Murray Basin standardisation

 
  Duncs Chief Commissioner

I noticed on Andrew Broad MP's FB page that he's been having conversations with the PM about federal funding for the project in the past week.

Perhaps he's pushing for a 23 TAL on the Mildura line? (The State Govt report suggested 21 TAL throughout)
Victorian plan is upgrade to 21 tonne axle load initially , with ability to step up to 23 tonnes when and if required .

Mineral sands are to come out of Manangatang in big quantities for many years, and  existing  mines near  Hopetoun line nearly expired .
kuldalai
A 22 tonne axel load is a 132 tonne locomotive, which is pretty much the norm for SG freight trains these days. So that should be the targeted benchmark.

Sponsored advertisement

  M636C Minister for Railways

A 22 tonne axle load is a 132 tonne locomotive, which is pretty much the norm for SG freight trains these days. So that should be the targeted benchmark.
"Duncs"


For some reason, axle loads are measured in tons, not tonnes....

In theory they should be in kiloNewtons, since a Tonne is a measure of mass and not a measure of force.

So it appears axle loads missed the national metric conversion of 1973.

Anyway, 22 tons is the figure, which gives a locomotive mass of 132 tons which is 134.15 tonnes

This is about 219 kN axleload.

M636C
  Beta4Me Locomotive Driver

A 22 tonne axle load is a 132 tonne locomotive, which is pretty much the norm for SG freight trains these days. So that should be the targeted benchmark.


For some reason, axle loads are measured in tons, not tonnes....

In theory they should be in kiloNewtons, since a Tonne is a measure of mass and not a measure of force.

So it appears axle loads missed the national metric conversion of 1973.

Anyway, 22 tons is the figure, which gives a locomotive mass of 132 tons which is 134.15 tonnes

This is about 219 kN axleload.

M636C
M636C
I don't think that's right. Case in point, V/Line's Network Service Plan - Network Operating Requirements: it refers to 19 and 20 tonne gross axle loads.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
I noticed on Andrew Broad MP's FB page that he's been having conversations with the PM about federal funding for the project in the past week.

Perhaps he's pushing for a 23 TAL on the Mildura line? (The State Govt report suggested 21 TAL throughout)
Victorian plan is upgrade to 21 tonne axle load initially , with ability to step up to 23 tonnes when and if required .

Mineral sands are to come out of Manangatang in big quantities for many years, and  existing  mines near  Hopetoun line nearly expired .
kuldalai
21 tonne axleload is short sighted and will hamper the potential efficiencies of SG conversion. Do it once and do it properly. The increased cost will be minimal. Our planners and politicians are 50 odd years behind reality.
(Sorry, I forgot for a minute that I was in Victoria.)
From the jaws of success we will seize defeat, without doubt.
  Alphabet Train Controller

Location: Moonee Ponds
Two questions, as someone who's not really followed forensically:

1) Why were Sea Lake-Kulwin and Manangatang-Robinvale not included?
2) I assume once the lines as far as Sea Lake and Manangatang are converted to SG, that therefore Sea Lake-Kulwin and Manangatang-Robinvale will be useless as they'll be disconnected BG? Is there any plan to convert them later or just abandon them/rip them up?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
They are both abandoned today, so gauge Isolating them changes nothing !
  damooops Junior Train Controller

Location: The Revenue Raising State
G'day all.
Considering one of the next mineral sands sites is meant to be at Euston, just over the border from Robinvale, it would make sense to have the line reopened and gauge converted to Robinvale. But we ARE in Victoria, aren't we? Common sense isn't all that common when it comes to rail investment here!
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
Considering one of the next mineral sands sites is meant to be at Euston, just over the border from Robinvale, it would make sense to have the line reopened and gauge converted to Robinvale.
Damoops
There doesn't seem to be a push by Iluka to do that; I would suspect that it is cheaper to haul the mineral sands by truck an extra 50km than to restore 50km of track that may not be used by other operators.
  x42 Junior Train Controller

Location: NSW
These post are starting to appear along side the track

  x42 Junior Train Controller

Location: NSW
These post are appearing beside the track. Can anyone enlighten me ?

  Contrillion Junior Train Controller

Location: Geelong, Victoria
These post are appearing beside the track. Can anyone enlighten me ?

x42
It might just be me, but it doesn't seem to be loading :/
  x42 Junior Train Controller

Location: NSW
I can't work out why it's not showing the post and doubling up my posts. Basically surveying posts are turning up next to the line. Would this be for ballast height or for when they pull the track in ?

Has any work started between Ararat and Maryborough ?

