Preserving a second Series X class, someone has to do it

 
  DounutCereal Chief Train Controller

Location: Who knows.
Hello all, I have been doing some thinking about PN's current 'lets scrap the old stuff' antics and I started wondering about second series X's. We have X31 preserved so we have a member of the first series and we have X53 and 54 with Aurizon (probably for sale soon though) but PN has all of the second series X's in their fleet.

Victoria has yet to lose a class or subclass of diesel locomotive and if all 2nd series X's were chopped up (which looks likely) then they'd be the first to go in 63 years of diesel power. I'm not sure about everyone else here but I reckon they're the first big 645's and are worthy of being preserved. I doubt the SRHC will be getting one and it looks unlikely that the museum at newport will be getting any more loco's so who's going to get an X?

What are the possibilities of setting up a new group to buy an X or at least try and get custody of one for preservation purposes? Would anyone here be interested in helping preserve one? Looking at scrap prices and what an X might be they could be worth up to $35k - $40k with all the copper in them.

And further more, possibly a H class if not an X.

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  Bogong Chief Commissioner

Location: Essendon Aerodrome circa 1980
I guess PN would let one go for scrap value, so long as there was an iron clad "no compete" caveat stating the locomotive (or it's parts) could never be used by a competitor.

You say $40,000? Let's make it $50 k to include transport and legals.

I'll happily fork out for a 2% share as long as someone else stores the thing and I don't have to pay out an annual fee for "aggistment".
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
I guess PN would let one go for scrap value, so long as there was an iron clad "no compete" caveat stating the locomotive (or it's parts) could never be used by a competitor.

You say $40,000? Let's make it $50 k to include transport and legals.

I'll happily fork out for a 2% share as long as someone else stores the thing and I don't have to pay out an annual fee for "aggistment".
Bogong

Why not? They don't eat much Smile
  Raichase Captain Rant!

Location: Sydney, NSW
I don't understand the "save everything" mentality of railfans. What justification is there to save a second series X Class? Were they any more significant than the first series? They certainly don't look different. I'd understand if people wanted to save a third series X, given the different windscreen design, but even then...

It's all good and well to want to save everything, but where does one park it? Where does the money for the upkeep come from?

I'm not opposed to the concept, I quite like X Class, and the enthusiast in me would like to see as many saved as possible, however the realist in me suggests that it's just not possible to save everything. Let X31 stand as a representation of the class, and use the money/undercover space/etc to secure an A Class instead...
  JimYarin Chief Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
what gauge as these units on? still bg?
  DounutCereal Chief Train Controller

Location: Who knows.
what gauge as these units on? still bg?
JimYarin

All BG except for X37 which is on workshop bogies.
  Bevan Wall Deputy Commissioner

All BG except for X37 which is on workshop bogies.
DounutCereal

I didn't realise that the Werris Creek depot and yardhad been converted to BG! There's a mob of Xs stabled there.
  Raichase Captain Rant!

Location: Sydney, NSW
I didn't realise that the Werris Creek depot and yardhad been converted to BG! There's a mob of Xs stabled there.
Bevan Wall

I didn't realise those X class at Werris Creek were suddenly second series. Wink

Edit: Forgot an emoticon.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
On would require backup BG locomotives. They may keep a few.
  JimYarin Chief Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
just realised the locomotives section might have this data.  http://www.railpage.com.au/locos/x-class-x37-x44



all but one are on broad gauge.

what is stored at werris creek?
  Bevan Wall Deputy Commissioner

I didn't realise those X class at Werris Creek were suddenly second series. Wink

Edit: Forgot an emoticon.
Raichase

My lack of knowledge of Victorian locos is now showing!

So the X class stored at Werris Creek are designated as third series? What is the time gap between the last second series X class and the first third series?  Were any mechanical improvements made?

Thanks,
BW
  rjgmfan

Location: Sydney, Australia
Are you certain there are Second Series X class locomotives stored in NSW?
  DounutCereal Chief Train Controller

Location: Who knows.
all but one are on broad gauge.

what is stored at werris creek?
JimYarin

The one listed as SG is now an XR and the locos stored at Werris Creek are all 3rd series X's.

So the X class stored at Werris Creek are designated as third series? What is the time gap between the last second series X class and the first third series? Were any mechanical improvements made?
Bevan Wall


The second series was 1970 and the 3rd was 1975. The 3rd series was set up for short end first only and had a completely different cab design to the 2nd series and they were ordered for the Jet services. The 2nd series was set up for bi-directional running with the long hood designated the No.1 end I believe and had a cab like a 1st series. The 2nd series was an upgrade of the first series, only differences being made to accommodate a 645 engine.
  trainbrain Chief Commissioner

I will be up in the Werris Creek area in a few weeks, I will go and have a sticky and grab some photos if possible..............
  Raichase Captain Rant!

