Clyde extension should not wait 10-15 years to get built

 
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Hopefully this would mean Labor would actually fast-track plans for Clyde rail. They have been slow to address this. It's like Mernda rail announcements back in 2014.
James974

Would also be expecting a similar announcement?

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  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Worth popping in the election thread, too. That's arguably the first "real" PT promise from Guy.

Done.

This is a real promise and does not constitute a study as appears already costed.

What is the situation with stabling on the Cranbourne/clyde line?

Is this done at Dandenong?
x31
Stabling facilities are provided at Cranbourne for 6 trains, the rest would come from Dandenong.
  LeroyW Station Master

Location: Awaiting Mernda Rail
Hopefully this would mean Labor would actually fast-track plans for Clyde rail. They have been slow to address this. It's like Mernda rail announcements back in 2014.
James974
Perhaps one difference is the organised and long-running grass roots lobbying campaign to get Mernda built - first campaigning for the South Morang extension and then once that was funded, moving both major parties from a position of 'no plan for Mernda' to 'Mernda by 2030' to 'Mernda by next election'... in the space of 5 years.

I don't think there's anything quite like it for Clyde but getting one party to commit to something gets you half way there.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
This will require at least 4 (former) level crossings to be eliminated, all track between Dandenong and Cranbourne to be duplicated and also new stabling facilities at Clyde.

More importantly, it will increase the demand for services on the Cranbourne line. It just goes to highlight  how much the Caulfield - Dandenong corridor needs to be amplified to 4 tracks. What a shame the recent major works on the Caulfield - Dandenong line didn't include this.

The sad truth is it's an election promise, and like most of them, it is good on the surface, but the reality is that it just proves that both parties are massively disconnected with what is actually required to serve the outer suburbs of Melbourne with the public transport they sorely need.

Matthew Guy has spent the last 3 years bitching about Skyrail, rather than being a constructive opposition leader and pointing out the missed opportunities of not getting the most out of the Skyrail project.
  drunkill Locomotive Fireman

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Rail under road, what happens to the stabling access at Cranbourne station if the rail line is sunk and a new cranborune station is build in a trench? Give up on that pretty new and expensive stabling yard and make a new one out in clyde for the HCMTs?

Also, this does not include duplication of track between Dandenong and Cranbourne so probably no service increase. Just point scoring in my eyes.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Rail under road, what happens to the stabling access at Cranbourne station if the rail line is sunk and a new cranborune station is build in a trench? Give up on that pretty new and expensive stabling yard and make a new one out in clyde for the HCMTs?

Also, this does not include duplication of track between Dandenong and Cranbourne so probably no service increase. Just point scoring in my eyes.
drunkill
Yep move the Cranbourne stabling yards to a proper facility at Clyde.
  steve195 Train Controller

Does this promise include duplication all the way from Dandenong?
  drunkill Locomotive Fireman

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Does this promise include duplication all the way from Dandenong?
steve195
No.

Only a dual track line after Cranbourne station on the new extension. Duplication works would (in this liberal plan) take place 5-7 years later and no doubt require shutdowns along the line to do those works.

So ya know, an election promise. If you buy into those.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Train Controller

Only a dual track line after Cranbourne station on the new extension. Duplication works would (in this liberal plan) take place 5-7 years later and no doubt require shutdowns along the line to do those works.


drunkill
That is just completely beyond the pale. Here I was thinking "finally, there might be a reasonable alternative for the Transport vote this November" and then I read this.

What numnut builds a double track railway at the end of a single track spur line? Oh, that's right, the same numnut who is somehow going to extend broad gauge services along a standard gauge track.

Good grief.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Has that section of duplication of the Cranbourne line between the junction and Greens Road been commissioned yet ?

If not what's the hold up ? signaling ?
  drunkill Locomotive Fireman

Location: Melbourne, Australia
One thing that should happen when duplication is finally done, by whichever government, is to upgrade the linespeed to a 130kph rating which is the top speed of the HCMTs.

Vicsig says the dandenong-cranbourne section max speed is currently 115kph so it shouldn't be too hard to increase it between Dandenong and Lyndhurst-Merinda Park where trains would be able to hit those speeds easily.
  James974 Deputy Commissioner

Well I am hoping Labor would probably announce a better plan that would mean duplicating and extending the line to Clyde at the same time than doing them at different times. LNP plan is still underdeveloped and silly. He wants to create 55 road underpass, create a 30 billion dollar motorway but doesn't spend that little extra to probably upgrade the Cranbourne line at the same time as extending it. Mind you 30 billion dollars could easily quadruplicate the Dandenong line and electrify and upgrade many more rail lines.
  reubstar6 Junior Train Controller

Yes you could easily have the fully fledged Metro 2 and Doncaster Rail with money still left over with all of that!
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Matthew Guy seems hell bent on road projects which will just add to the pollution and provide very little benefit once the traffic gridlocks once again.    I really think it would have been better to run double track to Clyde and continue single track electrification to Koo Wee Rup allowing for more housing around that area.  Feedback?
  justarider Station Staff

A track all the way to Koo Wee Rup would be a step way too far for Mr Guy to swallow.

