Metro Trains wins another 7 year contract

 
Topic moved from Victoria by bevans on 12 Sep 2017 13:40
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey


if true I am definitely voting for the opposition.  Disgrace.

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  Valvegear The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Is anybody surprised?  The issue went into the "Too Hard" basket, and was allowed to fall out again.
I don't have a problem with Yarra Trams, but, Metro?
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

Did anyone else want to run the suburban rail network?  Were they locked out by the existing contract?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-12/metro-contract-extended-for-melbournes-train-network/8895462

"Under the previous contract, the operators had an exclusive right to negotiate with the Victorian Government for a new deal before other businesses could bid.

The exclusivity agreement is not in the new contract."

Obviously Spring St didn't want to run it like the olden days...
  steve195 Junior Train Controller



Very vague, but this little detail could be good: "Passengers will no longer have to deal with overbearing and in your face advertising at stations and on trams and trains."


Yay!

Daily inspections of stations, trains and major tram stops will be introduced, and restrictions on advertising — including a ban on wrap-around tram ads — will be put in place.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-12/metro-contract-extended-for-melbournes-train-network/8895462
  lkernan Chief Train Controller

Location: Melbourne


if true I am definitely voting for the opposition.  Disgrace.
x31

Nothing like making an informed decision based on all the facts.


Or you know, just vote based on a tweet.....
  steve195 Junior Train Controller

A few more details

  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
What is the definition of insanity?

Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result.
  steven_h Train Controller

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Sure, you could switch to _another_ company and have them have to learn the ropes again _and_ realise how hard the whole task will be.
Instead Metro get it again.. with tougher measures on ALL the points I have had issues with.
I'm actually hopeful that, along with all the improvement works they're doing, this will actually be beneficial to all of us.

I was initially disappointed to hear another 7 years (maybe it's a little tooooo long), but with the added provisos, it sounds like an OK deal.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Not sure why this ended up in the 'Victoria' thread when its strictly a 'Melbourne Suburban' thread topic.

Nothing to do with Regional Victoria whatsoever.

Mike.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
The network is struggling to get people to and from their workplace and struggling with poor track management and timetabling.  We have had years of the network being voted one of the worst in Australia.  How can this be a good deal?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The network is struggling to get people to and from their workplace and struggling with poor track management and timetabling.  We have had years of the network being voted one of the worst in Australia.  How can this be a good deal?
x31
It will be a good deal as it will continue to largely insulate the Minister and the Government from the chronic failings of the system. Metro will remain a well paid punching bag.
  Crossover Junior Train Controller

Location: St. Albans Victoria
The network is struggling to get people to and from their workplace and struggling with poor track management and timetabling.  We have had years of the network being voted one of the worst in Australia.  How can this be a good deal?
It will be a good deal as it will continue to largely insulate the Minister and the Government from the chronic failings of the system. Metro will remain a well paid punching bag.
YM-Mundrabilla
         The system DOES have failings but after so many years of absolute underinvestment under previous administrations what do we expect ?
          At least there are tangible improvements happening , Level crossings going , Line extensions ( Mernda ) , Major system enhancements ( Metro ) & new trains still be delivered and on order .
  trainbrain Assistant Commissioner



if true I am definitely voting for the opposition.  Disgrace.
x31
Good, now go away
  Bogong Chief Commissioner

Location: Michigan J. Frog
The main failing of the suburban rail system is dodgy fixed infrastructure, stuff like tracks and signalling... and of course the state government pays for that, or rather, doesn't pay enough for it.

So rather than the government paying Yarra Trams extra money to make up for removing the larger ads from their trams, it might be better to spend that money on improved tracks and signalling. Yes it may only pay for a few short sections, but it all helps.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Scoping a preliminary feasibility study
The main failing of the suburban rail system is dodgy fixed infrastructure, stuff like tracks and signalling... and of course the state government pays for that, or rather, doesn't pay enough for it.

So rather than the government paying Yarra Trams extra money to make up for removing the larger ads from their trams, it might be better to spend that money on improved tracks and signalling. Yes it may only pay for a few short sections, but it all helps.
Bogong
There's also a 32% increase in Metro's maintenance budget to $330 million per annum. Yarra Trams gets a 63% increase to its maintenance budget to $81.5 million p.a.

http://economicdevelopment.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/1544453/TFV-Metro-Re-franchising-Contracts-Factsheet.pdf
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The main failing of the suburban rail system is dodgy fixed infrastructure, stuff like tracks and signalling... and of course the state government pays for that, or rather, doesn't pay enough for it.

