$2.1 Billion Sunbury Line Upgrade

 
  Lockie91 Train Controller

I thought a new thread would be relevant as this is quite an extensive project announced in today’s budget papers.

Despite what has Ben mentioned it seems the $2.1 billion announced today is not a cost over full from MM1. This project is being rolled out the same as CD9 was. In addition to the MM1 project.

The project is scheduled to be completed mid 2024/25.

It seems the government was hoping that if Bill was elected his $2B promise would fund this package of works and would free up the state government to spend elsewhere.

What stations are on the hit list for upgrades?

-Middle Footscray
-Tottenham
-Albion
-Watergardens ($8 million already announced)

Platform extensions at the majority of stations, some more complicated than others. St Albans and Ginifer already have provisions. I’m not sure which others do.

Reconfigured stabeling at Sunbury to accomodate linger trains? Modified Calder Park?

Hopefully the government will put some meat on the bones before this becomes to foamy.

Sponsored advertisement

  True Believers Chief Commissioner

I thought a new thread would be relevant as this is quite an extensive project announced in today’s budget papers.

Despite what has Ben mentioned it seems the $2.1 billion announced today is not a cost over full from MM1. This project is being rolled out the same as CD9 was. In addition to the MM1 project.

The project is scheduled to be completed mid 2024/25.

It seems the government was hoping that if Bill was elected his $2B promise would fund this package of works and would free up the state government to spend elsewhere.

What stations are on the hit list for upgrades?

-Middle Footscray
-Tottenham
-Albion
-Watergardens ($8 million already announced)

Platform extensions at the majority of stations, some more complicated than others. St Albans and Ginifer already have provisions. I’m not sure which others do.

Reconfigured stabeling at Sunbury to accomodate linger trains? Modified Calder Park?

Hopefully the government will put some meat on the bones before this becomes to foamy.
Lockie91

This wasn't a surprise to me. The last budget seemed to show this was going to happen soon as well on the Melbourne Metro website.

Last budget announcement: https://www.premier.vic.gov.au/upgrading-the-cranbourne-pakenham-and-sunbury-lines/

"undertaking detailed design work to enable new high capacity metro trains to run to Sunbury"

On the Metro website, they showed this upgrade for a while now, showing which stations needing upgrading.
https://metrotunnel.vic.gov.au/construction/upgrades-to-the-rail-network

It's good to hear that this planning work has now gone into the construction stage and not forgotten.

*cough* Rowville tram line *cough* *cough* did everyone seem to forget they announced this last year.
  drunkill Junior Train Controller

Location: Melbourne, Australia
*cough* Rowville tram line *cough* *cough* did everyone seem to forget they announced this last year.
True Believers
Wasn't this quietly shelved when Turnbull said he'd chip in the money to make it heavy rail? if the liberals won the next election.

 Then that stage 1 heavy rail to rowville (mainly to Monash uni) became the suburban rail loop. Which now has less upfront funding and just enough for a business case/detailed design document to then pitch to the public at the next federal and state elections.
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

*cough* Rowville tram line *cough* *cough* did everyone seem to forget they announced this last year.
Wasn't this quietly shelved when Turnbull said he'd chip in the money to make it heavy rail? if the liberals won the next election.

 Then that stage 1 heavy rail to rowville (mainly to Monash uni) became the suburban rail loop. Which now has less upfront funding and just enough for a business case/detailed design document to then pitch to the public at the next federal and state elections.
drunkill
Turnbull did say he would chip the money for heavy rail to Rowville. Only Turnbull announcements that seemed to be continued are the Airport rail link pledge, North East Link funding & Regional Rail Revival. The South Yarra station for Metro Tunnel, heavy rail to Rowville, Baxter rail from Federal Liberals have been quietly been shelved.

Heavy rail to Rowville is planned as a branch off Huntingdale, not from Clayton as per the SRL. The SRL was meant to be complementary to the Rowville tram idea.

To me, it seems like a promise not happening if the funding just doesn't appear at all in the state budget or even a mention on the progress of the project. DA seemed very serious when Labor announced it in the last budget. Even Port Rail Shuttle and the cursed Murray Basin Project gets a mention.

But to be fair, everyone was speculating the E-class tram orders ended in 2016 and funding was going towards only restoring the older trams. Then in September 2018, a late order announced btw budgets of an extra 10 trams.
Also ordering 10 trams per year is pretty slow. When you consider DA can remove about 7 level crossings each year.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
But, but, Greg Chunt told me to my face ‘Only the liberals will extend the line to Baxter’. Waaaah politicians have lied to my face.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Maybe it’s not a “cost overrun” in the strict sense, but the fact is that the Sunbury line is inadequate from a platform length and traction perspective to run HCMTs, so this is a work program with a deadline that has been known for a long time. That’s why I’m very skeptical about it being announced now. It would have been very awkward if we got to 2025 and everything had to turn around at West Footscray.

