Mitty Assistant Commissioner

Location: Hawthorn
You can now use myki on Bus 684, from Southern Cross to Eildon.  It's a 3 hour 5 minute trip, and crosses 11 myki zones.  Anyone wanna give it a try? Smile

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  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
Had cause to travel between Leawarra, Tyabb and back today.  No way to pay the fare.  None of the Myki equipment on either platform was in service.  Conductor told me to "Pay at Frankston" which was unreasonable given that the train was heading away from there and would not return for almost two hours.  On the return I was again told to "Pay at Frankston" despite stating clearly I was not travelling that far.  Conductor walked away with a shrug of his shoulders both times.

Even if I had held a Myki card I would have had no way to scan it at either end of the trip.

Revenue collection fail.  Customer service fail.   Myki system fail.
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
Had cause to travel between Leawarra, Tyabb and back today.  No way to pay the fare.  None of the Myki equipment on either platform was in service.  Conductor told me to "Pay at Frankston" which was unreasonable given that the train was heading away from there and would not return for almost two hours.  On the return I was again told to "Pay at Frankston" despite stating clearly I was not travelling that far.  Conductor walked away with a shrug of his shoulders both times.

Even if I had held a Myki card I would have had no way to scan it at either end of the trip.

Revenue collection fail.  Customer service fail.   Myki system fail.
Gwiwer

Gwiwer 1, Myki 0 Laughing
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
You can now use myki on Bus 684, from Southern Cross to Eildon.  It's a 3 hour 5 minute trip, and crosses 11 myki zones.  Anyone wanna give it a try? Smile
Mitty

It can't competently do two zones and now it's expected to work out eleven?  I bet there will be a lot of over-charging before they get it right.
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
Gwiwer 1, Myki 0 Laughing
xxxxlbear

And in case anyone should suggest visiting a retail outlet here's the gen on that.  The nearest to Leawarra is Frankston Station.  The nearest to Tyabb is apparently a shop in Somerville.  Both an unreasonable distance away in my opinion and both requiring use of the train first in order to pay the fare .........

Which is about the same scenario as we had under Metcard when daily tickets were withdrawn from sale on trams.  You were expected to visit a retail outlet before travelling which in many cases was a tram ride away .........

And this is a major city in the 21st Century?  Even Revenue has suggested we have failed to learn from mistakes made with Metcard.  The questions now are "Why?" and "Who is paying for this lack of learning?"
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
And if it is any consolation, I have just realised that there is not ONE single Myki retail outlet on the entire Bellarine Peninsula.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
There was a mention in another thread about how a passenger going from (for example) Camberwell to Bendigo would only need to "touch on at Camberwell, change at Southern Cross and touch off at Bendigo".  This was going to "completely change the perceptions of some people in relation to V/Line and regional travel."

That's possibly true, but I'm curious about how it would work in practice.  Wouldn't this passenger have to touch off at SCS, to get out of the suburban platforms area, then touch on again at platform x before boarding the Bendigo train, and then finally touch off again at Bendigo on arrival?  Same in reverse going back to Camberwell?  

How would Myki charge for this, given that regional tickets are supposed to include suburban travel anyway?
  Mitty Assistant Commissioner

Location: Hawthorn
There was a mention in another thread about how a passenger going from (for example) Camberwell to Bendigo would only need to "touch on at Camberwell, change at Southern Cross and touch off at Bendigo".  This was going to "completely change the perceptions of some people in relation to V/Line and regional travel."

That's possibly true, but I'm curious about how it would work in practice.  Wouldn't this passenger have to touch off at SCS, to get out of the suburban platforms area, then touch on again at platform x before boarding the Bendigo train, and then finally touch off again at Bendigo on arrival?  Same in reverse going back to Camberwell?  

How would Myki charge for this, given that regional tickets are supposed to include suburban travel anyway?
Lad_Porter
Going from Camberwell to Southern Cross you would pay for the zone 1 portion of the trip, touching on at Camberwell and off at Southern Cross.  Then you touch on again at the Vline barriers and get on the vline train, and touch off again at Bendigo.  You would be charged only for a single trip from Melbourne to Bendigo.  I've already tried this down to Lara (which is actually in zone 2) and was not charged any extra, so it actually already works... they just aren't letting us use it yet.  Of course, trips to other destinations could be different, we won't know til they let us try.
  thadocta Chief Commissioner

Location: Katoomba
There was a mention in another thread about how a passenger going from (for example) Camberwell to Bendigo would only need to "touch on at Camberwell, change at Southern Cross and touch off at Bendigo".  This was going to "completely change the perceptions of some people in relation to V/Line and regional travel."

