Typical stupid Greenies under the beds blaming TA and the liberals for this debacle; always blame the opposition regardless - very disingenuous and dangerous people that should never be trusted.

The Australian Government should now withdraw all aid, close the embassy and stand up to this disgraceful country and call this for what it is.  The Indonesians are deliberately aiding the people smugglers so they can over burden Australia socially and financially.

Rudd was much better at these sorts of things.  

Yes, he has a lot to answer for doesn't he not!  That's a bit of an oxymoron statement don.

Maybe we should ask him back from his retirement to sort this mess out; after all, he did cause it.

He is nothing but a pansy, crying as he announced his leaving parliament; for god's sake!

I'd believe a school teacher or university lecturer LONG before I believed the Murdoch drivel. Are you telling me you'd do otherwise? I should hope not but I fear it may be so.

Well that's not very intelligent is it!  You don't sound like a very grounded and critical thinking person; more like a rabid leftie green commie - greens under the beds.

Still, I do rather analyse information beofre sprouting off about it.  

I don't think sooooooo.

Look at how Abbott has handled the phone hacking saga that we're having trouble with Indonesia for at the moment. And yes, I know it was started in 2009. Under Labor.  

Well, Tony Abbott is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't, so I don't really think it matters what he does at the moment, because the Indos are brewing for a fight.  The worst thing we as a country could do is apologise to a bunch of bullies; that is just showing them that we are weak.  

At the end of the day, I bet the Indos are spying on us and other countries; bloody hypocrites!

Good 'ol ABC. Gleefully breaks the story about phone hacking allegations, based on stolen documents five months after they were made available (curious timing with the news only breaking now?). Has Snowden found asylum anywhere yet, or is he still holed up in Russia?

ABC have quickly fallen in behind Fairfax with the usual Abbott-bashing despite the activities occurring for goodness-knows-how-long. And now the ABC is wetting itself with fury that details of (tax-payer funded) staff payments are made public, after fighting an FOI request since 2010. They say that the information should be kept private.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/opinion/adversaries-emboldened-by-snowden/story-e6frgd0x-1226763763099

That last post of 2301, in answer to Greensleeves, is so stupid it defies answering. Every comment is mindless and devoid of any logic whatsoever.

You don't sound like a very grounded and critical thinking person;

Ho Ho Ho; coming from 2301, that is priceless.

because the Indos are brewing for a fight.

Why would they want a fight?  How do you know? Where will the fight be held?

I bet the Indos are spying on us and other countries; bloody hypocrites!

All countries have and do spy since time immemorial. Australia got caught red-handed, and it was the President, his wife, and others who had their phones hacked; that's why the brown stuff has hit the air circulating device.

Maybe we should ask him  (Rudd) back from his retirement to sort this mess out; after all, he did cause it.

Nonsense.  See my earlier post. We have been spying on Indonesia for decades.


Then there's his answer to don_dunstan . . .

That's a bit of an oxymoron statement don.

2301, do you know what an oxymoron actually is? (Why did I bother asking?) An oxymoron is a figure of speech with a pointed conjunction of seemingly contradictory expressions. For example, "...kept him falsely true"  or "faithfully unfaithful".(Some would say "military intelligence" and "McDonald's coffee" are also examples.) There is no oxymoron in what don_dunstan wrote.

And, to use 2301's favourite, "At the end of the day", there is little or no sense in what he has written, but that's not new, is it?

Abbott, don't apologise, to their confected outrage. Instead, cancel the $646.8 million cheque budgeted for Indonesia next financial year, and put a stop to whatever has not been cashed from the $541.6 million we sent them last financial year. Sorted! Causing them to make up the money from their meagre AUD 62.8 Billion GNP will make them take notice. If (hopefully) they don't like it, tell SBY to pull the funds from General Abdullah Mahmud Hendropriyono...

Well, we are being passively invaded by Indonesia but a lot of stupid Australians don't realise it yet; they're not sending boatloads of fit young middle eastern men to us for no reason.  

I find the Indonesian reasoning a bit strange to say the least; Indonesian boats crewed by Indonesians in Indonesian waters (mind you some only 70metres from shoreline) and the Indo's are saying it's got nothing to do with us guys - it's not our problem.  It's kind of like one neighbour saying to another neighbour after his silky oak tree has fallen onto his neighbour's roof "it's not my problem anymore mate."

Abbott, don't apologise, to their confected outrage. Instead, cancel the $646.8 million cheque budgeted for Indonesia next financial year, and put a stop to whatever has not been cashed from the $541.6 million we sent them last financial year. Sorted! Causing them to make up the money from their meagre AUD 62.8 Billion GNP will make them take notice. If (hopefully) they don't like it, tell SBY to pull the funds from General Abdullah Mahmud Hendropriyono...

Couldn't agree more; when old bang bang misses his lazy $646 million from the Australian taxpayer he and his cronies might start lamenting.  They would have to be one of the most corrupt and contemptuous nations on this planet; but what would you expect from a nation that slaughters animals the way they do.

I also agree with Aaron. Don't apologise; there's no point. Everyone's spying, and an apology by anyone would just be diplomatic bovine excreta. I also find the amount of aid we give Indonesia to be somewhat strange. Indonesia needs us more than we need Indonesia.

Well, we are being passively invaded by Indonesia but a lot of stupid Australians don't realise it yet; they're not sending boatloads of fit young middle eastern men to us for no reason.  

Do you honestly not see why people think you're delusional?

I also agree with Aaron. Don't apologise; there's no point.

Yeah, look, the two of you do have a valid point - but it ain't called 'diplomacy' for no reason.

Abbott needs to give the Indonesian leadership an opportunity to save face - they've been embarrassed in front of their own people. Anyway, haven't you ever said sorry and not meant it?  That's all he has to do in this situation; instead he's misinterpreted diplomacy as weakness.

Abbott, don't apologise, to their confected outrage. Instead, cancel the $646.8 million cheque budgeted for Indonesia next financial year, and put a stop to whatever has not been cashed from the $541.6 million we sent them last financial year. Sorted! Causing them to make up the money from their meagre AUD 62.8 Billion GNP will make them take notice. If (hopefully) they don't like it, tell SBY to pull the funds from General Abdullah Mahmud Hendropriyono...

Yeah, screw them. Two years ago Indonesia was caught spying on the Australian embassy, now they throw a hissy over the same issue. They are always ready to burn effigies of our leaders, then two minutes later, after some natural disaster, stick their hand out for aid.

We are always being chided for not making friends with Indonesia, but they have no idea what a friend is. Who else in the region can be bothered with them? Answer, no one.

And Don, why is it that we always have to give these potty-politicians the ability to save face, they never accord us that privilege.

I said something similar to my earlier post to a greenie earlier today. His response 'Oh, Indonesia has a large army, we shouldn't seek to insult them and inflame the situation.' My response to that: 'A large army? And how are they going to get it here? If they had troop carrying vessels what's functional of our subs would have them artificially reefed before they've left the Indonesian exclusive economic zone.'

'But what if they do get here?' Said the greenie. 'Simple, a troop of SASR standing on the beach, holding a banner saying 'Remember Timor?' ' That'll get em.

I am just about over these gits throwing their insignificant weight around.

Indonesia are crying "Crocodile Tears" over nothing really, I would stare them down, and not bat an eyelid

Kind Regards

I suspect that you are way off the mark. Judging by many observations over a long time, I believe that we have been spying on Indonesia since at least the days of Fraser and Whitlam. Obviously, it hasn't always been phone hacking, but it has been happening by other methods. I'll try and find a reference; I think it's in a book by Mungo McCallum; Whitlam was put on the spot by journalists about spying and fudged his answer.  Fraser did the same a couple of years later. It certainly isn't new, but Abbott is stiff to have inherited the mess.

Wouldn't surprise me, I was going off a quick article the Age ran on the issue today, which I probably mis-read anyway.

Well that's not very intelligent is it! Â You don't sound like a very grounded and critical thinking person; more like a rabid leftie green commie - greens under the beds.