Anyway, it’s good news. I do hope passive provision has been made for 7 cars at Ginifer and St Albans or that could be very expensive indeed.
  Lockie91 Train Controller

@PIMM

Depends how you slice the pie, $4B of the MM1 money has already been spent and we don't even have a TBM in the ground yet. It is also the way the government has structured the projects. CD9 had a $2B price tag, this was two seperate projects both run by LXRA. The actual removal of LX's and then the rail systems package (signalling and substations) How do you start to split what paid for what? On top of that you have works occurring at Pakenham east which is a seperate project as well. MM1 $10B + CD9 $2B + Sunbury $2B + HCMTS $2B. Be interesting to see what the true cost of MM1 will be!

Bang on the timing, this is one budget line the government had to include, it was just hoping that Bill would pay for it. Financial completion for this project is Q2 2024/25.

I know that Ginifer and St Albans both have provisions for extended platforms. The budget papers state every station will get an upgrade. Its very lite on details. Middle Footscray, Albion and Keilor Plans are prime targets. KP has to be one of the cheapest stations on the network.

Be interesting to see if the Pie includes the long rumoured new station at Calder Park or even the removal of the LX there.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
But, but, Greg Chunt told me to my face ‘Only the liberals will extend the line to Baxter’. Waaaah politicians have lied to my face.
Dangersdan707

Conservative politicians that is...

Mike.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

I know that Ginifer and St Albans both have provisions for extended platforms. The budget papers state every station will get an upgrade. Its very lite on details. Middle Footscray, Albion and Keilor Plans are prime targets. KP has to be one of the cheapest stations on the network.
Lockie91
Have been told today that St Albans and Ginifer are both long enough already, which is good.

Middle Footscray won't be any trouble to lengthen - the fenced off section at the up end is probably long enough - but getting accessibility at the narrow down end could be very troublesome.

I doubt KP will get any substantial improvements out of $2.1b, maybe a new shelter if they're lucky.
  Heihachi_73 Chief Commissioner

Location: Terminating at Ringwood
With the Liberals remaining in power, I was under the assumption that any and all transport-related funds would go towards building the East West Link instead.
  Lockie91 Train Controller

Seems both levels of government have rolled over a little bit and lightened the tone. With Dan happy to take Scomo’s $2B for Geelong, that I imagine will get worked into the Western Rail Plan. Also happy to let the federal government do the heavy lifting on MARL.

During the day election campaign it was as if the feds were picking projects at complete odds with the labor state government so it was seen to be supporting them. With Dan happy to let Bill have the limelight with the 10B promise for the SRL.

Now that Bill is gone, Dan is going to have to get what he is given by the Feds. Even more so now that stamp duty revenue has punched a hole in the budget.
  PikachuSnr Beginner

$2.1 Billion dollars for platform extensions, power upgrades does sound excessive. What does wheelchair boarding platforms mean? Don't the stations have these already. I'd assume wheelchair boarding platforms means the installation of lifts/ramps at stations such as in Keilor Plains etc. I actually wonder if the Sunbury line will undergo a Metro-standard conversion similar to the Bankstown Line in sydney
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

I'm not sure that a Metro style conversion would work given that this line also caters for VLine and freight trains.  

As for the cost - it does seem a bit pricey.  I only hope it includes extending the Parallel RRL for Bendigo trains around Albion Station to just before the decline to Ginifer.  It has to be untangled from Airport link anyway.

I think signalling is one of the biggest cost impositions.
  CraigieburnLineUser Station Staff

Is the signalling upgrade still for conventional signalling and any ideas what they are changing with the signals?
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

I have heard that the initial implementation of CBTC will be West Footscray to Westall with colour light remaining beyond a little while longer. However, it remains a firm plan to eventually convert Watergardens-Dandenong to CBTC. The reason for staging it like this is twofold. First, designing an interface with V/Line and freight – which will continue to use lineside colour lights patched into the CBTC system – is mighty complex and not commonly done. The system being used, Bombardier’s CityFlo 650, has had a rather difficult implementation on Crossrail dealing with different stock and service types. Second, the form of Sunshine junction over the next decade is still very much up in the air and the Metro Tunnel engineers can’t design an interface without knowing what lines will exist and what lines will be using them.

I stress this is all hearsay but it does make a lot of sense.
  Lockie91 Train Controller

$2.1 is not that different from what was spent on the other side of the river on the Dandenong corridor. Difference being a lot of worn was done as part of the LXRP a lot a track, signalling, traction power and station got upgraded as part of the removals. I think there was another $500 million was spent of the HCCU (High Capacity Corridor Upgrade) which was just filling the gaps of what the LXRA didn’t do. PED was another separately funded project that contributed to the over corridor upgrade.

