Is Eastern States Bias affecting the sales of some models

 
  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
what a interesting topic.

Shops/layouts and manufacturers all have problems with the distances to WA and SA.  I would factor that as one aspect that results in less aussie modeller in WA.
no layouts to see, no products to see - it adds up.  

WA models do not sell well but have been done. I know the WA L class will do resonablly well as it had a bit of exposure over in the Eastern states. me I'd take 4, two to represent the Comalco variants.

And as many people moan about missing out on the Vline N set in orange, or some 422 colours, and probally the AN in ghan colours, and trainorama's Vline S class and the GM in CR - many modellers  "missed out" on the loco of thier choice by waiting  for the product to come out, one often can miss out.  What I'm trying to say a aussie modeller has the choice to buy online, over the phone - from anywhere. And one can often do better by ordering either well before they come out, or as they come out. I recently bought a GM1 from trainorama. Didn't wait with a order but got one simply by a simple email and a call.  On the other hand the two r classes are taking years, but they are comming......

The WA modeller misses seeing lots of product, but can buy the same as anyone here. They  'miss out' on the exhibition specials, but another way is to befriend a eastern states modeller who can ring you and buy on your behalf..... there are ways.

Regards,
David Head

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  gw0071 Deputy Commissioner

Right on - the shops are either full of Hornby or above RRP 'native' product from domestic importers

Bogan hobbies tend to dominate in the west anyhow, ie - RC
  DQ2004 Chief Commissioner

Location: Hobart -where the rain has lumps in it
To answer the original question, re 'bias', as has been answered very well by others, yes of course it is.
If by bias one means wanting to make a model that will sell approx 2000 units within 2 years (at least).

You only need to look at the the populations of NSW, Victoria & QLD compared to WA to see why. And even QLD, which should be large enough for a reasonable RTR market not far short of Victoria's, has only in the last 12 months had such models released (although Wuiske & SRM appear to be trying to make up for lost time, with 7 different wagons released already).

If it seems that South Australia has had an unfairly large number of RTR models released compared to WA's nil, despite being a much smaller population, this is of course because many SA prototypes ran into Victoria (and a few into NSW).  And again this is why it will be a good bet for a producer to release a WAGR L class because they were (are) well-travelled.  But I would bet anything that when the L class is produced (as I'm sure it's only a matter of time, after all TrainOrama did announce it years ago), the WAGR colours will be the smallest part of the run.  It is very hard for a producer to have confidence in a non-existent market.

Queensland was a little different in that many many kits had already been produced by a number of people.  Wuiske for example knew how many potential customers that they had.  I'm sure that their RTR releases have generated new customers.  But even so they were still taking a risk.
In WA where there are very few local prototype modellers in HO scale and very few kits produced, it is a much bigger risk.

I'm sure that the L class will sell, and I'm sure that enough people will purchase a WBAX because they ran interstate.
Eventually the WA market may sputter to life.  It will be interesting to see how well the Southern Rail DFZ class does - unless someone is planning a surprise on us, it is likely to be the first RTR WA loco ever released, even though the prototype is a QLD import.

As for the other standard gauge locos, well that may well depend on the success of the L.

Kind regards,

Toby
  ALCO4401 Train Controller

Location: On the Branch waiting for a train order, west of Tarana
Being an expat (NSW man) living in WA for the past 14 years, the response from Eastern states traders has been next to nothing. Attendances at the yearly show in Perth would suggest that they are missing out on sales. Crowds between 10k and 25k (this was 2011) would clearly state that railways are popular.

I know of quite a few NSW and VR followers over here, as well as many other scales/ guages that also by "Australian Prototype" as a secondary persuit.

Yes, Pommie and US are strong, but the Australian following is quite high, as is the members on here from WA.
Sn3.5 is a niche group, only around 50 modellers with in the AMRA group of members, so is not a large following, maybe a couple of thousand of closet modellers.

The only regular East costers for the last six years have been Trainworld and Simply Glues. Anton did come over around 5 or more years ago, but now has a local agent here, so he doesn't come over.

