It's the economy, stupid!

 
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Blah blah blah - you're so right wing - blah blah blah - you don't have a balanced opinion - blah blah blah.

You even got 2GB and Sky in there.
"don_dunstan"
The standard Don response; ignore the issue, put up no evidence, and write tripe. See Don; there are others who disagree with you as well.

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  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Blah blah blah - you're so right wing - blah blah blah - you don't have a balanced opinion - blah blah blah.

You even got 2GB and Sky in there.
The standard Don response; ignore the issue, put up no evidence, and write tripe. See Don; there are others who disagree with you as well.
Valvegear
Nah generally just you.

I wasn't having a go at the ABC, I was saying that they're usually a bit more sympathetic with the CCP than others and yet they got banned. And you managed to turn that into something else altogether like it was an attack on the ABC. I wasn't saying anything about the ABC on that occasion.

See why I can't take your sniping seriously? You don't even know what it is you're upset about.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Founding member of Pink Floyd Roger Waters compares the neoliberal doctine to Orwellianism saying that it keeps people asleep (Reuters);

"...Because they’re the victims of the neoliberalism that Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher brought to the world,” Waters said.

Neoliberalism’s pervasiveness through Western culture and politics, in Waters’ view, has left many people with the inability to see and accept anything critical of the mainstream narrative.

“Part of the way it works is to anaesthetise people and almost make it uncomfortable for people to see anything real.”

For Waters the root of this antipathy, in the US at least, lies in part from its poorly funded public education system. In Waters’ view the reason for this lies in the political establishment’s desire to keep an ignorant and compliant population.

“They want to keep the electorate ignorant, and mindless, and unthinking, and malleable, and pliable, and very open to the use of consumerism and propaganda to keep them under control, to maintain the Orwellian notion of the sheep and whatever.”

Fair point Roger - I can respect him for at least not prostituting his brand all over the shop unlike others.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
See why I can't take your sniping seriously? You don't even know what it is you're upset about.
"don_dunstan"
Geez Don, I'm not upset - just pointing out a pertinent fact. Others disagree with you and you post a stupid "blah, blah . . ." reply. No attempt to address the issue; as usual.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Blah blah blah - you're so right wing - blah blah blah - you don't have a balanced opinion - blah blah blah.

You even got 2GB and Sky in there.
The standard Don response; ignore the issue, put up no evidence, and write tripe. See Don; there are others who disagree with you as well.
Nah generally just you.

I wasn't having a go at the ABC, I was saying that they're usually a bit more sympathetic with the CCP than others and yet they got banned. And you managed to turn that into something else altogether like it was an attack on the ABC. I wasn't saying anything about the ABC on that occasion.

See why I can't take your sniping seriously? You don't even know what it is you're upset about.
don_dunstan
Back peddling again. A few posts ago it was the "communist ABC".

You obviously have your list of villains that you're obsessed with. On any given day we can expect a lengthy rant, often simplistic, mostly naïve, and completely biased.

Call it for what it is and that’s what you get back.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Back peddling again. A few posts ago it was the "communist ABC".
Groundrelay
Because it brings the old time Labor party salwarts out of the woodwork to defend it - and presto!
You obviously have your list of villains that you're obsessed with. On any given day we can expect a lengthy rant, often simplistic, mostly naïve, and completely biased. Call it for what it is and that’s what you get back
Groundrelay
Again, it brings the old time commies out of the wood-work - like you for example.

"Completely biased" - LOL, I didn't know I was supposed to be presenting some kind of a balanced and informative news service for your sensitive little eyes, in future I'll have to put in some token references to how much I love endangered parrot-mincing wind-towers or how the Labor Party is really wonderful. I'm so sorry if my simplistic rants offend - you and all the other true believers must be right scandalised every time you read my posts.

Good.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Groundrelay, you'd better come and join me in the Unbelievers' Corner. Don doesn't like people like us who want sensible answers when we query what he says.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Groundrelay, you'd better come and join me in the Unbelievers' Corner. Don doesn't like people like us who want sensible answers when we query what he says.
Valvegear
Poor you! But actually it's the "True Believers" corner; you sincerely believe in the Labor Party along with the fairies in the garden and the goblins down the well...
  Radioman Chief Train Controller

Hello All,

hey fellas, this is supposed to be an exchange of ideas and commentary, which , by definition is not an unbiased series of comments.

