A-City trains

 
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Justapax

My point was that units may have to be turned sometime in their service life.

There is a solution, the turntable in the Dry Creek MPC is dual gauge and accessible from the metro tracks.

Your crane solution would get the half buttock award except the each crane would have half a buttock making a full complement provided they are of the opposite hands. (Two left hand buttocks? Laughing)

There seems to be an almost irrational resistance to reinstatement of the Gaol Loop akin to its wrecking the whole system.
That ultimately every vehicle to and from the DCRCD for the southern lines has to turn-back through the ARS platforms when they could be bypassed without time lost for the turn-back is odd. The opportunity is there.
The cost of reinstating the loop is not out of this world.
Sure the system can manage without it but would have more flexibility with it.

I defy people to tell me RATIONALLY why the gaol loop should NEVER be reinstated.

Ian

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  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
I'm with you, Ian.

In past years direct Gawler - Showgrounds services have run; why preclude that happening again?

Do the train services all need to be Adelaide centred?   Is there a market for other trains from the north travelling to a southern destination, or the other way around?    

Has anyone ever questioned this?   The ticket system should have the data.
  hosk1956 Deputy Commissioner

Location: no where near gunzels
The Rosewater loop was used earlier this year to transfer cars between the Outer Harbor line and Dry Creek during the rebuild of the Adelaide yard.
kipioneer
No it wasn't, they re-instated a section of the gaol loop as a 'turn back', Outer harbour trains went into this then out onto the Gawler line and vice versa.

Wayne
  hosk1956 Deputy Commissioner

Location: no where near gunzels
Justapax

The letter may be for A end and B end just like they had cast brass plates on the Red Hens.

You suggestion of units being A, B & C has some merit.

Makes arranging delivery easier, As cab to rear of truck, Cs cab to front of truck.

All very well until a set or two have a collision or other misfortune. They could well finish up with a surplus of A's and two or more Cs out of service. Until the goal loop is reinstated there is no way of turning them. (somebody needs to take over from Heath) A turntable at Dry Creek would silence the Gaol Loop supporters (just).
Exciting day

Ian
steam4ian
There are no turning facilities at Dandenong, the truck backs up and takes and delivers 4001A, next trip it will be 4001B and then 4001C, not rocket science, not much chance of getting them mixed up is there! unless some Railpage psuedo engineers get involved!!
What is it with you fella's about turning railcars, I can't put my finger on a number but it has been many years since a railcar has been turned around, bogies are swapped out and wheels can be re profiled for wheel wear, it's called wheel management.
But I do have to agree with you about the gaol loop should be re instated for operational flexibility but DPTI are adamant that it will not be re instated.
And no, nobody has to take over for Heath, may he be long gone.

Wayne
  rail_road_runner Station Staff

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
I have questions again.

1. Why do the trains have to be turned around?
1a. Isn't rosewater a long way to go to rotate a train?

2. We have 1 piece, when does the next piece arrive?
2a Will it be a end or middle EMU?
2b. is there a schedule for these deliveries? (other than the final dead line).
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
I have questions again.

1. Why do the trains have to be turned around?
1a. Isn't rosewater a long way to go to rotate a train?

2. We have 1 piece, when does the next piece arrive?
2a Will it be a end or middle EMU?
2b. is there a schedule for these deliveries? (other than the final dead line).
"rail_road_runner"


1. because the left and right side wheels sometimes wear at different rates - as mentioned above it's just as easy to swap bogies. {Memory seems to think that the worst line for uneven wheel wear was the belair line so that won't bother the 4000's at all!}

1a. Yes
2. read back in this thread, delivery rate has been mentioned. {In a nut shell think about how long it will take the truck to return to Melbonk, load the next section and then return to Seaford}
2a. Middle {read back it HAS been mentioned}
2b. Yes {refer item 2.}

Back so quickly Heath?
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Wayne

The only reason for turning EMUs apart from wheel wear, which can be addressed by bogies swap, is accidental damage.