So rather than the government paying Yarra Trams extra money to make up for removing the larger ads from their trams, it might be better to spend that money on improved tracks and signalling. Yes it may only pay for a few short sections, but it all helps.
There's also a 32% increase in Metro's maintenance budget to $330 million per annum. Yarra Trams gets a 63% increase to its maintenance budget to $81.5 million p.a.

http://economicdevelopment.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/1544453/TFV-Metro-Re-franchising-Contracts-Factsheet.pdf
LancedDendrite
An interesting comparison between the Metro Maintenance Budget which is only four times that of Yarra Trams.

I have no knowledge of the subject but perhaps there are some here on RP who could provide informed comment on what, on the surface, appears to me to be a little 'odd'.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

This may explain the timing of the 'name a station' stunt.
  skitz Chief Commissioner

Stupid is, as stupid does.

Metro behave in the exact manner they are allowed to behave.  Cant see the new contract being effectively different from the last given that one side of the argument, the Victorian government departments, will remain essentially the same.

In a franchise both the client and supplier need to perform to get results.  

There is enough material in this decision to base a whole season of Utopia.
  DalyWaters Chief Commissioner

Stupid is, as stupid does.

Metro behave in the exact manner they are allowed to behave.  Cant see the new contract being effectively different from the last given that one side of the argument, the Victorian government departments, will remain essentially the same.

In a franchise both the client and supplier need to perform to get results.  

There is enough material in this decision to base a whole season of Utopia.
skitz
Indeed.

Having a look at the contracts, it is obvious that they were written with the idea of getting the MTM consortium over the line for making it look like the passenger and taxpayer was the winner whereas it will be business as usual.

If there were any intention to treat the passenger with any respect, MTM would have complied with these standards voluntarily over the previous few years. Instead, they did just what they had to in order to get their bonus or avoid the paltry fine.

I would call it collusion based on ethnic grounds.

The upper hierarchy of the PTV, Infrastructure, TfV, etc., (basically the only people the, way out of her depth, Minister listens to) are from the Mother Country.  They rule the Department with an iron fist.  The Australians I know of there get virtually no say and hate the thought of another seven years of MTM.

MTM is 50% a Hong Kong based company, owned by MTR.  They, in turn, are owned by small shareholders and institutions there as well as having some China Government involvement.  When they first came to Melbourne , they brought quite a few Hong Kong engineers and the like.  When it became apparent that Victoria's transport management was in the grip of Mother Country control, MTM very quickly allowed the Hong Kongers to return home and went for all Mother Country management.  The numbers swelled from 80 managers at Connex to well over 300 managers at Metro within two years.  Many of these managers were on 457 visas.

Since then it has been collusion between the hierarchy of PTV, etc., and Metro to "make MTM management of our system look like a success.

The wheel has turned even further with the appointment to V/Line of ex Metro, ex Mother Country managers.  The positions of CEO and Operations Manager are held by people who did not last long at Metro but, somehow, got appointed by PTV to these crucial positions.

Unfortunately, the Minister for Transport is a dead end job.  No one can survive the portfolio and go up in their career.  Since the late Lynne Kosky, at Labor, the portfolio has been the place to park a politician with ambitions of being Premier so as to stop their progress.  It dosen't matter if the incumbent has the first clue about transport.  It is part of the political game.

When we do ever get a Minister that knows something about transport, they might wake up to the fact these Mother Country types couldn't run a bath. We can only live in hope.
  steve195 Junior Train Controller

MTM is 50% a Hong Kong based company, owned by MTR.  They, in turn, are owned by small shareholders and institutions there as well as having some China Government involvement.  When they first came to Melbourne , they brought quite a few Hong Kong engineers and the like.  When it became apparent that Victoria's transport management was in the grip of Mother Country control, MTM very quickly allowed the Hong Kongers to return home and went for all Mother Country management.  The numbers swelled from 80 managers at Connex to well over 300 managers at Metro within two years.  Many of these managers were on 457 visas.

Since then it has been collusion between the hierarchy of PTV, etc., and Metro to "make MTM management of our system look like a success.
DalyWaters
Great post.

I'll just add that I have heard stories similar to the above. Basically, there was a huge culture clash when MTM took over - especially in the area of maintenance. The HK engineers wanted to implement a sweeping preventative maintenance regime, but were over ruled by the 'establishment' who knew that the network had so many problems that they'd be flat out with just fixing issues as they occur.
One can only hope that the increased maintenance budget in the new contract will be used for wholesale upgrades of track and signalling systems. That would be a big step towards a more reliable network.
  skitz Chief Commissioner

Stupid is, as stupid does.