Realistically, there is no such thing as "unbiased", that is due to all of us having some sort of bias , acknowledged or otherwise , and to the lunatic fringe, everything else is biased.

The best that you can hope for is that the various sides of the debate a reported, and even this is a big ask.

Regards, Radioman.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Hello All,

hey fellas, this is supposed to be an exchange of ideas and commentary, which , by definition is not an unbiased series of comments.

Realistically, there is no such thing as "unbiased", that is due to all of us having some sort of bias , acknowledged or otherwise , and to the lunatic fringe, everything else is biased.

The best that you can hope for is that the various sides of the debate a reported, and even this is a big ask.

Regards, Radioman.
Radioman
Hey Radioman, they love being here - I give them a reason to exist on this board. And Valvegear in particular, I seem to provide lots of fodder for him because of my special hatred of the Armarni clad class traitors at the so-called Australian Labor Party; for some reason he seems to think its really unfair that I always pick on the party of aspiring Slater & Gordon lawyers and p*ss weak ex-union organisers who've never been near a factory floor in their lives. And they're all in it to make cushy jobs on boards or as lobbyists after politics - look at the rank hypocrisy of Mark Arbib working for Crown Casinos and Martin Ferguson going in to bat for the mining industry.

I'm not saying the Liberals aren't worse - they are. But somehow because it's the Labor Party they seem to have a golden halo around like while they're screwing the people they're supposed to represent - like Hawkie apparently had. The number of people you meet who still eulogise that arsehat; he was the enemy of the working class numero uno along with Keating.

Anyway... end of biased rant.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Anyway... end of biased rant.
"don_dunstan"
Actually, end of biased and inaccurate rant.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Regards, Radioman.
Radioman
Incidentally Radioman - just a guess but do you know anything about vintage radios? I'm looking to restore an old console to working order and I thought I'd ask.
Actually, end of biased and inaccurate rant.
Valvegear
No, completely accurate. That narcissistic suck-hole Hawke, how could anyone think what they did was good. All they've done is replace real jobs and real independence with welfare, un-affordable housing and mass-immigration.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
No, completely accurate. That narcissistic suck-hole Hawke, how could anyone think what they did was good. All they've done is replace real jobs and real independence with welfare, un-affordable housing and mass-immigration.
"don_dunstan"
Hopefully, one day you'll wake up.
You have variously accused me of:
(a) being an ALP lover/supporter/ voter.
(b) drawing a pension whilst still working.
(c) being a commie, et al.
All are completely wrong.

Why you cannot understand the reason I post as I do completely baffles me.
There is one recurring point, and one only.

IT IS YOUR CONTINUED REFUSAL TO BACK UP STATEMENTS WITH SOURCES, FACTS OR EVIDENCE.

That is the sole reason I post to you as I do.

Anything else which you care to dream up is a red herring.
You claim that I can't handle dissent - I'm the one who started the dissent, and I can handle it well thank you.

Think about it, and try debating with proper methodology. You'll gain a lot more respect if you do.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Hopefully, one day you'll wake up.
You have variously accused me of:
(a) being an ALP lover/supporter/ voter.
(b) drawing a pension whilst still working.
(c) being a commie, et al.
All are completely wrong.

Why you cannot understand the reason I post as I do completely baffles me.
There is one recurring point, and one only.

IT IS YOUR CONTINUED REFUSAL TO BACK UP STATEMENTS WITH SOURCES, FACTS OR EVIDENCE.

That is the sole reason I post to you as I do.

Anything else which you care to dream up is a red herring.
You claim that I can't handle dissent - I'm the one who started the dissent, and I can handle it well thank you.

