Southland Station

 
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

Latest on Southland Station:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/no-public-toilets-for-new-21m-southland-train-station-20140423-3732r.html

I can't see the point of public loos if it's close to the shopping centre.

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  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Its servicing a shopping centre, and will see at least 4400 passengers a day? Cutting amenities is going to backfire and be impossible to undo. It'll be worse than Box Hill.
LamontCranston


Perhaps passengers could use the amenities located in the Shopping Centre? When deciding if toilets are required one must ask how long should a passenger need to wait (platform and journey time) between toilet breaks?

Are toilets available on other railway station platforms on that line?
  lkernan Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
From the article: "Large metal gantries above the tracks would also go"
Will be interesting to see how they intend to hold up the wires then.

I wonder if Westfield will be persuaded to install a gate to provide direct access, i'm sure they don't want to.

The design will be interesting though as for the first time in ages, it won't be one of these up and over monstrosity they've been rolling out the last few years.
  K-Class Chief Train Controller

Location: Melbourne
This proposal is a wast of money. The only people that would be regular uses of the train to Chadstone would be student that already go past and would stop here to kill time before heading home from school. The number of tourist using the service would be insignificant. Normal shoppers will not want to be carting their shopping home on the train they would much rather drive.

Look at stations like Ringwood and Box Hill and how many people do you see getting on the train with shopping; very few. Most using these stations are heading to and from the city.

The reason Westfield does not want to hand over any large amount of cash to help build the station is that they know it will not bring them any additional profits.  

Matt
  TedHanson Junior Train Controller

From the article: "Large metal gantries above the tracks would also go"
Will be interesting to see how they intend to hold up the wires then.
lkernan

Metal poles I suppose, maybe even wood. This project should be part of extending the third track to Cheltenham at least and Mordialloc at best. But, an el cheapo platform is all we can manage.
  JimYarin Chief Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
is there precedent in melbourne in building railway stations without toilets?
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

is there precedent in melbourne in building railway stations without toilets?
JimYarin

Heathmont station doesn't have toilets.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

How ridiculous  Westfield benefits in that station attracts extra shoppers to Southland, but does not contribute a single cent.
For the price quoted for a basic station it must be gold plated .  This one is another  Transport  "Blue Hills" .  We will believe it if and when it ever gets built .  Why do we need  PSO cells when Westfield is closed most nights after 1900  ?  Again ridiculous waste of money  PSO's and cells for 2 late shopping nights a week .
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

How ridiculous Westfield benefits in that station attracts extra shoppers to Southland, but does not contribute a single cent.
For the price quoted for a basic station it must be gold plated . This one is another Transport "Blue Hills" . We will believe it if and when it ever gets built . Why do we need PSO cells when Westfield is closed most nights after 1900 ? Again ridiculous waste of money PSO's and cells for 2 late shopping nights a week .
kuldalai

Westfield haven't paid a cent because they're probably worried the station will attract the kind of people to Southland that our PSOs lock up in aforementioned cells.....

Logical.
  JimYarin Chief Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, South Australia


election time?
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
is there precedent in melbourne in building railway stations without toilets?
JimYarin

Most smaller stations in suburban Melbourne don't have toilets, also, with those that do, they are locked when the stations aren't manned either by Metro staff or Vic Pol PSOs.
  jamesadams7 Station Master

I think the station should be built, as your average Joe is not going to bother walking 15 minutes from Cheltenham and back when they can just drive their car. Not everyone takes public transport at every opportunity like the readers of this forum.

However, it must be well connected to the shopping centre. If this () is what's going to greet shoppers when they walk out of the station, it's an absolute waste of money and will get no patronage. From the sounds of it, Westfield wants nothing to do with it and will most likely expect shoppers to walk through the carpark/loading bay.

The station should instead be integrated into a future expansion of the centre, so that shoppers are able to walk right out of the station and be presented with an entrance to the centre in front of them, or better yet, be in the centre itself. Watergardens does this fairly well:

I also think the Government should not give in so easily to Westfield's insistence not to pay a penny. If Westfield refuses to contribute to a station, then the government should simply refuse to approve extensions, more carparks or put other annoying restrictions on the centre.
  waynes Junior Train Controller

Location: Victoria
Toilets or no Toilets that is an obscene amount of money for a railway station at that location. Is the price a joke?

Anywhere else it would be $3-$5m plus or minus 20%

Where is Grosso when you need him?
  Madjikthise Deputy Commissioner

Toilets or no Toilets that is an obscene amount of money for a railway station at that location. Is the price a joke?

Anywhere else it would be $3-$5m plus or minus 20%

Where is Grosso when you need him?
waynes

You forget that when tendering for a government job you multiply by at least 7 times what you would quote a private company. Then when you're about 3/4 of the way through the build you say "woops, sorry costs have gone up it will cost another (insert random 6 digit figure here)".
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
Only on Railpage would a station at an activity centre be admonished and a waste of space like Hurstbridge defended.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Has anyone said or suggested the railway station should not be built ?

What I have read is the value fe money argument. As many have suggested and we have all witnessed rail projects managed by Victrack and other agencies in Victoria just don't manage these projects efficiently and with value for money in mind.

Even myself I feel the price tag is huge for a railway station so small.
  shrekman Junior Train Controller

Location: E.R.D.
Google the price of the Williams Landing station if you reckon this price is inflated!!

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/rail-station-cost-over-the-top-20110815-1iut7.html
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
I have done the research. The stations are very very different.
  Comeng552M Assistant Commissioner

Location: In Sydney "Fixing the trains"
Has anyone said or suggested the railway station should not be built ?

What I have read is the value fe money argument. As many have suggested and we have all witnessed rail projects managed by Victrack and other agencies in Victoria just don't manage these projects efficiently and with value for money in mind.

Even myself I feel the price tag is huge for a railway station so small.
freightgate

And we're not even getting a decent station for that price. Even Adelaide can build decent new stations cheaply such as the new Showgrounds station. Features 3 platforms with a large roof, a footbridge with a lift and some ramps, all for only $16.5 million. If they can get good value for money when building new stations why can't we?

http://www.infrastructure.sa.gov.au/RR/rail_revitalisation/wayville_station
  X'Trapolis-904M Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
And we're not even getting a decent station for that price. Even Adelaide can build decent new stations cheaply such as the new Showgrounds station. Features 3 platforms with a large roof, a footbridge with a lift and some ramps, all for only $16.5 million. If they can get good value for money when building new stations why can't we?

http://www.infrastructure.sa.gov.au/RR/rail_revitalisation/wayville_station
Comeng552M


why cant we build a plain station without fancy roof's
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
I remain unconvinced of any need for a Southland station.despite the relative inconvenience of Cheltenham being a short distance from the shopping centre.  Many people walk that.  There are very few homes which would be closer to Southland than to Cheltenham to offer out-of-shopping-hours traffic.
Gwiwer

Putting stations at activity centres is obvious.

Box Hill for example, has large numbers of disembarkations.

Why have Southland station suffer the same fate within a few months of opening.
ChooChoo

A cheaper station with more services is superior - you shouldn't have to waste time waiting at it the first place.
  JimYarin Chief Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
has the vic government released any artists impressions illustrating the proposed look of the planned station? would be interesting to see where the money is going.
  jamesadams7 Station Master

has the vic government released any artists impressions illustrating the proposed look of the planned station? would be interesting to see where the money is going.
JimYarin

No, other than the artist's impression which appeared in The Age awhile back, which I think is from the newspaper and not the government: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/derailed-station-plan-exposed-20130918-2tzu6.html
  MtBeenak Train Controller

A) Does anyone remember Sydenham Railway Station?  That was ignored when the electric terminus was built adjacent to the Watergardens shopping centre.  How did that go for the developers?  Now that the terminus is at Sunbury and the signal box at Craigieburn, the facilities are way more than needed.

B) Can we drop the political debate.  Libs have not built a southland station, but neither did the ALP during their 10 years.  Surely if there was a demonstrated need, it would have been an issue long before this.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Somewhere In the media It was stated that people have been waiting since the year 1880 for this station to be built !

How could this be ? the whole area was market gardens back then (or been developed for market gardens)


Anyway I think the plans for a station at this location Is a big waste, going to jack up running time on the timetable by about 2 minutes.

One thing Is the Government has already spent up big on this project (through their planning, consultants, spin doctors etc) so that would explain the ever Increasing cost.

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