Of the Hurstbridge line and that bridge

 
  Heihachi_73 Chief Commissioner

Location: Terminating at Ringwood
The problem with electrifying to Bacchus Marsh is the fact you are never going to fully duplicate the line there.
"tazzer96"

In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.

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  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
tell that to the national trust! I don't think hurstbridge will be duplicated any time soon because of 'the bridge'....
  Crossover Train Controller

Location: St. Albans Victoria
In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
tell that to the national trust! I don't think hurstbridge will be duplicated any time soon because of 'the bridge'....
Dangersdan707
Could not a separate bridge be built to carry the duplicate track and the Heritage bridge remains in use as is being done with the tunnel duplication near Rosanna ?
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
tell that to the national trust! I don't think hurstbridge will be duplicated any time soon because of 'the bridge'....
Dangersdan707
I think you are mentioning the Eltham trestle bridge. Well I am afraid to say that section has already confirmed to be duplicated since planning work has been funded in 2017-2018 state budget of 5 million from Greensborough to Eltham.

So that bridge ain't the obstacle. It is the cost.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
Yes, the mythical timber structure they all call The Eltham Trestle bridge
  steve195 Train Controller

In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
tell that to the national trust! I don't think hurstbridge will be duplicated any time soon because of 'the bridge'....
I think you are mentioning the Eltham trestle bridge. Well I am afraid to say that section has already confirmed to be duplicated since planning work has been funded in 2017-2018 state budget of 5 million from Greensborough to Eltham.

So that bridge ain't the obstacle. It is the cost.
James974
They won't necessarily duplicate the bridge..

The Level Crossing Removal Authority (LXRA) will also undertake the planning work on possible future rail duplications on sections between Greensborough and Eltham, to further boost services.
Press Release


Duplication beyond Eltham won't happen for a very long time, if ever, as the patronage is minuscule.
  Heihachi_73 Chief Commissioner

Location: Terminating at Ringwood
Yes, the mythical timber structure they all call The Eltham Trestle bridge
"Dangersdan707"

Anyone got a match? Twisted Evil

Ironic that the Yarra Valley Railway, a heritage tourist railway, has more modern bridges than the Hurstbridge line which is a daily-used for-profit suburban rail service.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Yes, the mythical timber structure they all call The Eltham Trestle bridge

Anyone got a match? Twisted Evil

Ironic that the Yarra Valley Railway, a heritage tourist railway, has more modern bridges than the Hurstbridge line which is a daily-used for-profit suburban rail service.
Heihachi_73
If it isn't broken...
  tazzer96 Deputy Commissioner

The problem with electrifying to Bacchus Marsh is the fact you are never going to fully duplicate the line there.

In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
Heihachi_73
Belgrave has enough loops on the fairly small single track section that its not a massive issue.  That line has other issues beside absolute capacity.
Hurstbridge didn't have the population half a centuary ago and currently need at least duplication to eltham, and at least another loop wattle glen and ideally hurstbridge.

Hurstbridge had other issues like staff and ticket working until only a few years ago, which is simple amazing.  I don't even know of a suburban line operating on some form of staff working in the last 30 years.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
The problem with electrifying to Bacchus Marsh is the fact you are never going to fully duplicate the line there.

In other words, it will be just like the Hurstbridge and Belgrave lines, which should have been duplicated half a century ago.
Belgrave has enough loops on the fairly small single track section that its not a massive issue.  That line has other issues beside absolute capacity.
Hurstbridge didn't have the population half a centuary ago and currently need at least duplication to eltham, and at least another loop wattle glen and ideally hurstbridge.

Hurstbridge had other issues like staff and ticket working until only a few years ago, which is simple amazing.  I don't even know of a suburban line operating on some form of staff working in the last 30 years.
tazzer96
In addition, the junction at Clifton Hill needs to be grade separated to increase reliability. I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.
Railblogger

Why?

It's among the quietest parts of the network. It is home to two of the stations with the lowest patronage figures in Melbourne (Wattle Glen and Hurstbridge). There is next to no urban growth past Diamond Creek.

It is just rural land. The remarkable thing is that they ever built the line in the first place.

It will remain as is for the foreseeable future, there are bigger fish to fry.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.

Why?

It's among the quietest parts of the network. It is home to two of the stations with the lowest patronage figures in Melbourne (Wattle Glen and Hurstbridge). There is next to no urban growth past Diamond Creek.

It is just rural land. The remarkable thing is that they ever built the line in the first place.

It will remain as is for the foreseeable future, there are bigger fish to fry.
Gman_86
Reduces the cost of running the service out there due to reduced travel time (and thus labour costs) as well as reduced maintenance costs due to less infrastructure.
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.

Why?

It's among the quietest parts of the network. It is home to two of the stations with the lowest patronage figures in Melbourne (Wattle Glen and Hurstbridge). There is next to no urban growth past Diamond Creek.

It is just rural land. The remarkable thing is that they ever built the line in the first place.

It will remain as is for the foreseeable future, there are bigger fish to fry.
Reduces the cost of running the service out there due to reduced travel time (and thus labour costs) as well as reduced maintenance costs due to less infrastructure.
railblogger
The issue is the Hurstbridge line is it is so outdated. It has a wooden bridge on a 21st century suburban line, like it is not Puffing Billy, it is still part of the metro network, any minor upgrades on the line are worth it. Not saying duplicating the whole line like other people stuck in fantasy land. Small upgrades like duplicating to Eltham and realigning track and an extra passing loop at Wattle Glen would increase the usage of the line, since you can run services much more quickly and reliable. Duplicating past Eltham would be silly since it is still rural, but making the track straight means trains can go quickly (more capacity) and an extra passing loop at Wattle Glen means that more services can run back and forth at the Hurstbridge terminus.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.

Why?

It's among the quietest parts of the network. It is home to two of the stations with the lowest patronage figures in Melbourne (Wattle Glen and Hurstbridge). There is next to no urban growth past Diamond Creek.

It is just rural land. The remarkable thing is that they ever built the line in the first place.

It will remain as is for the foreseeable future, there are bigger fish to fry.
Gman_86

More interesting is the adding of additional services between Greensborough and Hurstbridge in the recent timetable change.
  trainbrain Deputy Commissioner

the Hurstbridge line although has that rural feeling, this is probably what the Warburton Line would have looked like it if it had survived and was electrified.................
  LeroyW Junior Train Controller

Location: Awaiting MM2
I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.

Why?

It's among the quietest parts of the network. It is home to two of the stations with the lowest patronage figures in Melbourne (Wattle Glen and Hurstbridge). There is next to no urban growth past Diamond Creek.

It is just rural land. The remarkable thing is that they ever built the line in the first place.

It will remain as is for the foreseeable future, there are bigger fish to fry.
Reduces the cost of running the service out there due to reduced travel time (and thus labour costs) as well as reduced maintenance costs due to less infrastructure.
The issue is the Hurstbridge line is it is so outdated. It has a wooden bridge on a 21st century suburban line, like it is not Puffing Billy, it is still part of the metro network, any minor upgrades on the line are worth it. Not saying duplicating the whole line like other people stuck in fantasy land. Small upgrades like duplicating to Eltham and realigning track and an extra passing loop at Wattle Glen would increase the usage of the line, since you can run services much more quickly and reliable. Duplicating past Eltham would be silly since it is still rural, but making the track straight means trains can go quickly (more capacity) and an extra passing loop at Wattle Glen means that more services can run back and forth at the Hurstbridge terminus.
James974
With the existing passing loop at Diamond Creek (only 8 min from Hurstbridge even without splashing money around to "straighten" tracks and save perhaps a minute), you could run a 20min service to Hurstbridge all day, everyday, with trains passing at Greensborough, Eltham and Diamond Creek.
Much like they already do in part during evening peak.

However, given it's operationally possible at the moment and yet doesn't happen suggests that the powers that be see the level of patronage as not justifying the improved service.  And I tend to agree with them Laughing
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Yes, the mythical timber structure they all call The Eltham Trestle bridge
"Dangersdan707"
it may well be legendary, but it most certainly is not mythical.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

Yes, the mythical timber structure they all call The Eltham Trestle bridge
it may well be legendary, but it most certainly is not mythical.
Valvegear
I would go with "old" rather than legendary or mythical.

Gunzels often think the first two mean the same thing, and are also often guilty of creating some of the latter as well.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
For many years Eltham remained in a time warp, with its timber trestle bridge, clickety clack track and manual signalling.  At times I thought that VR/Connex/Metro was keeping it that way on purpose, as a kind of operating museum, but the modern world caught up eventually.  On Eltham station there is now a small display of what the old interlocking frame and staff machines were like, worth a look.

As for the bridge - many years ago, back in the 1970s, the VR put up a proposal to remove the bridge and replace it with a culvert, similar to one of the bridges near Diamond Creek.  The townspeople erupted with howls of protest, and a public meeting was called for the VR to put their case.  The result was an overwhelming motion to prevent any such work, by whatever means, and the VR backed off and did nothing further.  Don't know if the locals would feel the same way today.  The bridge, although of historical interest and nice to look at, is an anachronism in a 21st century railway, is speed limited, and no doubt requires regular maintenance.  In a way, it's unfortunate that it didn't burn down in the 1969 (Ithink?) fires which destroyed the wooden bridges near Diamond Creek, because those bridges were then replaced with something better.  

If/when duplication to Eltham occurs, the likely result would be to end the duplication just short of the bridge.  Although not ideal, this would still provide extra capacity between Eltham and Greensborough.  Other options would be to build a new bridge alongside the existing one, similar to Merri Creek, or (less likely) to build two new bridges or a new double track one, on a slightly different alignment, then pension off the old one and give it to the local Council as part of a walking/cycling track.  If no longer in active service for trains, it could last for a long time with minimal maintenance and still retain its characteristic appearance.
  Raleigh98 Beginner

In addition, the junction at Clifton Hill needs to be grade separated to increase reliability. I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.
railblogger
I reckon that renovation works for the clifton hill junction could possibly be done in conjunction with removing the notorious Rushall bend, with a new alignment for the south morang line through there. I agree with your the Eltham North realignment as well.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: North Haverbrook; where the monorail is king!
In addition, the junction at Clifton Hill needs to be grade separated to increase reliability. I would also realign the line north of Eltham to allow for higher speeds.
I reckon that renovation works for the clifton hill junction could possibly be done in conjunction with removing the notorious Rushall bend, with a new alignment for the south morang line through there. I agree with your the Eltham North realignment as well.
Raleigh98
The only way to properly remove the Rushall Curve is to put in a tunnel between Merri and Clifton Hill, with an underground interchange at the latter. At that point, you may as well spend the extra few billion and build the Melbourne Metro 2 tunnel.

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