Climate Change Confusion

 
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Finally, someone in the mainstream media acknowledges the reality of the koala population on Kangaroo Island being at pest proportions before the bush-fires - ABC

While the country laments the horrific loss of wildlife due to bushfires, talks are being held on Kangaroo Island to ensure its decimated koala population does not regenerate.

Koalas are a pest on Kangaroo Island — they were introduced in the 1920s in response to population decline across the country's south-east caused by the fur trade.

Starting with 18 disease-free koalas from French Island in Victoria, the population spiralled out of control to an estimated 50,000 by last year, creating unsustainable pressure on the local environment...

...While koalas are a threatened species in many parts of Australia, this is not the case in the Mount Lofty Ranges, the foothills of Adelaide and the southern suburbs, where a "decent, healthy population" of about 150,000 koalas is thriving. But those on Kangaroo Island, which were originally introduced to Flinders Chase National Park, have a very limited habitat.

The Government said this resulted in large areas of eucalyptus trees dying due to over-browsing (consuming all the leaves of a tree so it dies).

They also have a preference for the manna gum, which is already rare on Kangaroo Island and provides critical habitats for another native animals.

Many residents subsequently consider koalas to be a pest.

My understanding was that koalas had killed most of the manna-gums on the island and were eating vegetation that they normally didn't eat on the mainland like pine cones and wattyls. Evolution in action!

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  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Yeah, we always here these BS numbers on how few people are employed in coal/iron ore mining and how little difference it really makes to the economy. It all apparently makes sense and sounds good until, well the commodity prices dive and the country dives towards a recession lead by the likes of Qld and WA.

So lesson for you DB, don't believe the BS numbers saying mining makes a tiny fraction of the workforce.
Fair enough.

As an aside, what will happen to the economy when we get to the stage of most mining operations being fully automated?
DirtyBallast
Maybe don't panic just yet

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2019/09/mining-to-generate-jobless-booms/

I think you'd be surprised on how many mining jobs have been automated in the last 50-60 years. Hell the last horses and donkey's didn't leave the mining sector until the mid 60's. There is probably 10 x the jobs gone, than we have left. However the mining sector is probably 20-30 x bigger than it once was.

You could also say the same about every other industry.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Donors, look what they did to the car industry.
Do you think someone in the private sector lobbied the government to purposely kill the car industry? I'm all ears if you want to spell out the theory. Personally I've always thought that it was government policy since Hawke/Keating's Button Report.

Interesting to think that if the AU$ collapsed below US$0.50 that all of our lovely imported consumer durables would suddenly become un-affordable for the majority. And its entirely possible that we could have a rapid deterioration in the dollar - it would only take the Chinese to start sourcing iron ore elsewhere or our coal exports to halve for a catastrophic fall in the dollar to occur.
don_dunstan
...and we are back to the car industry. To save the debate, the car industry was killed off by a combination of
- changing buying tastes by the Australian population as well as global trend towards SUV and Dual cabs,
- too small a domestic market for stand alone production,
- failure to export what we made that others didn't (ie Commodore, Falcon, Territory) and
- inability to export (economically) global platform models due to Australian workers being some of the highest salaries in the world.
In short what happened in Australia has been replicated in most Developed world economies and preceded by numerous other industries,
time to move on.

If the Aussie dollar hit $0.50, then as happened last time, you will see a movement back on shore of industry that previously left and in some cases has subsequently left again. You would also see wages eventually rise but in real USD terms actually drop. The price of 2nd hand cars would rise as new car prices rise and sales slump.

The Chinese cannot source the iron ore they want elsewhere, if they could they would as how do you think the Chinese feel about paying iron ore train drivers 10 x their own salaries. The Chines moving off shore as you said would send the $A down, thus encouraging more buyers to look at Aust Iron Ore.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Donors, look what they did to the car industry.
Do you think someone in the private sector lobbied the government to purposely kill the car industry? I'm all ears if you want to spell out the theory. Personally I've always thought that it was government policy since Hawke/Keating's Button Report.