Come on guys, please come over, your sales would be great. Just ask the Trainworld guys, they keep coming back every year, so there must be a reason why!!!!
East coast following will only get higher with a lot of people moving here chasing high paying jobs!
Just realised that the amount of Kiwis here maybe NZR will become the flavour to follow in the future. You can't get more east coast than that!
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Wow People just do not seem to get it,the only reason Train World travel all the way to Perth is guess what they sell UK and USA rolling stock and Locomotives.That is the reason it is worthwhile for them to spend up to 10 days by the time they drive there go to show for weekend the pack up and drive back to Melbourne.They have product that market wants,they dont model Australian or those that do are a tiny minority or they model S Gauge,ON30.
The absence of Austrains,Auscision and other Australian outline manufacturers is proof its not worth the effort,don't you think if they thought there was a dollar in it they would go.Its a pipe dream i do not  think you will ever see Austrains or Auscision ect at a show in Perth as there is no market for their product.Or what little there is wouldnt even buy the fuel to get there.
  sol Assistant Commissioner

Location: Evanston Gardens SA
Wow People just do not seem to get it,the only reason Train World travel all the way to Perth is guess what they sell UK and USA rolling stock and Locomotives.That is the reason it is worthwhile for them to spend up to 10 days by the time they drive there go to show for weekend the pack up and drive back to Melbourne.
2LaGrange
Trainworld make it worth the trip as on the way back from Perth, they stop for the large 3 day Adelaide Exhibition, the weekend after the Perth Show.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

That may well be a factor but the only reason they drive west past SA border is to sell pommy and yank outline models in perth.
  ALCO4401 Train Controller

Location: On the Branch waiting for a train order, west of Tarana
Wow People just do not seem to get it,the only reason Train World travel all the way to Perth is guess what they sell UK and USA rolling stock and Locomotives.That is the reason it is worthwhile for them to spend up to 10 days by the time they drive there go to show for weekend the pack up and drive back to Melbourne.They have product that market wants,they dont model Australian or those that do are a tiny minority or they model S Gauge,ON30.
The absence of Austrains,Auscision and other Australian outline manufacturers is proof its not worth the effort,don't you think if they thought there was a dollar in it they would go.Its a pipe dream i do not  think you will ever see Austrains or Auscision ect at a show in Perth as there is no market for their product.Or what little there is wouldnt even buy the fuel to get there.
2LaGrange
Well let me confirm that Aussie stuff does sell in Perth. Trainworld sold out off all their Aussie Stuff at the show this year. Yes they do sell pommie and US stuff, but I am sure they sold at least 10 times more aussie stuff, Auscision, Eureka and Powerline were flying off the shelves.
A pipe dream it may be, but clearly with the crowds attending Perth show each year, there is potential for sales. I know myself, contributed to 3.5K to the bottom line.
Yes the Trainworld guys stop back in Adelaide at their show before returning to Melbourne. Well if they can do it, why can't some of the others? Do two states in one trip!
  MatthewH Locomotive Driver

Yes all quiet on the SCT,as proof that the SA/WA market is very limited as far as Australian Manufacturers are concerned lets look at some of the locos produced.

Trainorama 930 class was a very slow seller.
GMs have sold better but I think much smaller run compared to 930s .Lesson learnt there and GMs have worked in NSW and VIC so more appeal and larger market for them GMs I would suggest.

Auscision EL class have only recently sold out in AN green -that's over 4 years to sell out.
AN class will go ok due to AN3 in Ghan livery being in high demand but I see no other livery or numbers are close to selling out according to their web site.

600 class no mention of them with future 45 class production.

Austrains DL class was a poor seller as was the CL/CLFs in AN Green.

As for ready to run wagons I think Trainorama produced ALGX when they did VLCX run,nothing else from Trainorama after that effort.

Auscision have done AHGX grain hoppers,AOOX open wagons and ABFX Louvered vans and if you look at their web site most packs are still available and these were produced over 12 months ago.They are also producing WBAX louvered vans later this year/early next year.

