Tasmanian Preservation Happenings

 
  sam6778 Locomotive Driver

Location: Rockingham, WA
Once the coal road embankment gets flattened and the west leg of the wye gets built out of the old coal road track, re-railing the FFC's and FFF will become more of a proposition.
12CSVT

Is the KKD wagon still stored off rail behind the station building alongside the mainline?
Cheers

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  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
Is the KKD wagon still stored off rail behind the station building alongside the mainline?
Cheers
"sam6778"


Yes.
  Floody Locomotive Driver

Not sure if this ought to be in the media thread or this one... Muckery article today suggests the latest light rail plan will terminate in Glenorchy and be standard gauge. I'm conjecturing if that happens TTMS will be literally, not just bureaucratically, landlocked.
  Z1NorthernProgress2110 Chief Commissioner

Location: Burnie, Tasmania
I still don't know why standard gauge. Who makes up that idea?
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
Not sure if this ought to be in the media thread or this one... Muckery article today suggests the latest light rail plan will terminate in Glenorchy and be standard gauge. I'm conjecturing if that happens TTMS will be literally, not just bureaucratically, landlocked.
"Floody"


Definitely the wrong thread. Try;

http://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11355714-0-asc-s100.htm (Tas media) or

http://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11369772-s25.htm (Light Rail Business case)
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
However, with regard to the above posts about the latest reports about the HNSR proposal and reference to standard gauge and staying 'on topic', any attempt to needlessly change gauge for the HNSR would be strongly resisted by the Tas. rail preservation groups, as it obviously kills access to Hobart for any future tourist  or mainline rail passenger access, as much as conversion to the ludicrously conceived Bus Rapid Transit concept.

All part of the grand plan by certain bureaucratic elements to undermine the HNSR proposal by making it as useless and impractical as possible, to ensure it gets canned once and for all.
  lkernan Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
I still don't know why standard gauge. Who makes up that idea?
Z1NorthernProgress2110

For one thing, it opens the door to more standard rollingstock designs already developed.  For example, Melbourne trams are standard gauge as well.

Having seen the newer low floor trams here, I don't know how a low floor tram could work with narrow gauge bogies.
There wouldn't seem to be enough room for a floor between the wheels.
  tasstockau Station Staff

Hi

the report is worth a read.

whilst it does talk about standard gauge for the reasons above it does acknowledge that there is a higher cost to track through standard gauge such that the actual overall difference could be a low as 1%. It also talks about the possibility of dual gauge. As such it goes on to presume standard gauge but makes the observation that a lot will depend on actual vehicle construction costs. It also makes the ridiculous observation that heritage stock could be fairly easily converted to standard gauge using volunteer labour but at least recognises that heritage stock could be a user of the line on occasions.

Overall, at least we have positive recommendation this time and an extension of the city terminus to Franklin Square. If it can move onto narrow gauge, a few more stops and extension to at least Austins Ferry it might be getting somewhere. I see none of this as unachievable, considering where the project has come from over the last couple of years. Credit to those that have pushed it this far. Government interest is still luke warm so the timing  of the report just before federal and state elections is somewhat encouraging.

Out of all this though, it should not be forgotten that without this proposal, the TTMS is land locked anyway as the without an operational line (cant see tasrail maintaining it in an accessible condition in the short term) the heritage train opportunities are limited and the resourcing required to take on the line (especially with the nearby crossings) is significant.


Phil L

Phil L
  i_know_nothing Train Controller

My reading indicates that most, if not all, current vehicle designs are capable of being built in any gauge with little effort. There are quite a few metre gauge tram systems in Europe and many Japanese systems are 3ft 6in. Talk of standard gauge is, I feel, a Furphy. Having said that, heavy rail and light rail mixed operation is difficult and probably not viable just for a few heritage shuttles. If the cruise ship market is taken into account, it becomes a whole different story. The tourist train market for cruise ship passengers is potentially a multi million dollar a year operation. But what are we talking about with light rail in Hobart? Are we talking ultra low floor "trams" with the idea of extensive street running in the future? Or are we talking more "conventional" lightweight railcars that fit the normal Tasmanian passenger dimensions of floor height and capable of some small amount of street running?
In my view, without access to Hobart port, rail tourism in southern Tasmania will struggle.
  tasstockau Station Staff

the report actually mentions heavy/heritage mixed operations with light rail as not being as difficult as raised in previous reports, so another small win in this regard, as with proper controls in place there is no reason they cannot run on the same track and even cited a European system where this was happening as a precdenet (limited Sunday operation by heritage trains has  been mentioned in the past). Also mentions the possibility of the track running through the railyards past the corner of the new cruise ship terminal thus preserving the port access aspect. Even for night time freight operations if they were required.

By the way, there is no reason that low floor trains or trams cannot run on narrow gauge. 18 months ago I travelled on a narrow gauge low floor articulated light weight EMU unit at Lucerne in Switzerland. Entry was via a low door (from a track level "platform" to an area in between the bogies with seating also in this area for those that cant handle stairs. one or two steps up led to further seating in the car ends and over the bogies. I dont know of any rules that says the whole floor has to be the same height.