Location: Sydney, NSW
I've yet to see anyone answer my question as to WHY...
  Greensleeves Chief Commissioner

Location: If it isn't obvious by now, it should be.
The one listed as SG is now an XR and the locos stored at Werris Creek are all 3rd series X's.
"DounutCereal"


Not quite, X42 is the 2nd series X on SG, after its bogies were put under one of the ex-SG XR's when they were converted to BG (555, 558 or 559). X49 lost its bogies in similar fashion and can now be found on the SG turntable.

As to why someone would want to preserve a second series X over a third series, my only guess is that the second series ones were the first X's fitted with the 645 engine. That said, to anyone else, they won't be able to tell the difference and I'd rather see a third series saved first if possible anyway. Sure it'd be nice to save an example of everything, but if we're going that far why don't we get a billionaire to build us an S class steamer, or restore H220 to operating condition...
  SN7 Chief Commissioner

I welcome any one individual or group to preserve an X class of any variant,  however money usually talks and bull s ... Walks,  at $ 8900.00 to fill the fuel tank, each time,  I hope you never have to do an oil change , or replace a traction motor or wheel set!!!
  seb2351 Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney


It's all good and well to want to save everything, but where does one park it? Where does the money for the upkeep come from?

Raichase

Perhaps we could store it in Dorrigo, for its impending tourist train operations.
Or, we could lease the locomotive to a small private operator for them to push to its operating limits before they go bust. Both the private operator and the volunteer board behind the scenes...
  Henry Herby

Location: Victoria
Are you certain there are Second Series X class locomotives stored in NSW?
rjgmfan



Had a quick scan through here to see if someone had replied....

All 2nd Series X's are in Victoria. X36 is the only X that isn't a 3rd (its a 1st) in NSW and is stored at Werris Creek.
  waynes Junior Train Controller

Location: Victoria
Had a quick scan through here to see if someone had replied....

All 2nd Series X's are in Victoria. X36 is the only X that isn't a 3rd (its a 1st) in NSW and is stored at Werris Creek.
Henry


That sounds about right.
  DounutCereal Chief Train Controller

Location: Who knows.
I've yet to see anyone answer my question as to WHY...
Raichase

The reason why I was thinking a second series was because we have a first series preserved, X31 with Seymour and there are two 3rd series owned by Aurizon which I would think might have a bit of a higher chance of being sold instead of being scrapped (that and the rivit counters might like them more than PN's because they don't have toilet mods on them). Most groups who would be looking at preserving an X would probably be looking at 3rd series or like was previously suggested, A's.

The idea is that the second series may slip between the cracks and be lost while those who are already in preservation are looking at preserving other types of locomotives. And lets face it, there's a lot of heritage projects going on so the existing groups that could would most likely be looking at A's and 3rd series X's.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Just for those wanting a bit more knowledge of the three different X class:


First series X class, X31 to X36, 6 built in 1966. Used 1810hp EMD 16-567E engines
X31 has been preserved and is currently on Hire to Qube, mainly for use on their Maryvale Paper train
X32 through to X35 have all been converted to XR class
X36 is on SG and currently stored at Werris Creek


Second series X class, X37 to X44, 8 built in 1970. Used 2210hp EMD 16-645E engines
All on BG
X37 and X39 both stored at South Dynon
X38 and X40 both converted to XR class (both on BG)
X41, X42, X43, X44 are all in service but rarely used, X41 is the only one in PN blue and yellow livery. All are on BG.


Third series X class, X45 to X54, 10 built between 1975 and 1976, again using 2210hp EMD 16-645E engines
These are notable for having a redesigned cabin, similar to the ones used in the XR class and VL class.
All are on SG, X45 to X52 are owned by PN, and X53 and X54 are owned by Aurizon
Most if not all PN 3rd series X class are now in storage at Werris Creek.
Aurizon's units are still in use as far as I know.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
X class work the Tocumwal and the Mildura on a daily basis if you look at buncam.
  DounutCereal Chief Train Controller

Location: Who knows.
Third series X class, X45 to X54, 10 built between 1975 and 1976, again using 2210hp EMD 16-645E engines
These are notable for having a redesigned cabin, similar to the ones used in the XR class and VL class.
All are on SG, X45 to X52 are owned by PN, and X53 and X54 are owned by Aurizon
Most if not all PN 3rd series X class are now in storage at Werris Creek.
Aurizon's units are still in use as far as I know.
Gman_86

Simmilar but not quite like an XR or VL cab, Freight Australia rebuilt X47 and X49's cab with a chopped back nose and widened windscreens like those two classes but the rest of the class have a more C class like cab window arrangement with the two widely spaced windscreens.
  GAS351 Train Controller

The 2nd series Xs are used regularly still. X39 is still in service.
The difference between a second and 3rd is huge, it's basically a different loco. Let's not forget the fact that 3rd series have an alternator, 1st and 2nd have a generator.

1st also has the engine start in the cab, like a h or t class, you have to start a 2nd and 3rd on the engine. The 1st has slightly different electro-magnetic switchgear.

Nothing is more enjoyable then driving an early X long end leading with the windows down!

My favourite loco.

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