All this to me is evidence that the SA/WA market is small and I would hardly be blaming the Eastern States for any bias its simple economics you need to aim to sell enough product to recover your investment and possibly some profit.
Producers have targeted models that would have not only run in WA/SA but also NSW and VIC and they have still been slow sellers.

I think Auscision and others would be bitterly disappointed with the lack of sales or slow pace and will be unlikely to produce a great deal of product in WA/SA outline in the future.
(end quote, my iPhone is letting the quote tags work properly)

I believe the reason that it doesn't look like much SA outline is selling is that most of those are mainly AN stuff, which doesn't sell as well, the OER OB wagons are still available in AN green.

However, if you look at SAR stuff, you will see that they are very popular. The AHGX SAR wagons sold out very quickly, as have all the SAR OB/OBf/DWf wagons from OER, so much so that they have just rerun most of the SAR stuff they made.

My point is: SAR stuff does sell, AN stuff doesn't, which is why the DL/CL are still available.
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
Like people said: Certain things sell, like wagons and locomotives that were bogie exchanged.

WOAX wagons would sell well, same with the WBAX and L classes. Original livery would do well because 3 were based in Victoria for a while. Maybe the NA/NB's as well?
  Streamliner Junior Train Controller

Location: NSW South Coast
Auscision and Austrains etc don't travel over the western borders because they don't have anything to sell! Very Happy
Orient Express have got it right, if it's painted grey, it's almost like printing money.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
Auscision and Austrains etc don't travel over the western borders because they don't have anything to sell! Very Happy
Orient Express have got it right, if it's painted grey, it's almost like printing money.
SARking
They must have it right and actually be printing money as the SAR M vans are going to be done next so SAR and Victorian modellers will buy these vans. Yes the AN versions of anything here in South Australia do not seem to sell all that well. The Commonwealth Railways and South Australia Railways stuff though is another matter altogether, these are snapped up and usually sell out fast.

Remember that BGB have done these vans and the OB, OBF and DWf in the past but these were kits and not everyone could get a good model out of them, sure it makes us plonkers a bit but we have waited eon's here for RTR South Australian rolling stock.

The GM1 in AN colours I imagine in the end will be flogged off cheaper though as not many want it like that, but when they, if they bring it out in Commonwealth Railways livery don't get in the way at the counter unless you want to get squashed.
  AN 7166 Junior Train Controller

Location: WA
Auscision and Austrains etc don't travel over the western borders because they don't have anything to sell! Very Happy
Orient Express have got it right, if it's painted grey, it's almost like printing money.
SARking
I wouldn't necessarily agree with the first part, as Auscision released the Australian National EL, and soon to be released Australian National AN which both ran into WA.

You could also follow this up with their AOOX, and variants, and the ABFX; just to mention SA rolling stock.
What about the CL, CLF, CLP, DL, and upcoming BL locomotives from Austrains which also ran in to WA?

Orient Express as do the other manufacturers mentioned, need to be applauded for producing locomotives and rolling stock in the ANR, and Australian National livery, as there are modellers that like to model the AN system; or use their locomotives and rolling stock to compliment their own modelling preference.

I'm thankful that the forecast is not all grey.
  SAR523 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Chicago, IL
I'm less convinced that there's a Eastern States bias on the part of the manufacturers and more that there's simply an Eastern States bias in the market.

Populations of

SA: ~1.6M, of whom 1.2 live in Adelaide
WA: ~2.1M, of whom 1.7 live in Perth

Population of NSW + Vic + Qld: 17.3 M, of whom 8.6M live in Sydney and Melbourne alone.

More people live in just Melbourne alone that all of SA & WA combined.

And of course then there's the problem that the number of engines and rolling stock which traveled between the various states in the most frequently modeled period (steam/diesel transition) is vanishingly small (with somewhat of an exception for the VR and SAR).  

The CR is not analogous to the PRR or the UP or any of the post grouping big 4 in the UK and thus a manufacturer is looking at a state-based market for most of their products as most people model what they saw growing up.  Basically the NSGWR and the VR were the bigger systems and those states have the larger population base to support the market for models thereof.