A level crossing collision comes to mind, severe vandalism and fire are other reasons why two or more A cars could be out simultaneously. Instead of being down two cars they are then down two (or more) sets. Turning cars may restore at least one set. That assumes couplings and jumpers can be managed.

I know they have surplus sets at present but let us hope the traffic grows to match the commitment shown by AM.

Must go and play trains!

Ian
  Tonsley213 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Everywhere except South Kensington
The first set should be here by the end of next week. Then cars will arrive at a rate of 1 per week. A complete train every 3 weeks.

This info is on the latest PDF from the DPTI, published yesterday.
  redhen424 Station Staff

Bring back the redhens.....they were real trains....not glorified trams!
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Nice ironic joke post! The Red Hens of course looked significantly more like trams than the new EMUs, they rode like trams too and they were noisier than any tram I've ever ridden in Adelaide as well.


All Seaford services will be electric so the hand outs say. I doubt there are enough DMUs to extend the NC service to Seaford and if they did it would be a "one buttock" solution.

They would not want to start Seaford services without the proposed intensive timetable which can only be worked by the EMUs.

As for 1 February, we will wait with eager but unheld breath. The present Gov't would want it running before the March elections but not the publicity if it stuffs up.
steam4ian
I disagree about putting off the opening any later than absolutely necessary. The three linked projects (Seaford line construction, electrification and the new EMUs) have all overrun their completion dates quite badly, leaving it closed any later than it needs to be is a free kick to the Libs for March.

An earlier opening before enough EMUs are available to run all Adelaide-Seaford trains need not be a problem, the goalposts just need to be shifted to aim for an easier opening service than a full Adelaide-Seaford/Tonsley timetable. Running a couple of EMUs as a free 'preview' shuttle service between Noarlunga and Seaford (i.e. going no further from home than the Lonsdale sidings in case something went wrong) would surely be a hugely popular move that would need only a couple of units to be in service each day.  Even between now and February there are plenty of 'milestone' dates that would allow for some kind of launch of even just a shuttle service (or shuttles plus selected 'premium' express peak trains) with a big fanfare, if the marketing office has enough imagination to make it work.

The long weekend and one week of the school holidays would be a perfect time to "relaunch" rail in Adelaide after the shutdowns hitting the south over the last few years. Such a launch could include the first public services on the EMUs on Noarlunga-Seaford shuttles (especially if Kevin calls the election later than Julia's 14/9 date) and a week of free or discounted fares across the whole rail system to win back commuters and sell rail as an attractive option to new users.

If September/October can't be met or a shuttle would not be palatable, then the next good milestone would be to do it alongside the launch of the other big DPTI project approaching completion around the same time - the official opening of Adelaide Oval for the Ashes Test Match in early December.

Late January would be a big opportunity, to launch the electric service with free train fares through the Tour Down Under week to promote the system, most importantly for the team presentation and city stages (including other Australia Day events in the city) and with a special bus transfer system to Willunga on the Saturday.

Plenty of good opportunities over the coming six months to make a big song and dance about it without being a blatantly obvious election campaign stunt.
  lustychant Chief Commissioner

Are the A and presumably C units identical, or are the three cars set up set up as one complete unit with the various items of equipment distributed independently over the three cars?

Sorry if this has been answered in previous links.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
No it wasn't, they re-instated a section of the gaol loop as a 'turn back', Outer harbour trains went into this then out onto the Gawler line and vice versa.

Wayne
hosk1956
My mistake - going back over the forum it seems the last regular use of the loop was around mid 2010 when there was no Gawler line between Dry Creek and Adelaide.

Night workings of railcar sets occurred.
  fabricator Chief Commissioner

Location: Gawler
There are no turning facilities at Dandenong, the truck backs up and takes and delivers 4001A, next trip it will be 4001B and then 4001C, not rocket science, not much chance of getting them mixed up is there! unless some Railpage psuedo engineers get involved!!
hosk1956
Given the truck backed into the Seaford depot to unload 4001A, simply driving the truck in forward and putting the ramp facing south would put 4001C facing the other way. No chance of upsetting the load distribution on the truck, especially as the drivers cab is usually the heavy end of the railcar.
  hosk1956 Deputy Commissioner

Location: no where near gunzels
Are the A and presumably C units identical, or are the three cars set up set up as one complete unit with the various items of equipment distributed independently over the three cars?

Sorry if this has been answered in previous links.
"lustychant"


The official designation for the cars will 4001DMA, 4001DMT, 4001DMB (yeah, I know that the first only has 4001A), the DMA and DMB cars are not interchangable, the DMA cars are the 'brains' of the set.
So I am sorry Ian, but in the event of a collision between trains, a DMA car will not be getting turned to run as a DMB to get a set running.
This set up is common practice, the Perth and Brisbane cars are set up the same way.

Wayne
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Wayne

That about clears it up.

Which car has the pantograph and HV equipment?

Ian
  Tonsley213 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Everywhere except South Kensington
As far as I'm aware the transformer is in the middle car.
  Tonsley213 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Everywhere except South Kensington
Sorry for the double post, but there is no edit button on the mobile site.

The Panto is on top of the T-Car.
  defman Station Master

No it wasn't, they re-instated a section of the gaol loop as a 'turn back', Outer harbour trains went into this then out onto the Gawler line and vice versa.

Wayne
hosk1956
I believe KIPioneer may have been mistaking the Gawler line shut down... between Adelaide and Mawson Lakes, when indeed trains WERE run via the Rosewater loop to get trains back to Adelaide depot for maintenance...
  nm39 Chief Commissioner

Location: By a road taking pictures
The official designation for the cars will 4001DMA, 4001DMT, 4001DMB (yeah, I know that the first only has 4001A), the DMA and DMB cars are not interchangable, the DMA cars are the 'brains' of the set.
So I am sorry Ian, but in the event of a collision between trains, a DMA car will not be getting turned to run as a DMB to get a set running.
This set up is common practice, the Perth and Brisbane cars are set up the same way.

Wayne
hosk1956
Ummmm........I was saying.........Smile

Also, "They" should have put a "U" in there to make it "DUMB".Smile
  trainznbuses Train Controller

Location: Seacliff Park, SA
Have just got a text saying that the next one has just passed through Coonalpyn in the last few minutes Razz
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
Have just got a text saying that the next one has just passed through Coonalpyn in the last few minutes Razz
"trainznbuses"


Going by the first delivery, they should be unloading tomorrow lunchtime-ish
  Mufreight Train Controller

Location: North Ipswich
Going by the first delivery, they should be unloading tomorrow lunchtime-ish
Pressman

They will improve with practice, the odds are that the third car of the set will make the journey cap trailing rather than muck about having to turn the car on arrival, I understand that they are being loaded via a ramp so they would on unloading be in the same sequence and direction as when they were loaded.
Time will tell
  nm39 Chief Commissioner

Location: By a road taking pictures
Is it possible that the middle unit will be linked straight onto the front in the yard for towing purposes? It would make sense but would probably need more than one poxbox to do the job.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Is it possible that the middle car will be linked straight onto the front in the yard for towing purposes? It would make sense but would probably need more than one poxbox to do the job.
nm39
I would be amazed if the permanent coupling between the first and second car could be done outside in the yard like that.

These are not old-style railcars that can be coupled and uncoupled at will; these are permanently coupled cars that, once coupled, operate as one unit. Many of the various systems involved are by no means duplicated on each of the three cars that make up one unit.

A road-rail vehicle of some kind (using rubber tyres for better traction) might be more suitable for getting the centre car into the commissioning shed in the absence of a 3000-compatible coupling on either end.
  Tonsley213 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Everywhere except South Kensington
Tailem Bend.

Don't need too much explanation.

Regards Michael




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