Push to put trains back on Casino-Mur'bah rail line

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 15 Oct 2017 15:02
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Just when the rail trail guys wanted the track for their use the train guys are now putting up the fight which to my mind is good as the train will deliver more than a rail trail would.  Rail trails only work when the line goes somewhere interesting or tourist wise.  Bright is a great example.  South Gippsland a waste of taxpayers money.

Push to put trains back on Casino-Mur'bah rail line

Sponsored advertisement

  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Just when the rail trail guys wanted the track for their use the train guys are now putting up the fight which to my mind is good as the train will deliver more than a rail trail would.  Rail trails only work when the line goes somewhere interesting or tourist wise.  Bright is a great example.  South Gippsland a waste of taxpayers money.

Push to put trains back on Casino-Mur'bah rail line
bevans
You don't understand rail trails and choose not to understand them !

The Great Southern Rail Trail Is a great community asset, that gets people out doors and active, small towns along the trail are cashing In on the trail trade with cafe's opening.
A parkrun event Is soon going to be launched at Koonwarra using the newly opened section of trail.

There Is a strong push to extend the trail to Korumburra.

Some people have just got to accept that the Government has zero Interest In reopening some railways, and It was just all a big political point scoring game to who's Government was going to bite the bullet and put an uneconomical railway to death (once one side of Government did this, the other side were happy that they didn't have to were It)    

In the event that economical conditions change and there Is a desire for Government to re-establish a railway, any old railway that has been let go to nature would have to be fully demolished and rebuilt from the base up (like Ararat - Marybouough) wouldn't matter If the formation had been used as a rail trail (would of saved them the costs of dismantling and vegetation clearing) a new cycling walking trail would need to be first built next to the proposed re-established railway alignment (railway built to the optimal alignment within the railway reserve or even outside)
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

Apart from the 3KM of track at Byron Yuppieville Bay the line will Never ever again see anything more than the Bastardised 620/720 class set running on it anywhere so why not give it over to Rail Trail usage.
  Junction box Chief Commissioner

Location: newy
Unless the sums add up with new bridges, tamping sleepers, culverts, safeworking and stations we won't see sh1t .
The only way is to milk Byron tourism and get some long trains up there for the young working class in an 80's retro boom.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

Unless the sums add up with new bridges, tamping sleepers, culverts, safeworking and stations we won't see sh1t .
The only way is to milk Byron tourism and get some long trains up there for the young working class in an 80's retro boom.
Junction box

How are you going to get long trains there when there are several breaks in the track where bridges used to be?
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
Just when the rail trail guys wanted the track for their use the train guys are now putting up the fight which to my mind is good as the train will deliver more than a rail trail would.  Rail trails only work when the line goes somewhere interesting or tourist wise.  Bright is a great example.  South Gippsland a waste of taxpayers money.

Push to put trains back on Casino-Mur'bah rail line
bevans
Many, not all rail trials have proven to be cash flow positive and more attractive than the former railway operation ever was and many Heritage railways ever achieve.

In most cases, former railways are never reopened for all the reasons it closed in the first place and more and for a few lines probably dating back to why it should not have been built in the first place. Biggest issue with this historic branch lines is alignment, reopening to modern requirements for most lines in NSW, Tas and parts of Qld is you wouldn't reopen the old line anyway unless it was just for a short distance as the grade and curvature is often part of the reason it closed.

Like anything location location location will make or break a rail trail and the same applies to Heritage rail. As much as I'd love to see more old steamers and diesels running with many carriages of smiling faces, there just isn't the numbers to make it work. I also feel too many heritage operators are too narrow focused on what they want to run and bring about their own demise. Some EU heritage lines don't have any trains, rather rail bikes or similar.  

Unless someone has $1m now as a starter to take over a small section of the Mull'bah line, its dead and considering the level of tourism in the area this asset needs to be converted to something and done sooner rather than later. The rail option has been sitting there for 13 years, how much longer do we wait? Time to try something else that we can all use.
  cityrail-rulez Chief Train Controller

WHY bother? No offence! I'm pretty sure I read on here that the Byron Bay council brought the Byron Bay corridore part of the line for some damn bypass road, so therefore there will NEVER be any trains running on the line now

The government had opportunities to rebuild and reopen the branch line since they closed it and surely they have no intention of ever reopening it, so spit the dummy and give up! with a nitwit called gladys berejiklian in power who rips up, tears down and loves to spend billions of dollars wasting money on tramways, trams, driverless trains and wider trains that can't even run through the Blue Mountains unless more billions of dollars is spent upgrading the Blue Mountains line and heaps more, she's just a blood s u c k i n g heritage vampire who loves to distory the railways

I am just being honest! There's no way this line will EVER see trains, there's no way this line will ever be reopened
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
WHY bother? No offence! I'm pretty sure I read on here that the Byron Bay council brought the Byron Bay corridore part of the line for some damn bypass road, so therefore there will NEVER be any trains running on the line now