Interesting to think that if the AU$ collapsed below US$0.50 that all of our lovely imported consumer durables would suddenly become un-affordable for the majority. And its entirely possible that we could have a rapid deterioration in the dollar - it would only take the Chinese to start sourcing iron ore elsewhere or our coal exports to halve for a catastrophic fall in the dollar to occur.
...and we are back to the car industry. To save the debate, the car industry was killed off by a combination of
- changing buying tastes by the Australian population as well as global trend towards SUV and Dual cabs,
- too small a domestic market for stand alone production,
- failure to export what we made that others didn't (ie Commodore, Falcon, Territory) and
- inability to export (economically) global platform models due to Australian workers being some of the highest salaries in the world.
In short what happened in Australia has been replicated in most Developed world economies and preceded by numerous other industries,
time to move on.

If the Aussie dollar hit $0.50, then as happened last time, you will see a movement back on shore of industry that previously left and in some cases has subsequently left again. You would also see wages eventually rise but in real USD terms actually drop. The price of 2nd hand cars would rise as new car prices rise and sales slump.

The Chinese cannot source the iron ore they want elsewhere, if they could they would as how do you think the Chinese feel about paying iron ore train drivers 10 x their own salaries. The Chines moving off shore as you said would send the $A down, thus encouraging more buyers to look at Aust Iron Ore.
RTT_Rules
NO, it was killed by deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
NO, it was killed by deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
don_dunstan
Don,
you still believe Australia can build global platform low to mid priced cars in small volumes that Aussies will actually buy with almost no export potential, despite all the history that has occurred and what has happened in the USA, CAN, UK, Germany, France, Belgium, NZ, Sweden etc etc etc both before Australia ceased car assembly and the 5 years since the announcement.

Sorry to tell you, but the tooth fairy is also not real.

I bought my last new Australian made car in 2011, when was yours? Maybe this is the true end of the story?
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
NO, it was killed by deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
Don,
you still believe Australia can build global platform low to mid priced cars in small volumes that Aussies will actually buy with almost no export potential, despite all the history that has occurred and what has happened in the USA, CAN, UK, Germany, France, Belgium, NZ, Sweden etc etc etc both before Australia ceased car assembly and the 5 years since the announcement.

Sorry to tell you, but the tooth fairy is also not real.

I bought my last new Australian made car in 2011, when was yours? Maybe this is the true end of the story?
RTT_Rules
I've spelled out repeatedly what happened - unlike other nations our government abandoned the car industry from the Button Report onwards. Howard deliberately accelerated the demise by signing a lop-sided trade deal with Thailand - giving the car industry a massive hint that the Commonwealth wouldn't even try to go in to bat for them any longer - so they left.

Deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
NO, it was killed by deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
Don,
you still believe Australia can build global platform low to mid priced cars in small volumes that Aussies will actually buy with almost no export potential, despite all the history that has occurred and what has happened in the USA, CAN, UK, Germany, France, Belgium, NZ, Sweden etc etc etc both before Australia ceased car assembly and the 5 years since the announcement.

Sorry to tell you, but the tooth fairy is also not real.

I bought my last new Australian made car in 2011, when was yours? Maybe this is the true end of the story?
I've spelled out repeatedly what happened - unlike other nations our government abandoned the car industry from the Button Report onwards. Howard deliberately accelerated the demise by signing a lop-sided trade deal with Thailand - giving the car industry a massive hint that the Commonwealth wouldn't even try to go in to bat for them any longer - so they left.

Deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
don_dunstan
blah blah blah blah yes yes yes we all know about your conspiracy theories.

The Button plan was to reduce the number of models made, for which a number were on small scale assembly lines to encourage larger production numbers of export quality and price. it worked for a while, but then came Korea, then came  Malaysia and others.

The buyers abandoned the locally assembled Astra, Pulsar, Laser and finally Corrolla to Hyandai's and Kia's which were selling for less than the cost of assembly. Some of the new low cost imported suppliers failed on their own quality issues, ie Lada and Proton to name a few. Hell some of the imported cars even used engines made in Australia by Toyota and Holden, until they eventually developed their own.

You target Thailand as if it was the only car manufacturing country in the world exporting to Australia, yet its just one of a number of lower cost countries that have benefits from the shift of car assembly lines. Slovakia is the Thailand of the EU, Sth Africa in the south and Mexico in the west.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
blah blah blah blah
RTT_Rules
Yeah that's pretty much what I see when you post too.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
blah blah blah blah
Yeah that's pretty much what I see when you post too.
don_dunstan
Don, the global data is all there to be seen. There is no point trying to put Australia in its own box saying its different, when its not.