Metro behave in the exact manner they are allowed to behave.  Cant see the new contract being effectively different from the last given that one side of the argument, the Victorian government departments, will remain essentially the same.

In a franchise both the client and supplier need to perform to get results.  

There is enough material in this decision to base a whole season of Utopia.
Indeed.

Having a look at the contracts, it is obvious that they were written with the idea of getting the MTM consortium over the line for making it look like the passenger and taxpayer was the winner whereas it will be business as usual.

If there were any intention to treat the passenger with any respect, MTM would have complied with these standards voluntarily over the previous few years. Instead, they did just what they had to in order to get their bonus or avoid the paltry fine.

I would call it collusion based on ethnic grounds.

The upper hierarchy of the PTV, Infrastructure, TfV, etc., (basically the only people the, way out of her depth, Minister listens to) are from the Mother Country.  They rule the Department with an iron fist.  The Australians I know of there get virtually no say and hate the thought of another seven years of MTM.

MTM is 50% a Hong Kong based company, owned by MTR.  They, in turn, are owned by small shareholders and institutions there as well as having some China Government involvement.  When they first came to Melbourne , they brought quite a few Hong Kong engineers and the like.  When it became apparent that Victoria's transport management was in the grip of Mother Country control, MTM very quickly allowed the Hong Kongers to return home and went for all Mother Country management.  The numbers swelled from 80 managers at Connex to well over 300 managers at Metro within two years.  Many of these managers were on 457 visas.

Since then it has been collusion between the hierarchy of PTV, etc., and Metro to "make MTM management of our system look like a success.

The wheel has turned even further with the appointment to V/Line of ex Metro, ex Mother Country managers.  The positions of CEO and Operations Manager are held by people who did not last long at Metro but, somehow, got appointed by PTV to these crucial positions.

Unfortunately, the Minister for Transport is a dead end job.  No one can survive the portfolio and go up in their career.  Since the late Lynne Kosky, at Labor, the portfolio has been the place to park a politician with ambitions of being Premier so as to stop their progress.  It dosen't matter if the incumbent has the first clue about transport.  It is part of the political game.

When we do ever get a Minister that knows something about transport, they might wake up to the fact these Mother Country types couldn't run a bath. We can only live in hope.
DalyWaters
You know the system well.  

Understanding the dysfunction of the franchise is one thing.  Understanding the culture of Metro is a whole new game.   Some of the toxic behaviours have to be seen to be believed.  The relationship of their infrastructure department to to organisation being a highlighted example.

My bug bear is Metro have no incentive to improve the quality of the asset why they are reward by margin on maintenance throughput.   You wont see 'best practice' to preserve the asset at the lowest cost of ownership because it will reduce their profit.  Its in Metro's interest to have the asset at a high cost.  The only real improvement you will see is by capital (where they also get paid margin).  Unless they are specifically directed to do so by the client.  This effectively means that it is up to the state to asset manage the asset, yet can you see any expertise coming from that direction outside of capital?

The track will remain at, or on, the limit of safety.  The risk of derailment will remain high.   The cost to the tax payer will remain high.  Its a fine line between maximising maintenance profit and trains on the rails.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line

Unfortunately, the Minister for Transport is a dead end job.  No one can survive the portfolio and go up in their career.  Since the late Lynne Kosky, at Labor, the portfolio has been the place to park a politician with ambitions of being Premier so as to stop their progress.  It dosen't matter if the incumbent has the first clue about transport.  It is part of the political game.

When we do ever get a Minister that knows something about transport, they might wake up to the fact these Mother Country types couldn't run a bath. We can only live in hope.
DalyWaters

There is no 'Minister for Transport' in the Andrews government.

There's the Minister for Public Transport and the Minister for Roads and Road Safety.

The Minister for Public Transport is hardly a dead end job...the portfolio is coveted and is often in the media making good news announcements.

Mike.
  Boss Chief Commissioner

Location: Caulfield Line
...the portfolio is coveted and is often in the media making good news announcements.Quiet true - making the same announcements time and time again:)
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

It could be argued that MTR are a bunch of rent-seekers feeding off us, the taxpayer:
http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/economy/article/2110856/hong-kong-mtr-consortium-extends-right-operate-metro-trains

"With 869km of track in the Australian city, more than three times the amount that is in Hong Kong, Metro Trains is the most profitable rail project outside the MTR’s home market in the first half of this year."

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