The government had opportunities to rebuild and reopen the branch line since they closed it and surely they have no intention of ever reopening it, so spit the dummy and give up! with a nitwit called gladys berejiklian in power who rips up, tears down and loves to spend billions of dollars wasting money on tramways, trams, driverless trains and wider trains that can't even run through the Blue Mountains unless more billions of dollars is spent upgrading the Blue Mountains line and heaps more, she's just a blood s u c k i n g heritage vampire who loves to distory the railways

I am just being honest! There's no way this line will EVER see trains, there's no way this line will ever be reopened
cityrail-rulez
I think your dislike of Gladys is tarnishing your vision of what is really happening.

- Has the govt introduced an ACT of parliament to permanently close that section of the line in Byron? If not then it won't happen
- Gladys has commited to building more train lines (ones actually under construction) than built in last 70 years
- Finally fixing the width issue over the Blue Mountains to common rolling stock on all three IU lines, something previously done to Central Coast and probably the 'Gong. And no its not costing billions, less than $100m I believe.
- Replacing aging IU rolling stock and not fit for purpose IU rolling stock with modern rollingstock more suited to longer commuter travel
- Building more commuter rail trackage (Metro line 1) than built in Sydney in last 70 years combined
- Replacing the aging regional rollllingstock in compatible two fleets with likes one modern fleet which is expected to have similar appearance and theme to new IU rolling stock.
- What else in your list?
- From my own observation, improved the standard, safety, cleanliness, peak and off-peak frequency and reliability of commuter trains in Sydney.


The only line or track closed by the current govt is the Newcastle line which was going to happen regardless of state leadership (whether I liked it or not)

And you call this a blood sucking heritage vampire Premier that is destroying railways? I just don't get it, what is it that you see is a pro-rail Premier if the above is the opposite???

When the ALP closed the Mull-Casino line (yes Gladys didn't do it), was what they did so wrong? (Yes I'd prefer they didn't) but +120km of high cost track for one train a day? Yes it was a popular CSO train, but still one train a day. How many inquiries and investigations do we need to confirm this outdated alignment used by nothing else isn't viable as a CSO? Yes massive cost savings could be found in replacing many of the timber structures with low cost culverts, but not the big ticket items.

Even if a Heritage operator wanted to run, they would claim what 20-30km of track at most? No Heritage operator has survived long term with longer track without ongoing govt injections and even this much is likely a challenge. So what do we do with the rest of the track? Again if a Heritage/tourist operator wants to take it on, please wave your money now and go for it, its been 13 years since closure and the track condition isn't getting any better. If not, how much longer do we wait?
  ivahri Train Controller

Well said... and what makes me shake my head even more is that someone would vent at Gladys about this when the ALP have even less love of country rail... you would have to be a totally blind Labor supporter to be deluded enough to think that they will have any interest in protecting what is left of the right of way.

Richard
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
Well said... and what makes me shake my head even more is that someone would vent at Gladys about this when the ALP have even less love of country rail... you would have to be a totally blind Labor supporter to be deluded enough to think that they will have any interest in protecting what is left of the right of way.

Richard
ivahri
I don't believe in the ALP does this for PT and LNP don't. There is a long history of  greatness and badness on both sides in most states and fed level.

The issue appears to be however that the one-eyed ALP supporters in NSW cannot stand the fact that the current govt is doing so much for PT and more so than collectively done for last 30+ years in only 6 years with plenty of vision to come if given the chance. I think everything they believe in in regard to political stereotype is being turned upside down and they cannot stand it.

Do I agree with everything they have done or plan to do? no! For example I would have extended the ESR over the CSELR and not cut the Newcastle line   although I would have done something different. But that's just personal preference, we all have that.
  Spletsie Chief Commissioner

The reality of closed railway lines is that they very rarely re-open. Once they are closed that is usually the end of the line. Sorry, bad pun.

There needs to be a very compelling reason for a line to re-open, and I don't think the case for Casino-Murwillumbah is very strong.
  Junction box Chief Commissioner

Location: newy
The injustice of the closure is they shut the whole line not just truncated it and while they cried uneconomical they knowingly ran the smaller patronage XPT then we watch in 2017 the state Government spend billions on pie in the sky road and rail projects, sure they are rolling it, the romance of rail is nearly gone.
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
On a capotal cost per passenger I think all the Sydney based projects greatly out weigh the cost of making the Mull'bab line sustainable. People it's well over 100km long!!!!

However I strongly believe it should have been terminates at Lismore for which the Casino to Lismore branch lacks moat of tge high cost items and reinstatement would be low cost.
  james.au Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney, NSW
The LNP in Queensland has announced they would fund a feasibility study for 'fast' rail in the SEQ region.  I would love to see their National party brethren on the NSW side of the border (who are under some pressure from greens voters in the area mind you) to perhaps include the line in that study....  

It would be pretty remote (for inclusion of the line in a feasibility study or in the QR network plan) , but if the question is not asked there cannot be an answer..
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
The LNP in Queensland has announced they would fund a feasibility study for 'fast' rail in the SEQ region.  I would love to see their National party brethren on the NSW side of the border (who are under some pressure from greens voters in the area mind you) to perhaps include the line in that study....  

It would be pretty remote (for inclusion of the line in a feasibility study or in the QR network plan) , but if the question is not asked there cannot be an answer..
james.au
Feas' studies are cheap and an easy way to say we are doing something. What is likely to come out of its is that its not viable as the internal Qld  routes are too short and for a fraction of the money the existing interurban lines can be upgraded to achieve only slightly average travel distance from home to the city.

Regards
Shane
  Mufreight Train Controller

Location: North Ipswich
The LNP in Queensland has announced they would fund a feasibility study for 'fast' rail in the SEQ region.  I would love to see their National party brethren on the NSW side of the border (who are under some pressure from greens voters in the area mind you) to perhaps include the line in that study....  

It would be pretty remote (for inclusion of the line in a feasibility study or in the QR network plan) , but if the question is not asked there cannot be an answer..
Feas' studies are cheap and an easy way to say we are doing something. What is likely to come out of its is that its not viable as the internal Qld  routes are too short and for a fraction of the money the existing interurban lines can be upgraded to achieve only slightly average travel distance from home to the city.

Regards
Shane
RTT_Rules
It would be useful and cost effective to reinstate service between Casino and Lismore for both passenger and freight services.
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
The LNP in Queensland has announced they would fund a feasibility study for 'fast' rail in the SEQ region.  I would love to see their National party brethren on the NSW side of the border (who are under some pressure from greens voters in the area mind you) to perhaps include the line in that study....  

It would be pretty remote (for inclusion of the line in a feasibility study or in the QR network plan) , but if the question is not asked there cannot be an answer..
Feas' studies are cheap and an easy way to say we are doing something. What is likely to come out of its is that its not viable as the internal Qld  routes are too short and for a fraction of the money the existing interurban lines can be upgraded to achieve only slightly average travel distance from home to the city.

Regards
Shane
It would be useful and cost effective to reinstate service between Casino and Lismore for both passenger and freight services.
Mufreight
Won't find an argument from me not to not, except I highly doubt even 1t of freight would use the line.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

A new station would have to be built because I don't think the main bridge is capable of handling the XPT or Xplorer.
  barryc Chief Train Controller

Location: Waiting for a train to Canungra
A new station would have to be built because I don't think the main bridge is capable of handling the XPT or Xplorer.
simstrain
What main bridge?
  Jim K Train Controller

Location: Well west of the Great Divide in NSW but not as far as South Australia
People here are still living in the 20th century... time to move on. A Passenger train to this part of the world is not viable (actually... not many passenger trains are viable anywhere) People that visit this are come mainly by car/road as that is what they want... quick from Sydney or Brisbane, get around to where ever they are going and out again.

So why should the tax payer fork out millions for ongoing costs of a passenger train service in this area that will service bugger all.

Move on people....
  BDA Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney
Actually its very easy , give rail trailz the adjacent overgrown access road . The original formation is so useless that cyclists won't want to use it .
  tazzer96 Deputy Commissioner

Actually its very easy , give rail trailz the adjacent overgrown access road . The original formation is so useless that cyclists won't want to use it .
BDA
I've actually ridden on the line itself (until I got way too close to a massive brown snake).  I'm a firm beleiver that trains should be put back onto a line that's been upgraded, but as a cycle trial, it has alot going for it.  Especially between mullumwimby and murwillimbah as it has lots of bridges (including a good one over the brunswick) and tunnels.  This section is arguably the worst railway wise anyway, so you could even return trains to mullumbimby and rail trail the rest.
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
A new station would have to be built because I don't think the main bridge is capable of handling the XPT or Xplorer.
What main bridge?
barryc
We explained this to Sim's before. The station is on the Casino side of the bridge. But other structures between Casino and Lismore will need some work.
  62440 Chief Commissioner

The only way trains would ever return to Byron would be an extension of the Gold Coast line with a coastal alignment picking up places that didn't exist 100 years ago. Next to nobody ever went to Mbah, it was an accidental terminus where you changed to a bus.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

A new station would have to be built because I don't think the main bridge is capable of handling the XPT or Xplorer.
What main bridge?
We explained this to Sim's before. The station is on the Casino side of the bridge. But other structures between Casino and Lismore will need some work.
RTT_Rules

The whole line goes beyond Lismore does it not? This thread is about the whole line and not just extending to Lismore.

I meant bridge and not station.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.