Australind train off the rails

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 29 Apr 2019 20:54
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Services temporarily suspended.

What would you replace the service with in terms of rolling stock?

Australind train off the rails

Sponsored advertisement

  RTT_Rules Dr Beeching

Location: Dubai UAE
If the sparks were still coming from EDI, I'd say just buy more, remove the panos and install a gensets under the floor of A and B cars.
  DBclass Chief Commissioner

Location: Western Australia
Hire some stock from HVR.


$30M for a twice a day service that bleeds money?
  62440 Chief Commissioner

I used to be a regular user until they stopped guaranteeing the connections at Bunbury. After that I went to Mandurah and caught the SW coach to Duns. The Westrail bus had a long tea break just after it left Mandurah. When I used the Australind after the timetable change, 'er indoors had to drive from Duns to pick me up. Very annoying when the bus connected and she hadn't needed to drive.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Hire some stock from HVR.


$30M for a twice a day service that bleeds money?
DBclass

How is this relevant as it is public transport and is not designed to make money.
  witzendoz Junior Train Controller

Location: Fremantle
Hire some stock from HVR.


$30M for a twice a day service that bleeds money?
DBclass
Maybe it wouldn't if it was run properly, reliable and with connections as said.

The biggest problem it seems is that it does not actually go to Bunbury,  the attraction of trains is that they go into the city or town that is the destination.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Hire some stock from HVR.

$30M for a twice a day service that bleeds money?
DBclass

It's distressing to know that many of our friends on the other side of the country also discriminate against the operation of regional rail services.

Mike.
  witzendoz Junior Train Controller

Location: Fremantle
Hire some stock from HVR.

$30M for a twice a day service that bleeds money?

It's distressing to know that many of our friends on the other side of the country also discriminate against the operation of regional rail services.

Mike.
The Vinelander
I know, governments run it down until nobody can use it, then claim that no one is using it as an excuse to close it down.
  62440 Chief Commissioner

I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there. Another was running trains to Bridgetown and Manjimup which, I admit, would not register on any economic test. However, we looked at Busselton, which had protected corridor up to the old rail station building in its new location and the population to justify a service, again with a bus station next door. And a council that wanted it. Extending to Dunsborough was a challenge and to Margaret River was in the realms of fantasy.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there.
62440
Where Is the corridor between the current Bunbury rail passenger terminal and the old railway station (now the Visitor Information Centre) ?

You can see on Google Maps where the former corridor ran, with the patchwork of buildings filling up the former right of way, Blair Street looks like It has been widened.

One other plan that has been floated around was to build a new station near the Dolphin Discovery Centre, going via the Port area, but this location has It's disadvantages.
  DBclass Chief Commissioner

Location: Western Australia
Bunbury to Perth is 2hrs in a car, 2.5 by train. For a family it costs a fortune, and always will. I am pro rail, but the PTA report shows buses do a better job cheaper. In its current form I would be surprised if new rail cars alone will do anything to make it more attractive. I do know a number of people who drive to Mandurah and catch the EMU’s, with departures every 15 mins and a quick trip to the city why not. The Australind will not go more then 115kph, and will always be restricted by other traffic which is half its reason for not arriving on time. Patronage on the Australind based on the number of cars has been going down for years.

Would moving the train station back into town actually make any difference? It can’t happen now anyway everything is built up.

I enjoy riding the train it’s a great experience. But maybe 29 out of 30 times I go to Perth I drive up, and I am not alone on that, and I don’t see that changing for a long time.
  M636C Minister for Railways

The service could be replaced by dual mode railcars that could run on the Mandurah line, swapping to the freight line to Mundijong using a new link where it passes under the Mandurah line between Wellard and Rockingham stations.

This would give a faster overall time between the Perth CBD and Bunbury with a stop at Kwinana and could allow a through service up to Joondalup for example.