As an expat crow eater this pains me like I'm sure it pains those in WA and northern Qld but in Australia we're talking about a niche in a niche.  Even the "big" players in the US like Athearn, Bachman and Walthers are pretty small companies when you look at them.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Spot on virtually non existant market in WA and a tiny one in SA when compared to NSW and VIC.
An example of how thing sell would be Auscisions SA/WA wagons.The only packs of AHGX hoppers that have sold out are the original version which ran into NSW and VIC and therefore appealled to NSW/VIC modellers.ABFX/AOOX in CR/ANR liveries have not sold out and i beleive they are only doing a small run when they do WBAX van due to not many pre orders,all these wagons have not only run in WA and SA but also NSW and VIC yet still have not sold out even with a potential market of four states.This tells me its a very small market even with NSW/VIC appeal WA/SA rolling stock doesnt sell.Another example if this imaginary market exists why has Eureka not done a WA/SA steam loco,why hasnt Auscision included 600s in their 45 run,why hasnt powerline or trainorama produced 830 class with their 48s,why has no one yet produced the L class diesel .... The list goes on and the answer is because its a big financial risk,with plenty of examples of poor support for previous models in SA/WA models.The market is not there to support a production run of about 2000 units.Ask the manufacturers yourself i have and they will tell you most of their sales are on the east coast and thats what they concentrate on because thats the most viable market in Australia.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Spot on virtually non existant market in WA and a tiny one in SA when compared to NSW and VIC.
An example of how thing sell would be Auscisions SA/WA wagons.The only packs of AHGX hoppers that have sold out are the original version which ran into NSW and VIC and therefore appealled to NSW/VIC modellers.ABFX/AOOX in CR/ANR liveries have not sold out and i beleive they are only doing a small run when they do WBAX van due to not many pre orders,all these wagons have not only run in WA and SA but also NSW and VIC yet still have not sold out even with a potential market of four states.This tells me its a very small market even with NSW/VIC appeal WA/SA rolling stock doesnt sell.Another example if this imaginary market exists why has Eureka not done a WA/SA steam loco,why hasnt Auscision included 600s in their 45 run,why hasnt powerline or trainorama produced 830 class with their 48s,why has no one yet produced the L class diesel .... The list goes on and the answer is because its a big financial risk,with plenty of examples of poor support for previous models in SA/WA models.The market is not there to support a production run of about 2000 units.Ask the manufacturers yourself i have and they will tell you most of their sales are on the east coast and thats what they concentrate on because thats the most viable market in Australia.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Spot on virtually non existant market in WA and a tiny one in SA when compared to NSW and VIC.
An example of how thing sell would be Auscisions SA/WA wagons.The only packs of AHGX hoppers that have sold out are the original version which ran into NSW and VIC and therefore appealled to NSW/VIC modellers.ABFX/AOOX in CR/ANR liveries have not sold out and i beleive they are only doing a small run when they do WBAX van due to not many pre orders,all these wagons have not only run in WA and SA but also NSW and VIC yet still have not sold out even with a potential market of four states.This tells me its a very small market even with NSW/VIC appeal WA/SA rolling stock doesnt sell.Another example if this imaginary market exists why has Eureka not done a WA/SA steam loco,why hasnt Auscision included 600s in their 45 run,why hasnt powerline or trainorama produced 830 class with their 48s,why has no one yet produced the L class diesel .... The list goes on and the answer is because its a big financial risk,with plenty of examples of poor support for previous models in SA/WA models.The market is not there to support a production run of about 2000 units.Ask the manufacturers yourself i have and they will tell you most of their sales are on the east coast and thats what they concentrate on because thats the most viable market in Australia.
  fabricator Chief Commissioner

Location: Gawler
The real issue is the manufacturing process itself, having to make a set of dies, put them into a moulding machine, assemble the model, run the parts through another machine to apply paint. Then assemble it again with the glass, PCB, lights, railing etc. Pack the whole lot into a box with custom foam packaging.

The costs come not just from the massive cost of making the dies, but also tooling up the factory to make all the other stuff. Even making the entire thing in china does little to solve the minimum batch size to make it worthwhile.

I'm sure if some magic 3d printer existed that not only printed the model, but also applied paint and made up the polystyrene packing, certain companies could make a killing. Would also help with customer good will as the chinese do like to fiddle with designs that worked well before, and break something in the process (round peg in square hole anyone).
  tabmow68 Station Master

Location: Brisbane
It always amazes me to hear, and in this case read about, people saying oh this manufacturer is not fulfilling my need or something of that kind.  If you don't like what THEY are doing with THEIR business, then do something about it yourself and start your own, as the kids movie Robots states "see a need, fill a need".  That was how most of these guys got going initially.  About now a lot of those people will be saying "but I don't have the capital to do that", well maybe they didn't either when they got started but they had enough desire and drive to make it work at huge risk.  If you can't do anything about it, or choose not to, then stop complaining and accept what is on offer, it is their business afterall.

I model QR on 12mm track, up until recently there wasn't much available and still there is very little RTR.  However, I took that as being what it was unless I was prepared to fix it myself and learnt/taught myself how to build kits, kit bash and even plain scratchbuild, just like the majority of Aussie modellers of 10 years or more ago.  I now help one manufacturer in getting RTR QR onto the market as something I can do to fill the need.

Like the story of the dog lying on the deck on a protruding nail and howling, it doesn't hurt enough to move but enough to howl about.  So either stop howling or get up and move.

Bazza
  SAR523 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Chicago, IL
"... why hasnt Auscision included 600s in their 45 run,why hasnt powerline or trainorama produced 830 class with their 48s"
2LaGrange

The Auscision decision is a bit of a disappointment and the general point stands but Powerline did product an AN 830 and I'm hoping you're not breaking the news that Traino has cancelled their 830s as I have two fully paid for.  That may arrive sometime Smile
  SAR523 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Chicago, IL
It always amazes me to hear, and in this case read about, people saying oh this manufacturer is not fulfilling my need or something of that kind.  If you don't like what THEY are doing with THEIR business, then do something about it yourself and start your own, as the kids movie Robots states "see a need, fill a need".  That was how most of these guys got going initially.  About now a lot of those people will be saying "but I don't have the capital to do that", well maybe they didn't either when they got started but they had enough desire and drive to make it work at huge risk.  If you can't do anything about it, or choose not to, then stop complaining and accept what is on offer, it is their business afterall.
tabmow68

3D printing is going to change this calculus very soon.  There was an article in Model Railroad Craftsman this year where some guy spun some very esoteric late 1800s (IIRC) passenger cars with a roof that had very elaborate compound curves and they looked very good.  

Otherwise spot on.  As an SAR modeler I've got to say I'm pretty happy with the RTR and kits available to me.  In the last few years I've been able to build an 800DE,  Fs, RXs, a resin 720 kit, various 700s whitemetal kits, 750s (with a brass one coming out) and 500s, 520s and surely 620s are in the pipeline.  And RTR there have been 500, 830, 700 and 930 DEs as well.

And while the BGB kits are a bit older today and their availability is spotty they were there for a long time, I have 850s and all sorts of other rolling stocks still sitting in the basement; SEM are still making some items that work and now we have OE reproductions.


The WA guys aren't nearly as well off but if you believe there's a market it's not actually that difficult to do a limited run resin rolling stock kit in the garage to get started.  And I'd have to believe that there's a market for HO/HOnX W / Wxs, perhaps based on a D&RG K-36 (assuming you can accept HOn3 for 3'6")

The other idea might be to organize a "Modelling the Railways of Western Australia" convention.  Apologies if there is one (I'm not finding one with a 2 second google); the SA one is now in it's 17th (?) year and there is a bi-annual one in QLD.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
What many in South Australia must remember though if not for the Eastern state bias there would be almost no local RTR models for South Australia. It took quite a few years to get any manufacturer from the Eastern states to even look at a SAR or CR model now they are everyday events almost. Many of us here in South Australia took NSW Alco diesels and made SAR versions from them Comrail modellers probably did the same as well it was more limiting for these modellers though. I have several locomotives diesel that were bought as NSW diesels and altered to SAR types. Two brass 830's, one 700 class diesel even a couple of NSWGR steam locomotives that have been bashed into RX an F type steam locomotives. Sure they are not dead scale models now, but that was all we could get back then. It was that or nothing.