Anyway, glad we are done here.
  C2 Junior Train Controller

Government subsidies go to Billionaires no problem. Digging up coal with government subsidies redicilious ,creating, manufacturering  jobs with subsidies ingenious . economy management is so simple a drovers dog wrote it. Reading the Oz ego stroke for screen viewer believer not eyewitnessing fact.
  Graham4405 Minister for Railways

Location: Dalby Qld
Government subsidies go to Billionaires no problem. Digging up coal with government subsidies redicilious ,creating, manufacturering  jobs with subsidies ingenious . economy management is so simple a drovers dog wrote it. Reading the Oz ego stroke for screen viewer believer not eyewitnessing fact.
C2
Can you please get your cat to type your posts for you? We might be able to understand them then!
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Government subsidies go to Billionaires no problem. Digging up coal with government subsidies redicilious ,creating, manufacturering  jobs with subsidies ingenious . economy management is so simple a drovers dog wrote it. Reading the Oz ego stroke for screen viewer believer not eyewitnessing fact.
C2
Australia has been a major coal exporter for what 100 years, providing known well documented benefits to the local mining area but also the greater Australian economy. We have a long well documented history of the Australian dollar following the rise and fall of the coal and iron ore prices as well as jobs and other impacts.

But now, according to the worshipers from the "Church of Climatology", this whole industry is apparently subsidised by the taxpayers?
  Aaron Minister for Railways

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Yes, RTT,

‘Oh the coal industry is subsidised’

‘Subsidies paid to coal billionaires’

Coal is a $50+ Billion industry to Australia in exports alone.

Iron ore is a $80+ Billion industry to Australia in exports alone.

So a few billion in subsidy is a couple of % of export income.

Meanwhile, the government is repeatedly offering me a 76% subsidy (mostly paid to Tesla or Sonnen) for ‘green’ batteries.

Incidentally, typical of governments, they have funnelled the subsidies in the wrong direction, and the likely best tech for home battery storage (Sony) have seemingly pulled the pin from the Australian market. Inferior Tesla, Sonnen, LG and PylonTech were handed the market.
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

NO, it was killed by deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
Don,
you still believe Australia can build global platform low to mid priced cars in small volumes that Aussies will actually buy with almost no export potential, despite all the history that has occurred and what has happened in the USA, CAN, UK, Germany, France, Belgium, NZ, Sweden etc etc etc both before Australia ceased car assembly and the 5 years since the announcement.

Sorry to tell you, but the tooth fairy is also not real.

I bought my last new Australian made car in 2011, when was yours? Maybe this is the true end of the story?
I've spelled out repeatedly what happened - unlike other nations our government abandoned the car industry from the Button Report onwards. Howard deliberately accelerated the demise by signing a lop-sided trade deal with Thailand - giving the car industry a massive hint that the Commonwealth wouldn't even try to go in to bat for them any longer - so they left.

Deliberate government policy. End-of-story.
blah blah blah blah yes yes yes we all know about your conspiracy theories.

The Button plan was to reduce the number of models made, for which a number were on small scale assembly lines to encourage larger production numbers of export quality and price. it worked for a while, but then came Korea, then came  Malaysia and others.

The buyers abandoned the locally assembled Astra, Pulsar, Laser and finally Corrolla to Hyandai's and Kia's which were selling for less than the cost of assembly. Some of the new low cost imported suppliers failed on their own quality issues, ie Lada and Proton to name a few. Hell some of the imported cars even used engines made in Australia by Toyota and Holden, until they eventually developed their own.

You target Thailand as if it was the only car manufacturing country in the world exporting to Australia, yet its just one of a number of lower cost countries that have benefits from the shift of car assembly lines. Slovakia is the Thailand of the EU, Sth Africa in the south and Mexico in the west.
RTT_Rules
And Poland too.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Prince Charles proves the case for everyday people ignoring what the celebrities are telling them to do about carbon dioxide - Daily Mail;

Prince Charles was last night facing embarrassment after taking a series of private jet flights while lecturing world leaders about climate change.

On a trip to the World Economic Forum in Davos last week, the Prince met activist Greta Thunberg and used an electric Jaguar car to travel to the Swiss resort.

But the MoS can reveal that in the 11 days before his high-profile appearance, Charles took three flights on private jets for official Government business and one on a helicopter.