That's possibly true, but I'm curious about how it would work in practice.  Wouldn't this passenger have to touch off at SCS, to get out of the suburban platforms area, then touch on again at platform x before boarding the Bendigo train, and then finally touch off again at Bendigo on arrival?  Same in reverse going back to Camberwell?  

How would Myki charge for this, given that regional tickets are supposed to include suburban travel anyway?
Lad_Porter
The same way that it works now when it upgrades you from a zone 1 to a zone 1+2, or from a 2-hour to a daily.

When you touch off at SPencer St, it will place a 2-hour zone 1 on your myki. When you touch off at Bendigo, it will upgrade you to a Melbourne-Bendigo, and charge you the difference between that fare and the ticket that is already loaded onto the card.

Dave
  Mitty Assistant Commissioner

Location: Hawthorn
Well, finally.  Been waiting for this for a long time.

http://ptv.vic.gov.au/about-ptv/media-centre/media-releases/myki-to-start-on-v-line-commuter-services/
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Well, finally.  Been waiting for this for a long time.

http://ptv.vic.gov.au/about-ptv/media-centre/media-releases/myki-to-start-on-v-line-commuter-services/
Mitty
This is good news. It seemed stupid that you could use it in Melbourne and in certain regional centres, but not in between.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
It still won't be available on V-Line buses or services where reservations are required -
  Revenue Chief Commissioner

Well, finally.  Been waiting for this for a long time.

http://ptv.vic.gov.au/about-ptv/media-centre/media-releases/myki-to-start-on-v-line-commuter-services/
"Mitty"


Such good news!  Smile

- This is going to dramatically reduce the number of V/Line tickets sold at stations (remember, if you travel two or three days a week or only travel one way, you need line up to buy a ticket each time you travel). So we can expect to see dramatically shorter ticket queues all over the V/Line network. Lots of regular V/Line customers will switch to 7-Eleven, etc,. to top up.

- Fewer people going through ticket barriers at metro stations means that staff will have more time to check the tickets of people who haven't touched on. If the V/Line people can go in and out of the barriers like everyone else it will reduce pressure on staff at those stations and make fare evasion more obvious.

- More tourists and occasional users travelling to regional Victoria from Melbourne - more day trips, etc. Particuarly off peak - which is great.

- It will allow for more spontaneous V/Line travel - which should hopefully translate to higher patronage at off-peak times (eg. it avoids having to go near the ticket office - you can just turn up just before your train leaves, touch on and travel).  This is actually really important - as it effectively reduces travel time for passengers.

Lots of other benefits as well.

I'm sure there will be some transition issues - but the conductors provide a level of customer service that wasn't possible in the metro roll out so that's an advantage.
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
Such good news!  Smile

- This is going to dramatically reduce the number of V/Line tickets sold at stations (remember, if you travel two or three days a week or only travel one way, you need line up to buy a ticket each time you travel). So we can expect to see dramatically shorter ticket queues all over the V/Line network. Lots of regular V/Line customers will switch to 7-Eleven, etc,. to top up.

- Fewer people going through ticket barriers at metro stations means that staff will have more time to check the tickets of people who haven't touched on. If the V/Line people can go in and out of the barriers like everyone else it will reduce pressure on staff at those stations and make fare evasion more obvious.

- More tourists and occasional users travelling to regional Victoria from Melbourne - more day trips, etc. Particuarly off peak - which is great.

-
It will allow for more spontaneous V/Line travel - which should hopefully translate to higher patronage at off-peak times (eg. it avoids having to go near the ticket office - you can just turn up just before your train leaves, touch on and travel).  This is actually really important - as it effectively reduces travel time for passengers. Lots of other benefits as well.