Think about it, and try debating with proper methodology. You'll gain a lot more respect if you do.
Valvegear
Don't think I've ever accused you of drawing a pension while working - all I've ever said is that I know lots of people who draw Centrelink aged pension while stashing their assets cleverly. I know that you are still working, you've mentioned this before. My late grandfather worked as a cleaner and tea-break caterer at a local panel-beaters in his retirement, it really bought a lot of joy to him and he liked the cash. Nothing wrong with working in retirement.

Anyway... what evidence do I need of the Labor Party's complete descent into abject betrayal any further than Hawke and Keating's retirements lobbying for anyone and everyone who would pay them including Chinese Communist Party operatives. What a shock that the ALP was faster to embrace so-called "free trade" agreements with a country with no rule of law and no justice whatsoever - just like they themselves want to inflict on the Australian people.

Chew on them potatoes.
  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
Incidentally Radioman - just a guess but do you know anything about vintage radios? I'm looking to restore an old console to working order and I thought I'd ask.
don_dunstan
My father inlaw is a vintage radio repairer, especially Ham Radio sets (for extra cash in his early retirement). Anything with a valve, he can likely fix it. He's more into the actual electronics repairs, than actual cabinet or box it may come in.

If this is what you are after PM me, I'll send you his email address which is ironically his 5 digit HAM radio call sign (apparently 5 is special as most are 6).
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
, it brings the old time commies out of the wood-work - like you for example.
don_dunstan
And FU too!

Whilst you’re at it check out the rationale behind Godwin’s Law because it’s obvious you cannot debate without resorting to emotive branding. I could counter that but your sort seem to wear it as a badge of honour these days Razz

As for being labelled a communist you’re wrong as usual and now just being an idiot.

Apparently I’m one of those 'aspirationals'. I do quite well under capitalism, even have a share portfolio and OK super. However I grew up on struggle street and in spite of seeing plenty of bludgers, I do think the more successful we are the more we can give back. It’s to do with empathy I believe.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Incidentally Radioman - just a guess but do you know anything about vintage radios? I'm looking to restore an old console to working order and I thought I'd ask.
My father inlaw is a vintage radio repairer, especially Ham Radio sets (for extra cash in his early retirement). Anything with a valve, he can likely fix it. He's more into the actual electronics repairs, than actual cabinet or box it may come in.

If this is what you are after PM me, I'll send you his email address which is ironically his 5 digit HAM radio call sign (apparently 5 is special as most are 6).
RTT_Rules
Thanks RTT, but the issue is that it's a large Kriesler console radio and I'd physically need to take it to someone who is an expert on valve radios; there are several experts in Melbourne I probably could have taken it to but I need to get off my ar*e and find someone in SA who could look at it. Your father-in-law may well know of enthusiasts in the southern states who do this sort of work so do mention to him the next time you chat.

It's in incredibly good condition considering age: Made in Sydney in 1937 complete with short-wave bands and it probably cost more than a car when new. The case is spectacular, high art deco - I think as a working piece it would probably be worth hanging on to but at the moment it's just a nice ornament.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Whilst you’re at it check out the rationale behind Godwin’s Law because it’s obvious you cannot debate without resorting to emotive branding. I could counter that but your sort seem to wear it as a badge of honour these days Razz
Groundrelay
I'm not emotive branding, it's true to say that many old Labor Party stalwarts had a lot in common with communist ideology.
As for being labelled a communist you’re wrong as usual and now just being an idiot.
Groundrelay
Spoken like a true communist in denial.
Apparently I’m one of those 'aspirationals'. I do quite well under capitalism, even have a share portfolio and OK super. However I grew up on struggle street and in spite of seeing plenty of bludgers, I do think the more successful we are the more we can give back. It’s to do with empathy I believe.
Groundrelay
The richer you get the less generous you are - there's been plenty of studies to suggest that poor people are the most generous donors to charity.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Spoken like a true communist in denial.
"don_dunstan"
Nonsense. A true communist wouldn't deny it.