So really if any manufacturer does not make exactly what you want, then don't fret at some time in the future when they have made just about all there is to make they might actually make them.
  Geekboy Train Controller

Location: Banned
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  1213Driver Chief Commissioner

Location: Perth Western Australia
The typical Eastern States Bias is shown in the comments posted.

What a load of codswallop! There are plenty of Aussie modelers over here in WA. that buy that which is served up by producers that only make the eastern states prototypes. They buy it because if they want to model Australian they have little other choice.

I am aware of Modelers who have huge layouts of the stuff and purchase multiple items on release. Ever heard of the layout "Arid Australia" ???? - one of the biggest layouts around and a Guiness World record holder for the longest model trains run on it - You cant tell me they have not bought an item or two that hasn't propped up the eastern states RTR market.

Show me a traditional RTR Western Australian model! If there had been one then I would have it.

The stuff that crosses the border into WA does not constitute being acceptable as the WA market. When a "L" class does hit the shelves over here it wont last long and it would be folly of the producers to limit their run of liveries to only one.

Why is there supposedly no worthwile market in WA - Its because nothing in the form of a true Western Australian model has been made that remotely reflects the railways of WA.
You dont grow up in NSW and want to buy a model of a WAGR "D" or "V" class now do you! So why would we want to buy a 36 or a 44. Again we only buy it because we have to if we want out of the box Australian.

Perhaps the producers of Australian models should pick a prominent WA locomotive and give it a try - Cause lets face it, if you dont have a worthwhile WA locomotive then not much point making wagons to sell now is there - though it would seem that, that is what has happened with a few dressed up Eastern States wagons on the market, which given comments here, seems to be getting used for evaluating the whole basis for the value of the WA market interest - Not a true reflection of the market at all.

But lets talk real Western Australian prototypes suitable for RTR - Not the standard gauge stuff, but the Narrow Gauge.
If you were going to represent true WA railways in the same sense of the NSWGR then one of the most ubiquitous Australian Mainline Locomotives was the WAGR "X" class diesel.
This locomotive over any of others was used for "EVERYTHING" from 1954 till late 1980's so if you were ever going to make a WA model to sell that covered the steam, diesel and standardisation eras then it should be an "X" in whatever scale.  I can tell you that the number of people who would buy these in WA would be huge! Numerous liveries would sell even more.
But of course this limits the market to WA only now doesn't it because the X didn't run anywhere else and you lot over there wouldn't want one just like some of us dont want your locos. So hence why the "L" class has been chosen for holding the WA flag and only because it ran in the east for a while. Unfortunately it is standard gauge and certainly not the most favourite locomotive for true West Aussie rail fans.

Given that the apparent requirement for making a model is that it must have run in other States the only other "REAL" WA locomotive suitable is the "W" class which was used by the Silverton Tramway and later Pichi Richi. It seems that the SA modelers are in a similar sort of boat to us WA modelers so fat chance of that happening either.

Oh well all pipe dream stuff - None of the RTR producers have the balls to have a go at a real WA prototype as in the true narrow gauge - Cant see it happening so wont be holding my breath.

The True value of the WA market is yet to be realized! Yes there is a group of S scale modelers here in WA but essentially they are the people who actually do some real modeling by scratch building the local prototype because you cant buy it. There is thousands more who would love to buy it out of a box because they cant or wont have a go at building it.

Does the Eastern States Bias affect the sales of some models ? Yes of course it does.

The only RTR models I have is a set of Silvers (IP cars) which I have had since I was a Kid and 1 Ghan loco which I bought to go with the silvers as I had seen it over here on them (the 44 that came with the silvers got scrapped). Perhaps I will buy an L class to replace my Athern painted version when it happens.
Other than that, I have not bought any other Eastern States crap and wont be in the future. Im More than happy to build for myself the trains I saw and grew up with.