I'm sure there will be some transition issues - but the conductors provide a level of customer service that wasn't possible in the metro roll out so that's an advantage.
Revenue

It is good news, finally!!
But I am not sure how the issues I highlighted in bold will change.
In fact, it may deter some people from travelling, the very irregular traveller and the tourist who may want to travel only perhaps once in their lifetime, when they realise that they will have to purchase a Myki card ($6 adult, $3 child/concession) even before paying for the travel itself.
....how can V/Line migrating to Myki be of any additional benefit to this small section of the travelling public? People still have to buy a Myki, even if the know they will use it only once or twice.
I am still adament that the cost of a Myki should a deposit rather than an outright purchase charge, and the deposit returned to the holder once they have finished with their Myki.

Great news for V/Line train users, but not so great for V/Line coach users who still have to wait for their services to 'go Myki'.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
The same way that it works now when it upgrades you from a zone 1 to a zone 1+2, or from a 2-hour to a daily.

When you touch off at SPencer St, it will place a 2-hour zone 1 on your myki. When you touch off at Bendigo, it will upgrade you to a Melbourne-Bendigo, and charge you the difference between that fare and the ticket that is already loaded onto the card.

Dave
thadocta
Thanks for the explanation - seems that Myki is not that dumb after all.

On the return trip, touch off at Spencer St would put the Bendigo-Melbourne charge on the card, and then touch off at Camberwell would add $0, because suburban travel is included in the V/Line fare.  Is that correct?
  melbtrip Chief Commissioner

Location: Annoying Orange
Thanks for the explanation - seems that Myki is not that dumb after all.

On the return trip, touch off at Spencer St would put the Bendigo-Melbourne charge on the card, and then touch off at Camberwell would add $0, because suburban travel is included in the V/Line fare.  Is that correct?
Lad_Porter
Myki is a single ticket system that works on the bases of the following:
  • Zones
  • Time


Under myki, there no such thing as a V/Line fare, it a MYKI fare.

Melbourne to Bendigo fare is zone 1 to 13 and if you travel from Melbourne to Bendigo and then on you myki you should have single fare that is good for minimum of 4 hours (at time of touch on) for zone 1 to 13.



If you wish, you can go from Bendigo via Melbourne to Traralgon at the cost of a Melbourne to Bendigo fare (zone 1 to 13)

If you wish, under myki you can travel from Melbourne to Bendigo and then back to  Bendigo on  a single fare

Key note: Customers who do not touch on and off correctly will be charged a peak fare.
For customers travelling off-peak, the peak fare contributes toward Daily caps, even though they are paying a reduced fare.
A example of this when a  customer travels three zones off-peak, 100% of the standard fare will be counted
towards their Daily cap even though the customer has only have to pay 70% of the standard fare.
  Revenue Chief Commissioner

Thanks for the explanation - seems that Myki is not that dumb after all.

On the return trip, touch off at Spencer St would put the Bendigo-Melbourne charge on the card, and then touch off at Camberwell would add $0, because suburban travel is included in the V/Line fare.  Is that correct?
"Lad_Porter"


Don't think of it as "suburban travel is included in the V/Line fare" - think of it as that you will be charged the right fare for travel in Zones 1-13.  There aren't V/Line fares any more - it's one integrated fare structure that doesn't depend on the operator of the service.  But yes, you are correct - because you've already paid the fare for that zone you won't be charged again...and here's the really good bit. If you travel from Bendigo to Melbourne you can continue to anywhere in Victoria covered by myki and you won't pay any more.  Yes, that's right - the fare from Bendigo to Melbourne is now the same as the fare from Bendigo to Moe. Not that it's a huge market. So V/Line is now the same as Metro (eg. a fare from Frankston to Werribee is the same as Frankston to the city,  a fare from Bendigo to Moe is the same as a fare from Bendigo to Melbourne).

It's more of an academic benefit I grant you.  Wink
  Revenue Chief Commissioner

It is good news, finally!!
But I am not sure how the issues I highlighted in bold will change.
In fact, it may deter some people from travelling, the very irregular traveller and the tourist who may want to travel only perhaps once in their lifetime, when they realise that they will have to purchase a Myki card ($6 adult, $3 child/concession) even before paying for the travel itself.
....how can V/Line migrating to Myki be of any additional benefit to this small section of the travelling public? People still have to buy a Myki, even if the know they will use it only once or twice.
I am still adament that the cost of a Myki should a deposit rather than an outright purchase charge, and the deposit returned to the holder once they have finished with their Myki.