However, the Clyde station could need an extension called CLYDE EAST. Located approx the corner of Station st and C421.

Lets campaign for the new line to Clyde East.

cheers
John
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
A track all the way to Koo Wee Rup would be a step way too far for Mr Guy to swallow.

However, the Clyde station could need an extension called CLYDE EAST. Located approx the corner of Station st and C421.

Lets campaign for the new line to Clyde East.

cheers
John
justarider

Hi John,

Thanks for the feedback.  Koo Wee Rup made more sense to me as it is a natural connection point for the BASS Shire for bus interconnects. Tooradin would also benefit.
  James974 Deputy Commissioner

Bevans, as much as it would be nice to have the rail line past Clyde. The existing single track needs upgrading first. Also anything past Clyde with a single track isn't likely gonna be worth it. You would need to put a business case for it and you'd find out that it wouldn't be worth the extra spending.

Wouldn't it be better that money was set aside improving the existing coach service, and put forward planning for electrifying the Melton/Wyndham corridors?
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
I really detest the half-arsed way Matthew Guy seems to be going about his Public transport policies.

He just keeps reminding us of the terrible job they did the last time they were running the state.

I'm not saying Daniel Andrews is brilliant by the way, just that every public transport policy coming from Matthew Guy seems to be massively underdone.
  Crossover Junior Train Controller

Location: St. Albans Victoria
I really detest the half-arsed way Matthew Guy seems to be going about his Public transport policies.

He just keeps reminding us of the terrible job they did the last time they were running the state.

I'm not saying Daniel Andrews is brilliant by the way, just that every public transport policy coming from Matthew Guy seems to be massively underdone.
Gman_86
The Libs have NO IDEA about proper transport planning .  Labor has made some mistakes and perhaps not built projects to their full potential but at least they follow a coherent plan , not a hotchpotch like the libs seem to do !
  bramt Deputy Commissioner

Rail under road, what happens to the stabling access at Cranbourne station if the rail line is sunk and a new cranborune station is build in a trench? Give up on that pretty new and expensive stabling yard and make a new one out in clyde for the HCMTs?

drunkill
Not necessarily, when the Epping line was extended under Cooper St, the existing maintenance & stabling was unaffected (in fact, stabling was extended over the top of the former station building). Just build a retaining wall in between the ground-level stabling, and the rail-under dive.
  TOQ-1 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Power Trainger
The Urban growth boundary currently ends at Cranbourne at or about Berwick-Cranbourne Road. The extension to Clyde would be only that long to meet the boundary. It is under investigation to be extended though, and it seems like there are already developments going up that are outside the existing limits. I would imagine that by extending to Clyde, the government could make it official that the boundary could be extended as there is more access to PT in the area.

The Urban Growth boundary in the SE Suburbs Map

With it being Liberal Party policy to release a lot more land in the outer suburbs for development, I can see that happening. A short extension, to justify the existing housing, then a massive expansion of the suburbs because the last one was so successful, with no actual consideration to how people need or want to travel.
  drunkill Locomotive Fireman

Location: Melbourne, Australia
If anything the line should swing north at clyde and join up with Pakenham to service all the infill housing in the next 10 years between the two.

Then in 15 years when the third airport at monomeith is built you can re-open the line from clyde to kooweerup, which is swampland so no housing.
  justarider Station Staff

A loop from Clyde to Officer would need to be reserved now.
Most of the land in that corridor is already spoken for, and probably have to pay developer prices.

As for Koo Wee Rup. Its a bit harsh calling it swamp. Been to land sales in Clyde North ? (aka Berwick Waters)
KWR is picturesque waterviews with abundant lakes and nearby sandy beaches. The brouchers for Clyde East will be out in the next year or so.

cheers
John
  slowcoach Locomotive Fireman

I'd be better off removing the bottlenecks between Caulfield and Dandenong before adding an extra track from Dandenong to Cranbourne and beyond. I'd also consider removing the Webster St level crossing and upgrading Dandenong station by adding a 4th platform. Then preserve space for 2 extra tracks between Dandenong and Oakleigh but I'm unsure whether only premium stations or all stations get 2 extra platforms. Quadriplicating the Caufield-Dandenong corridor is another engineering, economical and political challenge in of itself.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Trapped in a meeting with Rhonda and Karsten
As for Koo Wee Rup. Its a bit harsh calling it swamp. Been to land sales in Clyde North ? (aka Berwick Waters)
KWR is picturesque waterviews with abundant lakes and nearby sandy beaches. The brouchers for Clyde East will be out in the next year or so.
justarider
Fine, will 'agriculturally oriented wetlands' suffice? I can't tell what smells worse around that part of the world, the asparagus or the bulldust sprinkled through the development brochures...

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