Sunbury Line is not at all the same with the only recently upgraded stations being Ginifer and St Albans. New overhead from Kensington out Sunbury. Completely overhauled signalling system as PIMM mentioned to CBTC. New traction power and substations. In addition the the platforms extensions at every station and reconfigured stabling at Calder Park, Watergardens and Sunbury. It’s a fair bit of work for 2.1 Billion.

I think Daniel Bowen has a pretty good post on his blog about this.
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

The only way it could come to that cost if it included completely rebuilding the stabling yards. Not really many details out there in public at the moment.
  n459L1150 Train Controller

Location: at sunbury on a V/line service into melbourne, waiting for thousands of impatient people to get on
how about a DEDICATED V/LINE PLATFORM????!!!!
  Lockie91 Train Controller

@True Believers
In terms of stabling Calder Park is slated for additional roads. Something like 12 in total. Train wash facility and also light maintenance (Wheel lathe, windows, Grafiti removal) As well as a dedicated track into Watergardens which the turn out was already in place. There was talk about having a road in from Sunbury so trains didn’t have to run shorts to Watergardens just to stable at CP.

Watergardens is simple extension, now that Melton Hwy is gone there is plenty of room. Sunbury is complicated as there is not a lot a space. The stabling roads are already pretty close the the Blue Stone Bridge (Macedon Street). They might be able to squeeze a couple of meters in but not sure how Sunbury will handle 10 car HCMTS.

@N
There will be zero money spent on dedicated V/Line infrastructure. Long term goal is to have these run via the Airport. Can’t see money being spent on platforms and major reconfigured stations for what might only be 10 years.
  justarider Chief Train Controller

Location: Stuck on VR and hoping for better.

@N
There will be zero money spent on dedicated V/Line infrastructure. Long term goal is to have these run via the Airport. Can’t see money being spent on platforms and major reconfigured stations for what might only be 10 years.
Lockie91
sad and probably true.

I have gone cold on any likelihood of Bendigo via the Airport. Definitely all the govt statement about MARL have been pretty clear it's a non-starter.

The big problem going via Airport is that any existing passengers beyond Sunshine (and that includes all the cross bus connects), would have to back track to Sunshine to catch the Bendigo train.
The only solution to that is extending the Metro electric to Clarkefield to rejoin the V/line - and that is plain silly.

However, despite all the waffle, there is still plenty of room for 4 tracks between Sunshine and Sunbury. Just some lateral thinking needed.
None of the intermediate stations (except maybe Watergardens) need a V/line stop, meaning the tracks can go around without too much interference.
St Albans & Ginnifer are a real squeeze now, but could get away with a single track there.
Cost wise probably no different to the Airport idea.

Of course it's just gunzel, but with $2.1B on the table, including some future planning wouldn't go astray.

cheers
John
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

https://metrotunnel.vic.gov.au/rail-projects-victoria/sunbury-line-upgrade
Works notifications confirm the direction in which platforms Footscray–Sunshine will e extended; no real surprises there.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
@justarider It isn't just St Albans and Ginifer that pose a problem. Any new track would block off access to at least one platform at every other station. In addition the space at Watergardens is quite tight.
  justarider Chief Train Controller

Location: Stuck on VR and hoping for better.
@justarider It isn't just St Albans and Ginifer that pose a problem. Any new track would block off access to at least one platform at every other station. In addition the space at Watergardens is quite tight.
railblogger
yes but.

Keilor Plains and Diggers Rest already are missing a platform cross-over. In effect access is already blocked.
As per what is happening on the Ballarat line, a pedestrian overpass is required, that would also cover any additional tracks.

Watergardens and Sunbury aren't as tight as you seem to imagine. They already have 3 tracks, and the existing pedestrian overpasses extend pretty much over where extra track could be.

In all cases, including St Albans and Ginifer, the major space wasters are the carparks.
Pity some of them are brand new, but they do takes up a lot of railway space that can have better use.

Chances of separating V/line and Metro on the Sunbury line are slim, which doesn't mean construction on that corridor should deliberately prevent it. Even the Ginifer and St Albans LX removals still left some wriggle room.

cheers
John
  Lockie91 Train Controller

I don’t foresee any kind of track amplification between Sunshine and Sunbury. With the roll out of HCS the current track pair can handle up to 30TPH. Plenty of room to push three V/Lines into Sunshine and leave tones a capacity for a 10 or even 5 minute service to Watergardens.

And just maybe one day they might go via the airport, maybe even at their top speed of 200km/h
  trainbrain Deputy Commissioner

I don’t foresee any kind of track amplification between Sunshine and Sunbury. With the roll out of HCS the current track pair can handle up to 30TPH. Plenty of room to push three V/Lines into Sunshine and leave tones a capacity for a 10 or even 5 minute service to Watergardens.

And just maybe one day they might go via the airport, maybe even at their top speed of 200km/h
Lockie91
iop speed of 200kmh to the Airport, what rubbish, for such a short distance. A good steady reliable service is what is required.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: