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      nscaler69 Deputy Commissioner

    Location: There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
    I don't know if the points are 'tighter than anywhere in Australia and indeed the world', I have also heard there are tightness issues at the other end of the line too, somewhere at Seaford.
    Posted: 21 May 2014 20:28

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      justapassenger Minister for Railways

    "The tightest points in the world" sounds a little too close to "dog ate my homework" territory.

    With all the errors so far you'd be forgiven for thinking this is a bunch of graduate engineers having a go at building some trains for the first time.
    Posted: 21 May 2014 21:09
      steam4ian Chief Commissioner

    What I did hear from some blokes seconded to Tracksure was that the alignment had to be redesigned to take out the transitions.

    The system had been run down in more ways than just the capital assets, there was no knowledge in the bank either. I crossed swords with that problem on one occasion and withdrew from work because of it.

    The 'team" was cobbled together in great haste. Good engineers but with no common rail experience, no culture.

    Ian
    Posted: 21 May 2014 22:39
      don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

    Location: Adelaide proud
    The 'team" was cobbled together in great haste. Good engineers but with no common rail experience, no culture.
    steam4ian

    Did they lose that when they lost SAR? The destruction of the broad gauge freight network shortly afterwards wouldn't have left much for them to do in SA.
    Posted: 21 May 2014 23:35
      steam4ian Chief Commissioner

    Don
    The engineering aspect of Adelaide metro rail engineering was totally run down over succeeding decades. What was evident on the tracks also occurred in the back office. The management board had no engineering expertise on it, only two persons on the board had any likelihood of rail knowledge, the General Manager and the union representative; the rest had sectional interest but wouldn't have known a TSR even if it hit them in the face.
    Progressive signalling changes couldn't be made because there were no resident signalling experts.
    Progressive track upgrading couldn't be done because there was no resident expertise; nor the expertise that recognised it should and could be done.
    Much of the track rebuild was the result of progressive neglect not poor infrastructure as received.
    When the electrification came there was no knowledge, no culture, no team. SA could have afforded on "resident expert".

    As a professional engineer I have strong feelings about deskilling of the engineering functions within any organisation that relies on technology to deliver its services. Seen it all too often, seen the cost, reaped the personal rewards from filling in the gaps. Smile

    Ian
    Posted: 22 May 2014 07:24
      witsend Chief Commissioner

    Location: Front RH Seat of a School Bus
    So for the Gawler Line, they are hiring all the armchair critics on here to project manage? What it does show is that successive cuts in the backoffice of Public Service does have an impact.
    Posted: 22 May 2014 08:07
      steam4ian Chief Commissioner

    Samuel

    Hopefully they will now have some in-house knowledge and culture.

    Ian
    Posted: 22 May 2014 08:39

    Last edited by steam4ian on 22 May 2014 08:40; edited 1 time in total
      yoyoman Junior Train Controller

    Location: Adelaide, SA
    I've had the pleasure of riding the new trains almost every day for the past few weeks. I have noticed 1 thing though, not with the railcars but with people on many occasions.  

    I find people interesting, always have.  I find it 'amusing' that when stopping at a platform there are people who don't get on the railcars at the door closest to them, even when it's right in front of them, but will look to another car (or door on the same carriage) and alight there.  It's like they don't realise they can walk through the entire length of the cars easily and have access to the whole consist.

    The other thing I noticed just yesterday was there was 1 or 2 people who walked from the rear car, passed me at the rear of the T car, and I think they may have walked all the way to the front door to get off before too many people crowded that area.  It was an express from Woodlands Park train, I think they started moving at around Mile End.

    Quite interesting from my perspective Smile
    Posted: 22 May 2014 12:12
      1S47 Assistant Commissioner

    Location: On the Down Fast
    ......  It's like they don't realise they can walk through the entire length of the cars easily and have access to the whole consist.
    yoyoman

    One thing I've noticed in the morning peaks is A-City trains passing me around Clarence Park or Goodwood (so ~10 mins from the city) with the front car full & people standing in the vestibules, while the rear car has plenty of seats to spare.

    Obviously some people don't mind standing.   If they were in a desperate hurry to be first off the platform at ARS, they could still sit down for the ride and walk through the train after Mile End
    Posted: 22 May 2014 13:14
      justapassenger Minister for Railways

    Moving before arriving is simple - you can be closer to the station exit at the time the train stops. I can understand that for people who are new to the trains and don't understand you need to add on six minutes to the scheduled arrival to account for one of the largest margins in the world for a commuter rail service.

    I've done that at other stations in the past when the train has been running late enough to make a bus connection tight or if it's raining heavily. It's not so useful now the doors are locked on the DEMUs, but before that there were a few times that it made the difference. I've never done it at Adelaide, though I might do it to get ahead of the herd on a well-loaded train or if I was tight for time.
    Posted: 22 May 2014 13:37
      nm39 Chief Commissioner

    Location: By a road taking pictures
    One thing I've noticed in the morning peaks is A-City trains passing me around Clarence Park or Goodwood (so ~10 mins from the city) with the front car full & people standing in the vestibules, while the rear car has plenty of seats to spare.

    Obviously some people don't mind standing. If they were in a desperate hurry to be first off the platform at ARS, they could still sit down for the ride and walk through the train after Mile End
    1S47

    It also amuses me how people stand up before Adelaide Station when there is no real hurry to get off while I just remain seated with no danger of falling over. Most of these people head out the gates and disperse through the city with no connecting transport to catch. If there was an issue that you might miss getting off I might understand it but as I have said to quite a few people- You can't get off til it stops so relax.
    Posted: 22 May 2014 14:59
      Pressman Spirit of the Vine

    Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
    It also amuses me how people stand up before Adelaide Station when there is no real hurry to get off while I just remain seated with no danger of falling over. Most of these people head out the gates and disperse through the city with no connecting transport to catch. If there was an issue that you might miss getting off I might understand it but as I have said to quite a few people- You can't get off til it stops so relax.
    "nm39"


    Like wise it amuses me when I'm on an air flight, I sit and watch as you pull up to the gate, most people stand up and crowd the aisle then stand there for 10 minutes because there is only the front door open, and everyone in front goes first!
    Posted: 22 May 2014 15:27
      David Peters Dr Beeching

    Location: "With Hey Boy".
    One other thing in Adelaide on trains was once you were in a carriage you could not move to another carriage while the train was moving. So you got onto a car and stayed there for the entire trip. The new cars have full access to any car but the public still think in the old way. So you get a car or cars packed solid almost and the rear car only has a handfull of people in it. Also Jumbo railcars here have helped a lot as well most people head to a trailer car for a bit quieter ride and old habits die hard!
    Posted: 22 May 2014 19:28
      yoyoman Junior Train Controller

    Location: Adelaide, SA
    I still miss the old days of riding the Red-Hens with the doors held open with your foot.  Most of the conductors let you keep the door open without any fuss.

    As far as I remember back in those days there were no rules about moving between carriages whilst in motion, keeping in mind that the only protection was the 2-3 thin chains on either side of the 'footplate' area (not sure what the correct term is) between the cars.

    How times have changed.
    Posted: 22 May 2014 20:06

    Last edited by yoyoman on 22 May 2014 20:09; edited 1 time in total
      don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

    Location: Adelaide proud
    Like wise it amuses me when I'm on an air flight, I sit and watch as you pull up to the gate, most people stand up and crowd the aisle then stand there for 10 minutes because there is only the front door open, and everyone in front goes first!
    Pressman

    I'm exactly the same, why bother rushing off the plane - if you have luggage booked through it's not going to come out any faster just because you've elbowed your way off the plane.

    I caught a plane a few years ago where an elderly gentleman (maybe 90 or so) got up and walked to the front of the plane before it even stopped - the cabin staff were yelling at him to stay in his seat but he just ignored them... I think he was deaf as a doornail.
    Posted: 22 May 2014 20:26
      steam4ian Chief Commissioner

    Back to the trains,

    In another forum I read that the crossover and slip on the Seaford Main leading to storage road #2 was taken out because the 4000s couldn't negotiate it. One correspondent said 4000s could only use platforms 1-3; haven't proof of this, others may know.

    Ian
    Posted: 22 May 2014 21:02
      Milkomeda Chief Train Controller

    Saw 4007 being assembled in the depot today as I was going past on the train.
    Posted: 23 May 2014 23:29
      SteamRanger Chief Train Controller

    Location: Warrnambool
    While in Adelaide last week, captured this shot at Goodwood Station.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/coreygibsonphotography/6561454363/
    Posted: 25 May 2014 19:51
      BillD Chief Train Controller

    Chan 7 news tonight (Wed 28th) had a short item from today showing a 4007 end unit on the truck at Mt Compass.
    Bill.
    Posted: 28 May 2014 19:04
      don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

    Location: Adelaide proud
    Chan 7 news tonight (Wed 28th) had a short item from today showing a 4007 end unit on the truck at Mt Compass.
    Bill.
    BillD

    Did it fall off the truck or manage to make it to Seaford unscathed I wonder!
    Posted: 28 May 2014 21:14
      steam4ian Chief Commissioner

    Did it fall off the truck or manage to make it to Seaford unscathed I wonder!
    don_dunstan

    Laughing
    Posted: 28 May 2014 22:38
      Pressman Spirit of the Vine

    Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
    Did it fall off the truck or manage to make it to Seaford unscathed I wonder!
    "don_dunstan"

    Reportedly it rolled off just as the truck backed up to the ramp, lucky hey Very Happy
    Posted: 28 May 2014 22:45
      GeoffreyHansen Minister for Railways

    Location: In a FAM sleeper
    While in Adelaide last week, captured this shot at Goodwood Station.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/coreygibsonphotography/6561454363/
    "SteamRanger"


    Good work Steamranger!
    Posted: 28 May 2014 23:28
      RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

    Location: Dubai UAE
    I'm exactly the same, why bother rushing off the plane - if you have luggage booked through it's not going to come out any faster just because you've elbowed your way off the plane.

    I caught a plane a few years ago where an elderly gentleman (maybe 90 or so) got up and walked to the front of the plane before it even stopped - the cabin staff were yelling at him to stay in his seat but he just ignored them... I think he was deaf as a doornail.
    don_dunstan

    India is really bad for people standing up as soon as wheels down. I was in isle with 9mth old on lap and bags above and behind and I am tall and seat spacings are tiny. The Indian guy next to me was trying to get past, I said you have to wait and if its not obvious, F'N OPEN YOUR EYES. He then complained some more, using even more colourful language I said do you have checked baggage, he said yes, then all hell broke loose and I pushed him into his seat and made him wait until we were the last people off the plane and yes, we still had to wait for baggage.  

    Back to Adelaide, peoples habits change slowly, give them time to work out the new trains.
    Posted: 29 May 2014 18:10
      don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

    Location: Adelaide proud
    Back to Adelaide, peoples habits change slowly, give them time to work out the new trains.
    RTT_Rules

    Assuming they do actually complete the order then 6am-7pm should be 'show up and go' - or at least every 15 minutes like in Perth.

    To get maximum value out of the Tonsley line it would be good if they could extend that to Flinders Uni but I guess that's probably 10-15 years away given the current political and economic environment.
    Posted: 29 May 2014 19:49

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