Great news for V/Line train users, but not so great for V/Line coach users who still have to wait for their services to 'go Myki'.
"xxxxlbear"


If you are tourist visiting Melbourne, you are probably going to have a myki. It will be a rare tourist indeed who does not travel around Melbourne by public transport, and then decides to go to Ballarat.  So it makes it easier because the tourist can pay their fare pretty much anywhere. We need to get the point where the following occurs:

Conversation with Hotel Concierge:
"Hi, how do I travel to X in regional Victoria"
"You can go to any 7-Eleven and buy a myki card and top it up with $Y and then just touch on and off"
"But I already have a myki"
"Then just top it up before you travel"
"So I don't need a seat reservation or a ticket?"
"Nope, it's just like travelling on any train in Melbourne".
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
If you are tourist visiting Melbourne, you are probably going to have a myki. It will be a rare tourist indeed who does not travel around Melbourne by public transport, and then decides to go to Ballarat.  So it makes it easier because the tourist can pay their fare pretty much anywhere. We need to get the point where the following occurs:

Conversation with Hotel Concierge:
"Hi, how do I travel to X in regional Victoria"
"You can go to any 7-Eleven and buy a myki card and top it up with $Y and then just touch on and off"
"But I already have a myki"
"Then just top it up before you travel"
"So I don't need a seat reservation or a ticket?"
"Nope, it's just like travelling on any train in Melbourne".
Revenue
That all depends on where you are travelling to/from. For instance, if you wanted to travel from Melbourne to Daylesford, you'd still need a V/Line ticket.
  Revenue Chief Commissioner

That all depends on where you are travelling to/from. For instance, if you wanted to travel from Melbourne to Daylesford, you'd still need a V/Line ticket.
"railblogger"


Quite right. I have friends in Daylesford who are pretty annoyed that myki won't cover them.
  DalyWaters Chief Commissioner

Quite right. I have friends in Daylesford who are pretty annoyed that myki won't cover them.
Revenue
Eildon is okay but Daylesford isn't.

How does that work?
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
Conversation with Hotel Concierge:

"Hi, how do I travel to X in regional Victoria"

"You can go to any 7-Eleven and buy a myki card and top it up with $Y and then just touch on and off"

"But I already have a myki"

"Then just top it up before you travel"

"So I don't need a seat reservation or a ticket?"

"Nope, it's just like travelling on any train in Melbourne".

May I ask how many times you have been on either side of this conversation?

I don't doubt that it sometimes goes more or less as described but my experience from the coal-face (customer service positions which included dispensing ticketing advice) was rather different.  More a case of "How do I travel to X?" "Buy a ticket at the station / on the tram / bus"  Which of course in many circumstances was not the best option then and is impossible now.

Why do we believe that so many incoming tourists will already have Myki?  Or is it the assumption that they will (be forced to) obtain one upon arrival in order to travel at all?

The process is unnecessarily user-alien and the V/Line rollout does not permit users to actually obtain a Myki at rural stations unless additional kit is yet to be installed.  Yes you can top up but you cannot buy a Myki.  So how is one to pay for a journey if paper tickets are withdrawn and there is no sales outlet either open, within reasonable distance or in the town at all?  Tallarook (based on my knowledge) cannot be the only example but the nearest sales point would appear to be Seymour for which a train trip is first required .........

Or as I posted above I was just as unable to pay for a Leawarra - Tyabb - Leawarra journey recently though was quite willing to do so.

The system is simply not working as well as it needs to across the board.
  TedHanson Junior Train Controller

Man goes up to a hotel concierge. He says he has two questions but the concierge only needs to answer one. The man then says " First question, how do I travel to X in regional Victoria?" and "second question, can you explain Einstein's Theory of General Relativity? " Concierge says, " Well, the point about Relativity is that it all depends on the observer..."
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
The process is unnecessarily user-alien and the V/Line rollout does not permit users to actually obtain a Myki at rural stations unless additional kit is yet to be installed.  Yes you can top up but you cannot buy a Myki.  So how is one to pay for a journey if paper tickets are withdrawn and there is no sales outlet either open, within reasonable distance or in the town at all?  Tallarook (based on my knowledge) cannot be the only example but the nearest sales point would appear to be Seymour for which a train trip is first required .........
Gwiwer
Don't most stations have a myki machine?
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
A topper-upper only in some places.  Others have sales disabled.

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