X42
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Considering one of the next mineral sands sites is meant to be at Euston, just over the border from Robinvale, it would make sense to have the line reopened and gauge converted to Robinvale.
There doesn't seem to be a push by Iluka to do that; I would suspect that it is cheaper to haul the mineral sands by truck an extra 50km than to restore 50km of track that may not be used by other operators.
LancedDendrite

I have posted previously.  There are grain silos still in use on the line to Robinvale and there are requests or have been in the past for intermodal from Robinvale.  The road from Manangtang to Robinvale is a dirt track and is very dangerous to drive with the trucks already on that road. (grain mainly)  It is will far cheaper to use the rail line than the road both in maintenance and also cost.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
It is will far cheaper to use the rail line than the road both in maintenance and also cost.
bevans

Ante up then. I look forward to seeing the announcement of your new joint venture with GrainCorp, Iluka Resources and the Rural City of Swan Hill.
  BDA Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney
M yep I think you are right with the Kn . Too many different factors come into play and while increasing axle loads does help adhesion pulling forces increase with better bogie design and traction motor size and type .
Recently I read that some 90 classes may be going into storage because lighter AC traction diesels can do the job as well or better than heavier DC units .
What higher axle load perway would give is increased loading capacity on the wagons themselves .
  fzr560 Chief Train Controller

M yep I think you are right with the Kn . Too many different factors come into play and while increasing axle loads does help adhesion pulling forces increase with better bogie design and traction motor size and type .
Recently I read that some 90 classes may be going into storage because lighter AC traction diesels can do the job as well or better than heavier DC units .
What higher axle load perway would give is increased loading capacity on the wagons themselves .
BDA
Whilst I can't comment on comparisons between light AC and heavy DC, I believe that the lack of ECP and DP options counted against the 90 class. The push toward longer and longer rakes probably forced PNs hand.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Considering one of the next mineral sands sites is meant to be at Euston, just over the border from Robinvale, it would make sense to have the line reopened and gauge converted to Robinvale.
There doesn't seem to be a push by Iluka to do that; I would suspect that it is cheaper to haul the mineral sands by truck an extra 50km than to restore 50km of track that may not be used by other operators.

I have posted previously.  There are grain silos still in use on the line to Robinvale and there are requests or have been in the past for intermodal from Robinvale.  The road from Manangtang to Robinvale is a dirt track and is very dangerous to drive with the trucks already on that road. (grain mainly)  It is will far cheaper to use the rail line than the road both in maintenance and also cost.
bevans
The road is bitumen, although with no hard shoulder.  Hopefully the rail corridor is maintained with the hope of future Standardization.  I somehow doubt that the Bannerton, Annuello or Bolton silos will be reopened.

There is a fair bit of fruit and vegies grown in Robinvale.  It should be sent to Melb by rail instead.

As for the current status of the upgrade, apparently a hi-rail has been out and about between Maryborough and Avoca.  But I think we'll have to wait until late 2016 before we start seeing some significant work on the ground.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Just wondering what the thoughts are on which locos/types of locos will be gauge converted along side this project?  Id imagine some Gs and BLs, what else could/would be needed for SG services?

Are there currently operating BG fleets that cannot be standardised?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Just wondering what the thoughts are on which locos/types of locos will be gauge converted along side this project?  Id imagine some Gs and BLs, what else could/would be needed for SG services?

Are there currently operating BG fleets that cannot be standardised?
james.au
Wouldn't be much of an Issue, with plenty of loco class's that could operate on the new SG system.

Open's the door for any SG grain operators to have a go chasing the grain season around South East Australia, yielding much better grain fleet utilization.
  NOELWB Locomotive Driver

I drove from Maryborough, via Avoca to Arrarat on the 9th of Feb. The road parallels the rail line between Avoca and Arrarat. I dont like the chances of a Highrail traversing the line, at least not without a D9 Bulldozer clearing the way! The line is generally overgrown with some very substantial trees blocking the way. To reinstate and gauge convert this line is going to cost a lot of money.
  mikesyd Chief Commissioner

Location: Lurking
I drove from Maryborough, via Avoca to Arrarat on the 9th of Feb. The road parallels the rail line between Avoca and Arrarat. I dont like the chances of a Highrail traversing the line, at least not without a D9 Bulldozer clearing the way! The line is generally overgrown with some very substantial trees blocking the way. To reinstate and gauge convert this line is going to cost a lot of money.
NOELWB
No Conversion necessary as it was converted to SG around 1996.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
they've allocated about 700-800k per km to restore that part of the line.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
@Nightfire, agreed, the existing SG fleets are going to be far better utilised, but id think some of the mixed gauge fleets will see converts, whilst others won't, where it will accellerate their retirement and scrapping.
  Beta4Me Locomotive Driver

they've allocated about 700-800k per km to restore that part of the line.
james.au
You could build a brand-new DIRN-grade line with only 1.5x that!
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
I drove from Maryborough, via Avoca to Arrarat on the 9th of Feb. The road parallels the rail line between Avoca and Arrarat. I dont like the chances of a Highrail traversing the line, at least not without a D9 Bulldozer clearing the way! The line is generally overgrown with some very substantial trees blocking the way. To reinstate and gauge convert this line is going to cost a lot of money.
NOELWB
The plan Is to rebuild the line with new ballast and new concrete sleepers ?

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: