Operating/Signalling/XPT and V/Line questions

 
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
Hello there,
I have questions concerning the Melbourne XPT, particularly it's journey in Victoria, which is why I'm posting it in this forum. Other questions are about general operation, gauges and signalling.

  1. I assume that Albury station is on the NSW side of the border, having noticed the NSW type indications and signals. Is this true?
  2. Do drivers change at Albury, or does the driver memorise both NSW and Victorian signalling and practise of operation?
  3. Why is the North East line on a different alignment to the Craigeburn line?
  4. How many tracks are on the North East line and what gauge are those lines.
  5. Does the V/Line service goes on the Craigeburn line, then on the North East line or is the V/Line service entirely on the North Coast line? I ask this because I saw a Vlocity on the Craigeburn line.
  6. Which freight is broad gauge and which freight is standard gauge?
  7. Which V/Line services are broad and standard gauge?
  8. Do trams use the same Victorian broad gauge or a different gauge?
  9. How do the colour light signals work? I think the lens changes colour? That is not the case in Sydney, which uses single coloured lenses.
  10. Is there a websites that explains all the indicators and signals? Similar to RailSafe, in NSW.


Sorry for all the questions, CL.

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  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

Hello there,
I have questions concerning the Melbourne XPT, particularly it's journey in Victoria, which is why I'm posting it in this forum. Other questions are about general operation, gauges and signalling.

  1. I assume that Albury station is on the NSW side of the border, having noticed the NSW type indications and signals. Is this true?
  2. Do drivers change at Albury, or does the driver memorise both NSW and Victorian signalling and practise of operation?
  3. Why is the North East line on a different alignment to the Craigeburn line?
  4. How many tracks are on the North East line and what gauge are those lines.
  5. Does the V/Line service goes on the Craigeburn line, then on the North East line or is the V/Line service entirely on the North Coast line? I ask this because I saw a Vlocity on the Craigeburn line.
  6. Which freight is broad gauge and which freight is standard gauge?
  7. Which V/Line services are broad and standard gauge?
  8. Do trams use the same Victorian broad gauge or a different gauge?
  9. How do the colour light signals work? I think the lens changes colour? That is not the case in Sydney, which uses single coloured lenses.
  10. Is there a websites that explains all the indicators and signals? Similar to RailSafe, in NSW.


Sorry for all the questions, CL.

All of your questions can be answered by using search.
Junee is the Driver change Location and yes Albury is indeed in NSW.

Colonel Leon
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
On train crews I believe may change or at least be based at Albury?
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

On train crews I believe may change or at least be based at Albury?
x31
I think you may well be correct in this.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
clarification required in the on board train staff (not drivers) change at Albury.
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

clarification required in the on board train staff (not drivers) change at Albury.
x31
If you bothered to have a look at my reply to CL you would have sighted the words,Drivers are Changed at JUNEE.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
clarification required in the on board train staff (not drivers) change at Albury.
If you bothered to have a look at my reply to CL you would have sighted the words,Drivers are Changed at JUNEE.
Clyde Goodwin2
I for one didn't read your reply because it is embedded in a quote so it looks like you have simply re-posted the original post!

One could say that if you bothered to post correctly your reply may have been easier for X31 and others to understand Laughing

BG
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

One could also say that possibly if the insane nested quote,s worked correctly all the time so one could reply to the post that things would also be easier to understand for people such as you who skim without looking.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
One could also say that possibly if the insane nested quote,s worked correctly all the time so one could reply to the post that things would also be easier to understand for people such as you who skim without looking.
Clyde Goodwin2
Agree - reply posts do not always work as they should and as for the formatting of pasted quotes better not to try...........
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
One could also say that possibly if the insane nested quote,s worked correctly all the time so one could reply to the post that things would also be easier to understand for people such as you who skim without looking.
Clyde Goodwin2
His enter if you manually insert a quote so it leaves a space which will allow to "exit" the quote. You may have just hit "reply" which in that case, it may be a bug on the website.

May I ask, what happened to your old account?
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
1. Signals from the Down Departure Signal at Albury use VR Three Position aspects.
Down signal arriving at Albury use NSW Single Light Indications.

VR 3PS and NSW SLI are "fairly" compatible, as VR Green roughly equate to NSW flashing yellow.
VR 3PS and NSW Double Light indications are rather contradictory, since Green Over Red means Clear Normal Speed for VIC, and Caution for NSW.

VR doesn't use flashing yellow for anything. If you wanted to upgrade 3 position signalling to 4 position signalling, the cheapest way to do this would be to introduce a flashing yellow on the top head, rather than introduce an extra Medium speed head.
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
1. Signals from the Down Departure Signal at Albury use VR Three Position aspects.
Down signal arriving at Albury use NSW Single Light Indications.

VR 3PS and NSW SLI are "fairly" compatible, as VR Green roughly equate to NSW flashing yellow.
VR 3PS and NSW Double Light indications are rather contradictory, since Green Over Red means Clear Normal Speed for VIC, and Caution for NSW.