Phil L
  Electric C Junior Train Controller

Location: The Shed - land of junk, smoke and wonder
The royal carriage (AAL +1) has been returned to don from Launceston rail workshops and ex EBR carriage DB 5 taken to Launceston workshops for restoration estimated at 4 years of work (mind you they said 7 for the royal it was done is 4 and a half)
  benscaro Chief Commissioner

For one thing, it opens the door to more standard rollingstock designs already developed.  For example, Melbourne trams are standard gauge as well.

Having seen the newer low floor trams here, I don't know how a low floor tram could work with narrow gauge bogies.
There wouldn't seem to be enough room for a floor between the wheels.
lkernan
melbourne has had trams on 5'3" too, in the past.

gauge is neither here nor there as a visit to numerous european cities with trams of metre gauge or similar would indicate.  

standard gauge has probably surfaced because of the innate australian tendency to come up with rail proposals that are as witless and unlikely as possible.
  Z1NorthernProgress2110 Chief Commissioner

Location: Burnie, Tasmania
Don River Railway have a Diesel Days weekend happening this weekend. 866 celebrating turning 50, hauling passenger trains with Y6, top and tailing. X4 did run i think a few mixed trains, failed with a mechanical/electrical gremlin.
Also on display is the fully restored, which is very well done and fantastic royal carriage AA+1.
  GeoffreyHansen Minister for Railways

Location: In a FAM sleeper
melbourne has had trams on 5'3" too, in the past.

gauge is neither here nor there as a visit to numerous european cities with trams of metre gauge or similar would indicate.  

standard gauge has probably surfaced because of the innate australian tendency to come up with rail proposals that are as witless and unlikely as possible.
"benscaro"


Hobart and Launceston had 3'6" trams in the past. Maybe we could even have heritage trams on the Light Rail (assuming you could get the gauge sorted).
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
Hobart and Launceston had 3'6" trams in the past. Maybe we could even have heritage trams on the Light Rail (assuming you could get the gauge sorted).
GeoffreyHansen
Not just a matter of gauge. Wheel profiles are different on tramways compared to railways. Hence any consideration of running heritage trams on the HNSR would require equipping with railway profile bogies.
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
Out of curiosity, the train Alco 866 was hauling - how was it braked (being 866 is air and the vehicles are vacuum)?

Actually just had a closer look at the photo - is that Y6 on the other end of the train doing the braking? If so, how did the crew on 866 get Y6 to brake the train?
  DRR_Fireman Deputy Commissioner

Location: -
Magic.
  Z1NorthernProgress2110 Chief Commissioner

Location: Burnie, Tasmania
He who knows has to keep the magic, secret.
  Electric C Junior Train Controller

Location: The Shed - land of junk, smoke and wonder
At DRR Launceston, DB5 has been lifted off its under frame and three things have been discovered. One that it appears that the body is two carriages joined together! Second it has been severely damaged, some time ago, at one end the under frame has has new sections welded in and the body new framing joined in on the body. Third and finally there was a sliding door in the opposite end of the carriage it dates form the time on the westcoaster as it was covered with tin when it entered use on the breakdown train. These have us all a little stumped! (especially the sliding end door!)
  DRR_Fireman Deputy Commissioner

Location: -
It was originally modified from a 'standard' TGR side loading carriage (can't currently locate my literature to tell me which class, someone else will know) by EBR into the composite carriage that it ran on the Westcoaster as. The underframe is very likely from another carriage modified to fit under it as the body was sat on the ground at Guildford as a camp/workshop for the gangs (though apparently really put there as a shooting lodge for the manager and his mates). The sliding door is probably some basic form of corridor connection, if you look at photos of ABL1 it has a similar sliding door setup on the ends. Looking at the photo on pg. 25 of the book "Railways & Tramways on the West Coast of Tasmania" by Peter Heerey and Richard Barrack you can make out chains and drop down plates between the carriages.
  Z1NorthernProgress2110 Chief Commissioner

Location: Burnie, Tasmania
DB5 was a BA but modified.
  BP4417 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Launceston, Tasmania
DB5 was a BA but modified.
Z1NorthernProgress2110
DB 5 was an ex TGR Carriage, either BA 24 or 25 sold to the Emu Bay Railway on the 16th November 1957. Tare 17 Tons, 15 Cwt.
  Electric C Junior Train Controller

Location: The Shed - land of junk, smoke and wonder
yeah its defiantly a modded side loader, the under frame looks original (it is the correct length of 46 feet) but it has been repaired not extended (cracks galore, woot) but i wonder who can answer us if it was 2 separate carriages! I'll post a picture of the joins after Saturday. do you think TGR would bother doing it?
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
All,



For those that haven't got the latest update from DVR as yet, the elevated coal road embankment that used to serve the old Royal Derwent Hospital's coal dump has gone.



Thanks to the assistance of the Derwent Valley Council, the fill from the embankment has been taken up to the New Norfolk tip, where it will be stockpiled for council works or tip management.



DVR's New Norfolk depot yard has now gained considerable new usable real estate and scope for significant new trackage through to the rear of the yard, including the completion of the rebuild of the New Norfolk wye.



The track had previously been removed and stockpiled. The ballast from the coal road has been retained, but will need cleaning before it can be reused. The actual concrete coal drop pit still stands, but will eventually be dismantled as well.



Photos of the new look DVR yard (still subject to grading and levelling) can be seen on the DVR Facebook site:  https://www.facebook.com/pages/Derwent-Valley-Railway-Tasmania/125404400859782



Cheers,

Steve Z

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