Peter
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there. Another was running trains to Bridgetown and Manjimup which, I admit, would not register on any economic test. However, we looked at Busselton, which had protected corridor up to the old rail station building in its new location and the population to justify a service, again with a bus station next door. And a council that wanted it. Extending to Dunsborough was a challenge and to Margaret River was in the realms of fantasy.
62440

Sorry if I have missed it but why was the railway station which I recall being downtown disconnected from the network?
  duttonbay Minister for Railways

I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there. Another was running trains to Bridgetown and Manjimup which, I admit, would not register on any economic test. However, we looked at Busselton, which had protected corridor up to the old rail station building in its new location and the population to justify a service, again with a bus station next door. And a council that wanted it. Extending to Dunsborough was a challenge and to Margaret River was in the realms of fantasy.

Sorry if I have missed it but why was the railway station which I recall being downtown disconnected from the network?
bevans
The vast amount of space occupied by the railway was no longer needed, as no freight ran into the Bunbury yard any more, so it was sold or converted to public space. Same as Geraldton (although there were no passenger trains there when that was closed), Wodonga, Newcastle and a number of places up the coast of Qld.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Rail freight does use Bunbury with more trains planned to join those already running and the passenger services was using Bunbury.  More Australian mismanagement more than anything else.
  duttonbay Minister for Railways

Rail freight does use Bunbury with more trains planned to join those already running and the passenger services was using Bunbury.  More Australian mismanagement more than anything else.
x31
Freight does indeed use Bunbury, but no longer uses the yard. Without the plethora of branchlines feeding into Bunbury the large yard is not required; with diesel locos the large roundhouse is not required; with block trains there is no need for remarshalling. Freight trains run directly to the port bypassing the station. While I guess they could have kept the station with just a single line, the decision was taken to relocate. I'm not going to argue whether that's sensible - all I was doing was answering bevans' question. Describing what happened.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Bunbury to Perth is 2hrs in a car, 2.5 by train. For a family it costs a fortune, and always will. I am pro rail, but the PTA report shows buses do a better job cheaper. In its current form I would be surprised if new rail cars alone will do anything to make it more attractive. I do know a number of people who drive to Mandurah and catch the EMU’s, with departures every 15 mins and a quick trip to the city why not. The Australind will not go more then 115kph, and will always be restricted by other traffic which is half its reason for not arriving on time. Patronage on the Australind based on the number of cars has been going down for years.

Would moving the train station back into town actually make any difference? It can’t happen now anyway everything is built up.

I enjoy riding the train it’s a great experience. But maybe 29 out of 30 times I go to Perth I drive up, and I am not alone on that, and I don’t see that changing for a long time.
DBclass
I traveled on the Australind about 18 Months ago, the service seemed like a real locals train with noticeable turnover of passengers throughout the journey, as the train stopped at little wayside stations.

At one minor station (Waroona I think) the train manager must of though there was no customers for the train to stop for, until a passenger on board alerted the manager (that the train had missed their stop) so the train came to a stop than backed up to the nearest level crossing, where the passenger climbed down from the train.  

Harvey seemed to be the busiest Intermediate Station.

I would think passenger numbers would be a lot higher If there were unreserved carriages as part of the train, but that doesn't seen the way TransWA likes to run things.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Slightly related but proposals for more freight into Bunbury https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/kemerton-rail-line-is-critical-says-cr-cook
  DBclass Chief Commissioner

Location: Western Australia
That spur into Kemerton has been on the cards forever, I hope it goes through this time.

Of note Qube are now running at least one triple road train into Bunbury.
  djukinX1016 Deputy Commissioner

Just to correct a few of the statements being made Bunbury Yard was still very much in use the reason it was relocated to Picton was so the foreshore areas could be opened up for development and public access. Roads were built along with the Marlston Hill development. I have photos of Bunbury Yard before closure still full of trains etc.

Geraldton was the same the railway effectively cut off the City Centre from the Town beach area and was the key driver for the relocation. Narngulu was constructed in lieu of the facilities in the City Centre along with a new Port access railway, thank goodness this happened cannot imagine how the current 104 wagon trains would have gone getting into the port on the old railway given all the level crossings etc.
Regards
Phil
  Bulbous Assistant Commissioner

I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there. Another was running trains to Bridgetown and Manjimup which, I admit, would not register on any economic test. However, we looked at Busselton, which had protected corridor up to the old rail station building in its new location and the population to justify a service, again with a bus station next door. And a council that wanted it. Extending to Dunsborough was a challenge and to Margaret River was in the realms of fantasy.
62440


Just putting this in perspective in the current climate - The proposed costing to reduce the journey times between Perth and Bunbury to 60 minutes in 2003 dollars was $300-$400 million, with a patronage increase from 12k per annum to 140k per annum expected. The cost for each of the branches from Bunbury (to Manjimup and to Margaret River) in 2003 dollars was $140 million each for new/upgraded track throughout. Required patronage was around 550k per annum per branch to "justify" the cost of the reinstatement.

Given the state of the roads and traffic in the south west (just come back from a week in Margaret River), and the price of the dualling of Bussell Highway, Bussell Highway upgrades, Bunbury outer ring road, upgrades to South West Highway, etc - I would put the original price of the southern branches (and the price of the new fast line) as a bargain that was sorely missed during the mid-2000's.

Note that the figure given in 2007 to reinstate the line to Manjimup was $92 million after the last trains two years beforehand, i would hazard that the decision was about as short-sighted as you can get.

Cheers,

Matt
  witzendoz Junior Train Controller

Location: Fremantle


I would think passenger numbers would be a lot higher If there were unreserved carriages as part of the train, but that doesn't seen the way TransWA likes to run things.
Nightfire

This is the same problem with the Avon link, a friend that moved to Toodyay had to go to Perth at short notice and was going to catch the train, however then found out you can't just catch it you have to book on line 24 hrs ahead, drove to Perth.  They need to make it easy to catch these trains.
  Bulbous Assistant Commissioner



I would think passenger numbers would be a lot higher If there were unreserved carriages as part of the train, but that doesn't seen the way TransWA likes to run things.
This is the same problem with the Avon link, a friend that moved to Toodyay had to go to Perth at short notice and was going to catch the train, however then found out you can't just catch it you have to book on line 24 hrs ahead, drove to Perth.  They need to make it easy to catch these trains.
witzendoz


There were days when I was working in Northam and ran late, and had to get home to Midland. I would call Transwa and let them know I would like to get the late Prospector home that night, only to be told that as I had not given them 24 hours notice of the booking, it would not be possible to secure travel, and they could not guarantee that the train would even stop there. The booking office also noted that they would not contact the train to let them know I would be waiting, as I may not be there when they arrived, costing the service additional money and time for a wasted stop.

The final suggestion from the booking office was to wait at the platform until 8.15pm or so, and when the train came around the curve at Yilgarn Ave, I should wave for them to stop. This worked most of the time (a couple of overshot platform stops and a quick reverse if needed), but the onboard staff then treated you like you had ruined their evening by wanting to use the train.

The PTA personnel still have no idea how to run a train for the benefit of the travelling public.

Cheers,

Matt
  62440 Chief Commissioner

I was involved in looking at options in the SW some years ago. One was looking at extending the existing track the short distance to the former rail station in the centre, next to the bus station. That could have been done at reasonable cost as the corridor was there.
62440
Where Is the corridor between the current Bunbury rail passenger terminal and the old railway station (now the Visitor Information Centre) ?

You can see on Google Maps where the former corridor ran, with the patchwork of buildings filling up the former right of way, Blair Street looks like It has been widened.

One other plan that has been floated around was to build a new station near the Dolphin Discovery Centre, going via the Port area, but this location has It's disadvantages.
"Nightfire"

When I was looking at it, the track was still intact as far as the Dolphin Centre with only a short length missing. The track layout overall was being affected by port developments. We looked at a 90 minute travel time (don't laugh) and then what would be needed for a 60 minute journey (alright, now you can laugh). Extending the Mandurah line from Lakelands along the highway alignment was considered.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
A real lost opportunity to retain the old railway station and platform with track and the first thing you see when you arrive at the station by train is a visitors centre and you spend your day in Bunbury.

Sponsored advertisement

Subscribers: bevans, Nightfire, witzendoz

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.