Ask the question again when the market place has a true reflection of Australian railways from Tas to Qld, SA, WA and perhaps even NT.
  kingfisher Chief Train Controller

The typical Eastern States Bias is shown in the comments posted.

What a load of codswallop! There are plenty of Aussie modelers over here in WA. that buy that which is served up by producers that only make the eastern states prototypes. They buy it because if they want to model Australian they have little other choice.

I am aware of Modelers who have huge layouts of the stuff and purchase multiple items on release. Ever heard of the layout "Arid Australia" ???? - one of the biggest layouts around and a Guiness World record holder for the longest model trains run on it - You cant tell me they have not bought an item or two that hasn't propped up the eastern states RTR market.

Show me a traditional RTR Western Australian model! If there had been one then I would have it.

The stuff that crosses the border into WA does not constitute being acceptable as the WA market. When a "L" class does hit the shelves over here it wont last long and it would be folly of the producers to limit their run of liveries to only one.

Why is there supposedly no worthwile market in WA - Its because nothing in the form of a true Western Australian model has been made that remotely reflects the railways of WA.
You dont grow up in NSW and want to buy a model of a WAGR "D" or "V" class now do you! So why would we want to buy a 36 or a 44. Again we only buy it because we have to if we want out of the box Australian.

Perhaps the producers of Australian models should pick a prominent WA locomotive and give it a try - Cause lets face it, if you dont have a worthwhile WA locomotive then not much point making wagons to sell now is there - though it would seem that, that is what has happened with a few dressed up Eastern States wagons on the market, which given comments here, seems to be getting used for evaluating the whole basis for the value of the WA market interest - Not a true reflection of the market at all.

But lets talk real Western Australian prototypes suitable for RTR - Not the standard gauge stuff, but the Narrow Gauge.
If you were going to represent true WA railways in the same sense of the NSWGR then one of the most ubiquitous Australian Mainline Locomotives was the WAGR "X" class diesel.
This locomotive over any of others was used for "EVERYTHING" from 1954 till late 1980's so if you were ever going to make a WA model to sell that covered the steam, diesel and standardisation eras then it should be an "X" in whatever scale.  I can tell you that the number of people who would buy these in WA would be huge! Numerous liveries would sell even more.
But of course this limits the market to WA only now doesn't it because the X didn't run anywhere else and you lot over there wouldn't want one just like some of us dont want your locos. So hence why the "L" class has been chosen for holding the WA flag and only because it ran in the east for a while. Unfortunately it is standard gauge and certainly not the most favourite locomotive for true West Aussie rail fans.

Given that the apparent requirement for making a model is that it must have run in other States the only other "REAL" WA locomotive suitable is the "W" class which was used by the Silverton Tramway and later Pichi Richi. It seems that the SA modelers are in a similar sort of boat to us WA modelers so fat chance of that happening either.

Oh well all pipe dream stuff - None of the RTR producers have the balls to have a go at a real WA prototype as in the true narrow gauge - Cant see it happening so wont be holding my breath.

The True value of the WA market is yet to be realized! Yes there is a group of S scale modelers here in WA but essentially they are the people who actually do some real modeling by scratch building the local prototype because you cant buy it. There is thousands more who would love to buy it out of a box because they cant or wont have a go at building it.

Does the Eastern States Bias affect the sales of some models ? Yes of course it does.

The only RTR models I have is a set of Silvers (IP cars) which I have had since I was a Kid and 1 Ghan loco which I bought to go with the silvers as I had seen it over here on them (the 44 that came with the silvers got scrapped). Perhaps I will buy an L class to replace my Athern painted version when it happens.
Other than that, I have not bought any other Eastern States crap and wont be in the future. Im More than happy to build for myself the trains I saw and grew up with.

Ask the question again when the market place has a true reflection of Australian railways from Tas to Qld, SA, WA and perhaps even NT.
1213Driver

Put your money where your mouth is and fund the production of an L Class loco in China and see how much success you have.

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