VR doesn't use flashing yellow for anything. If you wanted to upgrade 3 position signalling to 4 position signalling, the cheapest way to do this would be to introduce a flashing yellow on the top head, rather than introduce an extra Medium speed head.

See: http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR251.pdf diagram of Albury.
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
Thanks for that.
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
Thanks for that.
  damooops Junior Train Controller

Location: The Revenue Raising State
G'day Colonel Leon.
A useful website for Victorian signalling info is: http://vicsig.net/
Here's the page on signalling: http://vicsig.net/index.php?page=infrastructure&section=signalling
In answer to some of your questions, the trams in Victoria run on Standard gauge (1435mm). The Craigieburn line also carries V/line traffic for the Seymour/ Shepparton lines which is on Broad gauge. The main North East line to Albury/ Sydney is on Standard gauge and has a different alignment via Albion and Jacana. Broad gauge freight trains also runs this way bound for Tocumwal NSW which is past Shepparton and Deniliquin in NSW via a branch line off the Shepparton/ Tocumwal line at Toolamba that runs to Echuca.
Cheers
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Hello there,
I have questions concerning the Melbourne XPT, particularly it's journey in Victoria, which is why I'm posting it in this forum. Other questions are about general operation, gauges and signalling.

  1. I assume that Albury station is on the NSW side of the border, having noticed the NSW type indications and signals. Is this true?
  2. Do drivers change at Albury, or does the driver memorise both NSW and Victorian signalling and practise of operation?
  3. Why is the North East line on a different alignment to the Craigeburn line?
  4. How many tracks are on the North East line and what gauge are those lines.
  5. Does the V/Line service goes on the Craigeburn line, then on the North East line or is the V/Line service entirely on the North Coast line? I ask this because I saw a Vlocity on the Craigeburn line.
  6. Which freight is broad gauge and which freight is standard gauge?
  7. Which V/Line services are broad and standard gauge?
  8. Do trams use the same Victorian broad gauge or a different gauge?
  9. How do the colour light signals work? I think the lens changes colour? That is not the case in Sydney, which uses single coloured lenses.
  10. Is there a websites that explains all the indicators and signals? Similar to RailSafe, in NSW.


Sorry for all the questions, CL.
Colonel Leon

It looks like you are new here so ill have a go at answering them.  These details can be found here and online with google but it might take some finding for some of them.  I don't know all the answers though.

1. Albury is on the NSW side of the border yes.
2. Cannot answer
3. Not sure what you mean by this?  I mean the lines are different lines altogether, being different gauges, the NE line being standard gauge (SG - I abbreviate the line name to NESG) and the Craigieburn forming part of the Melbourne metro and Vline networks, being on broad gauge (BG).
4. The NESG is single track Albury to Wodonga, then dual track to Mangalore, then single (with loops) all the way to Melbourne.  From Seymour the BG track is double track to Southern Cross).  Refer to the ARTC website for system maps.
5. Vline operates SG services on the NESG to Albury using N Class loco hauled sets and BG services to Seymour and Shepparton using VLocities, Sprinters and N Class loco hauled sets.  Refer to the VLine website for detail.
6. There are many freight services on SG from Sydney and Brisbane to Melbourne, as well as ad-hoc grain services.  Refer to ARTC website for the Master Train Plan.  The BG services run from Tocumwal.  Refer to the VLine Network Service Plan online for those timetables.
7. Refer point 5.
8. I was surprised to learn that trams in Melbourne run on SG.
9. Cannot answer, but NSW and Vic have different systems
10. Cannot answer.

Hope this gives you some starting points for your future information finding endeavours!
  theanimal Chief Commissioner

Hello there,
I have questions concerning the Melbourne XPT, particularly it's journey in Victoria, which is why I'm posting it in this forum. Other questions are about general operation, gauges and signalling.

  1. I assume that Albury station is on the NSW side of the border, having noticed the NSW type indications and signals. Is this true?
  2. Do drivers change at Albury, or does the driver memorise both NSW and Victorian signalling and practise of operation?
  3. Why is the North East line on a different alignment to the Craigeburn line?
  4. How many tracks are on the North East line and what gauge are those lines.
  5. Does the V/Line service goes on the Craigeburn line, then on the North East line or is the V/Line service entirely on the North Coast line? I ask this because I saw a Vlocity on the Craigeburn line.
  6. Which freight is broad gauge and which freight is standard gauge?
  7. Which V/Line services are broad and standard gauge?
  8. Do trams use the same Victorian broad gauge or a different gauge?
  9. How do the colour light signals work? I think the lens changes colour? That is not the case in Sydney, which uses single coloured lenses.
  10. Is there a websites that explains all the indicators and signals? Similar to RailSafe, in NSW.


Sorry for all the questions, CL.
Colonel Leon
1.  Yes Albury is in NSW

2.  Dependent upon the operator, as already stated NSW trains change crews at Junee, I believe SCT plan for Wagga?

3.  Unknown

4.  unknown

5.  unknown

6. unknown

7.  unknown

8. victorian trams ruin non standard gauge, as do Adelaide and Sydney trams

9.  I do not think there are any searchlight signals still in use in NSW, where there was a single light, with rotating coloured lights, otherwise in NSW usually multiple heads.

10. train S.A. Track and Signal
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
For signalling changes at Albury where NSW practice changes to VIC, see http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR251.pdf
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
Searchlight signals have a solenoid operated coloured device in front of the white lamp, which is always lit.

With no power, the device drops (by gravity??) to the middle and lowest position put red glass in front of the white lamp.

With negative DC power, the device swings so that yellow glass is in front of the white lamp.

With positive DC power, the device swings so that green glass is in front of the white lamp.

NSW had one experiment searchlight signal at Kogarah in the 1920s.

NSW installed fair number of searchlight signals on the Main South, and Main North, but these have long gone.

VIC, SA, CR, and WA had and still have lots.

AFAIK, QLD and TAS never had them.

See http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR251.pdf for diagrams.
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
Searchlight signals have a solenoid operated coloured device in front of the white lamp, which is always lit.

With no power, the device drops (by gravity??) to the middle and lowest position put red glass in front of the white lamp.

With negative DC power, the device swings so that yellow glass is in front of the white lamp.

With positive DC power, the device swings so that green glass is in front of the white lamp.

NSW had one experiment searchlight signal at Kogarah in the 1920s.

NSW installed fair number of searchlight signals on the Main South, and Main North, but these have long gone.

VIC, SA, CR, and WA had and still have lots.

AFAIK, QLD and TAS never had them.

See http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR251.pdf  for diagrams.
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
Thanks very much for the answers, we're getting somewhere now. There seems to be a bug where some posts come up twice.

It looks like you are new here so ill have a go at answering them.
james.au

Not new, I'm about a year old here but I'm new to the Melbourne and Victorian railways.

Clyde Goodwin2, why did you disagree to my original post? I wasn't stating anything, just asking questions??

Regards, CL
  Colonel Leon Junior Train Controller

Location:
So here is the info so far:
Bold = unknown
  1. Albury is in NSW.
  2. Drivers change at Junee but train crew change at Albury.
  3. By on a different alignment, I mean that the tracks of the North East line are not next to the tracks of the Craigeburn line. I thought they would've been, because on the network map it shows the V/Line next to the Craigeburn line.
  4. The NESG is single track Albury to Wodonga, then dual track to Mangalore, then single (with loops) all the way to Melbourne.  From Seymour the BG track is double track to Southern Cross).  Refer to the ARTC website for system maps. - Credit james.au
  5. Vline operates SG services on the NESG to Albury using N Class loco hauled sets and BG services to Seymour and Shepparton using VLocities, Sprinters and N Class loco hauled sets.  Refer to the VLine website for detail. - Credit james.au It's interesting how the N class loco comes in 2 different gauges.
  6. There are many freight services on SG from Sydney and Brisbane to Melbourne, as well as ad-hoc grain services.  Refer to ARTC website for the Master Train Plan.  The BG services run from Tocumwal.  Refer to the VLine Network Service Plan online for those timetables. - Credit james.au
  7. As 5.
  8. Standard gauge. The St Kilda LR - that used to be a railway. Was that railway in SG or BG?
  9. Refer to post by awsg24.
  10. http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/ and http://vicsig.net/



Many thanks for the answers, CL
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
Searchlight signals have a solenoid operated coloured device in front of the white lamp, which is always lit.

With no power, the device drops (by gravity??) to the middle and lowest position putting red glass in front of the white lamp.

With negative DC power, the device swings so that yellow glass is in front of the white lamp.

With positive DC power, the device swings so that green glass is in front of the white lamp.

NSW had one experiment searchlight signal at Kogarah in the 1920s.

NSW installed fair number of searchlight signals on the Main South, and Main North, but these have long gone.

VIC, SA, CR, and WA had and still have lots.

AFAIK, QLD and TAS never had them.

See http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR251.pdf  for diagrams.
awsgc24

For Searchlight signals near Seymour (ES3117 and ES3243)
see: http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR210.pdf .
  mikesyd Chief Commissioner

Location: Lurking
#3 - Have a look on Google Maps/Earth - the SG line is parallel to the BG north of Broadmeadows. Its on a different alignment south of there - via Albion.

#8 - It was Broad Gauge.

I am surprised that you did not know where Albury is located!!
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
Searchlight signals have a solenoid operated coloured device in front of the white lamp, which is always lit.

With no power, the device drops (by gravity??) to the middle and lowest position put red glass in front of the white lamp.
awsgc24
Do the signals have backup or battery power?  With no power, there would be no light at all otherwise.

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