The richer you get the less generous you are -
"don_dunstan"
Another of your wild accusations without a shred of evidence to back it up.

there's been plenty of studies to suggest that poor people are the most generous donors to charity.
"don-dunstan"
OK; I'll be nice to you. We don't want "plenty", just quote us one.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Nonsense. A true communist wouldn't deny it.
Valvegear
Yes they will - you lived through the McCathyist era, you should know that a good communist can also be a Fabian Socialist, in which case they're definitely hiding their true intentions.
Another of your wild accusations without a shred of evidence to back it up.
Valvegear
It is an established fact in psychology as discussed further here. Why do you think those charity chuggers congregate in poor neighbourhoods? It's because rich people don't give to charity like the poor do.
OK; I'll be nice to you. We don't want "plenty", just quote us one.
Valvegear
I can give you even more if you want.

It would be nice if you apologised to me sometime for your flying off the handle - I did exactly as you requested after all. Not that I'd expect you to ever admit that you were wrong, but it would be a nice gesture.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
It would be nice if you apologised to me sometime for your flying off the handle - I did exactly as you requested after all. Not that I'd expect you to ever admit that you were wrong, but it would be a nice gesture.
"don_dunstan"
I wish I knew what on earth you're talking about. "Flying off the handle"? Where?  Quote, and I mean quote, an example.

Admit that I'm wrong? You accused Groundrelay and you want an apology when I call you out? Don't deny it, your comment was in the second person singular and I quote verbatim, " The richer you get the less generous you are." That is an accusation.

You have a marvellous opinion of your own righteousness if you believe that disagreeing with you means I'm wrong. I'm very sorry that I don't think you're infallible.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
I wish I knew what on earth you're talking about. "Flying off the handle"? Where?  Quote, and I mean quote, an example.
Valvegear
Here you are flying off the handle:
Another of your wild accusations without a shred of evidence to back it up.
Valvegear
You're just obsessed with me - admit it.
You have a marvellous opinion of your own righteousness if you believe that disagreeing with you means I'm wrong. I'm very sorry that I don't think you're infallible.
Valvegear
Yeah but I found scientific evidence of what I was talking about - end of story. And there's heaps more out there.

You two just need to come to the realisation that if I say something not to question it because I'm automatically right... doesn't matter whether I find evidence of it on the spot or not; I'm almost always right and you two are almost always wrong.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
You two just need to come to the realisation that if I say something not to question it because I'm automatically right... doesn't matter whether I find evidence of it on the spot or not; I'm almost always right and you two are almost always wrong.
don_dunstan
Ah! . .  an explanation at last. Delusions of Grandeur. Now I can ignore you in peace, knowing that you can't help yourself. . . . very sad.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
You two just need to come to the realisation that if I say something not to question it because I'm automatically right... doesn't matter whether I find evidence of it on the spot or not; I'm almost always right and you two are almost always wrong.
Ah! . .  an explanation at last. Delusions of Grandeur. Now I can ignore you in peace, knowing that you can't help yourself. . . . very sad.
Valvegear
Well you demanded that I give you evidence - and I did. There's lots of evidence that rich people aren't as generous with charity as poor people, indeed, lots of scientific as well as anecdotal evidence. They wouldn't exactly be rich people if they were generous, would they. And by the way, delusions of grandeur would be where I'm of the belief that I'm Jesus Christ or Napoleon or someone... being right is just being right.
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

You two just need to come to the realisation that if I say something not to question it because I'm automatically right... doesn't matter whether I find evidence of it on the spot or not; I'm almost always right and you two are almost always wrong.
Ah! . .  an explanation at last. Delusions of Grandeur. Now I can ignore you in peace, knowing that you can't help yourself. . . . very sad.
Well you demanded that I give you evidence - and I did. There's lots of evidence that rich people aren't as generous with charity as poor people, indeed, lots of scientific as well as anecdotal evidence. They wouldn't exactly be rich people if they were generous, would they. And by the way, delusions of grandeur would be where I'm of the belief that I'm Jesus Christ or Napoleon or someone... being right is just being right.
don_dunstan
You're still just providing your opinion without providing any actual data/facts to back up your opinion. In fact the ultra rich do donate huge amounts to various causes that have a huge impact on life in poor countries. The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation is just one example that comes to mind. A quick Google search indicates that 'Gates’ recent donation brings his total number of gifts to charitable donations to $50 billion.' Too much hyperbole on your part Don.

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