Oh dear. I suppose you'll happily give up everything that has been researched by university officials, graduates and lecturers then? Better get rid of your PC too, Bill Gates (Windows) attended university, as did Steve Jobs (Apple), Ken Thompson and Co. (Linux) etc. etc.

I don't think sooooooo.

As compared to whom?

Well, Tony Abbott is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't, so I don't really think it matters what he does at the moment, because the Indos are brewing for a fight. The worst thing we as a country could do is apologise to a bunch of bullies; that is just showing them that we are weak. At the end of the day, I bet the Indos are spying on us and other countries; bloody hypocrites!

On that, you and I agree although his initial response could have been a little bit more tempered. He drew the short straw on this one.

And Don, why is it that we always have to give these potty-politicians the ability to save face, they never accord us that privilege.

Yeah but they're trying to get them to cooperate on the boats issue; not being more contrite might be honest but it's not helping Tony's cause.

EDIT: Just as I was typing that, they announced they didn't want to play ball on the boats any more.

Oh 2301...? I have something for you...

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/comment/blogs/blunt-instrument/arming-the-taliban-whatever-floats-your-gunboat-20131118-2xq4a.html

Yeah but they're trying to get them to cooperate on the boats issue; not being more contrite might be honest but it's not helping Tony's cause.

EDIT: Just as I was typing that, they announced they didn't want to play ball on the boats any more.

Tear up that cheque for $600+ mil! Tell them we'll write them another cheque for $2 mil for every boat they detain in their own waters. Suddenly Indonesia's navy will be deployed to the south of Java, not off the coast of Malaysia like it is now...

Oh 2301...? I have something for you...

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/comment/blogs/blunt-instrument/arming-the-taliban-whatever-floats-your-gunboat-20131118-2xq4a.html

So now you're resorting to artificial stories are you? Wow.

So now you're resorting to artificial stories are you? Wow.

It was actually to see if 2301 would take the bait, and run with it. I thought that seeing as you are relatively intellegent, you would have picked up on that and let it fly. We'll never know now, thanks to you. For somebody who thinks they're so smart, you're pretty dumb sometimes. Thanks again.

The 7.30 report had an interesting story about the Afghani refugees which should ring alarm bells for everyone; a lot of the young men in particular are falling fowl of the law and resorting to joining gangs.  It was quite compelling.

I said something similar to my earlier post to a greenie earlier today. His response 'Oh, Indonesia has a large army, we shouldn't seek to insult them and inflame the situation.' My response to that: 'A large army? And how are they going to get it here? If they had troop carrying vessels what's functional of our subs would have them artificially reefed before they've left the Indonesian exclusive economic zone.'

'But what if they do get here?' Said the greenie. 'Simple, a troop of SASR standing on the beach, holding a banner saying 'Remember Timor?' ' That'll get em.

I am just about over these gits throwing their insignificant weight around.

Aaron, this is one of the reasons why the Indonesians are so keen for the boatloads of young men to keep arriving; once they set up their caliphates it will become like the enemy from within.  One only has to look at what is happening in western Sydney to witness the rot that is setting in.  A lot of middle eastern people by very nature can't help themselves; just look at the middle east to see how a lot of these people operate; it is a hot bed of violence - they have to take over, control and destroy anyone that does not conform to their ways.

The 7.30 report had an interesting story about the Afghani refugees which should ring alarm bells for everyone; a lot of the young men in particular are falling fowl of the law and resorting to joining gangs.  It was quite compelling.

Why are you watching that program? It caters to the Inner City nanny state types and their fellow travelers. Bunch of welfare chiselers in ivory towers if you ask me.

a lot of the young men in particular are falling fowl of the law and resorting to joining gangs.  It was quite compelling.

Arr - those fowls; they're foul things.

Senior Liberal Party pollster/advisor Mark Textor has added petrol to the fire by comparing the Indonesian Foreign Minister to a 1970's Filipino p*rn star.  Apparently it made big news in Indonesia.

More evidence that reactionary people should not have Twitter accounts.

More evidence that reactionary people should not have Twitter accounts.

Couldn't agree more!