After his speech last Wednesday, during which he urged world leaders to take ‘bold and imaginative action’ on the environment, he took a fourth jet to Israel for an official trip.

Taking into account an additional five so-called ‘empty-leg’ flights required to collect the Prince, his jet and helicopter travel totalled more than 16,000 miles in less than a fortnight at an estimated cost to the taxpayer of £280,000.

Last night, a Clarence House spokesman said: ‘Global travel is an inescapable part of the Prince’s role as a senior member of the Royal Family representing the UK overseas.

Hypocrite.
  ANR Deputy Commissioner

Next time, he can travel by barge...
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Next time, he can travel by barge...
ANR
I love it how there was the token electric Jaguar between the Davos airport and the conference... as if that makes a fig of difference.
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
The Jag was probably flown out in a separate plane to Davros just so Charles could be seen arriving in it.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Next time, he can travel by barge...
I love it how there was the token electric Jaguar between the Davos airport and the conference... as if that makes a fig of difference.
don_dunstan
The whole climate change Davos conference is nothing but a complete joke and embarrassment at best.

In the name of the Env, lets fly the worlds leaders and their hangers on to a ski resort town in Switzerland in winter FFS.

I'm sure in between the hot air fest and Greta getting her 2c worth there was no skiing done and we won't mention the cost to the taxpayers and CO2 intensive transport required to get there.

Yes there is the cute typical Swiss mountain trains to get there, but how many do you think actually used them?

Perhaps next time if Greta wants to actually gain some actual credibility she should do a video conference from her home in Sweden.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
While I'm on a roll

http://www.blotreport.com/2020/01/13/how-murdoch-editors-lie/


Over to you Don.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
The Jag was probably flown out in a separate plane to Davros just so Charles could be seen arriving in it.
Donald
Davos has no credibility to anyone serious about climate change but dumb enough to not get caught up with the propaganda and show ponies that have traveled to a mountain ski resort town in Switzerland at the height of the ski season.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
While I'm on a roll

http://www.blotreport.com/2020/01/13/how-murdoch-editors-lie/


Over to you Don.
wobert
Hey, if it wasn't for Murdoch we'd have a conga line of media people telling us the world was about to end.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
Razz
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
The United Nations IPCC has very quietly released a revision of the huge disasters ahead due to the ravages of carbon dioxide 'pollution' and they've decided that the globe can expect out-of-control warming of up to 0.5 degrees Celsius by the end of this century. You heard right, the forecast for global warming has been cut to an increase of 0.5 degrees by 2100. Principa Scientific:

The revelation comes in an IPCC weblink which was posted last week in a Facebook group, and hopefully should be of some small comfort for those who believe the planet is heating out of control.

This inconvenient ‘devil in the detail’ is from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s own SR15 ‘Special Report’ in 2018, of which this is the Summary for Policymakers...

...Second, look at paragraphs A2 and A2.1. For clarity I reproduce them here:

A.2. Warming from anthropogenic emissions from the pre-industrial period to the present will persist for centuries to millennia and will continue to cause further long-term changes in the climate system, such as sea level rise, with associated impacts (high confidence), but these emissions alone are unlikely to cause global warming of 1.5°C.

A.2.1. Anthropogenic emissions (including greenhouse gases, aerosols and their precursors) up to the present are unlikely to cause further warming of more than 0.5°C over the next two to three decades (high confidence) or on a century time scale. [my emphasis added]

So after frightening children for years with stories of the end of civilisation they've now quietly decided that the increase in global temperature will be negligible? I bet the revised report will not make the ABC or any of those other doomsday-believers who are cheering on the (pretend) end of the world.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Used wind turbine blades (life expired at ten years old) are piling up and can't be recycled - so they're being land-filled across the world - Bloomberg;

A wind turbine’s blades can be longer than a Boeing 747 wing, so at the end of their lifespan they can’t just be hauled away. First, you need to saw through the lissome fiberglass using a diamond-encrusted industrial saw to create three pieces small enough to be strapped to a tractor-trailer.

The municipal landfill in Casper, Wyoming, is the final resting place of 870 blades whose days making renewable energy have come to end. The severed fragments look like bleached whale bones nestled against one another... Built to withstand hurricane-force winds, the blades can’t easily be crushed, recycled or repurposed. That’s created an urgent search for alternatives in places that lack wide-open prairies. In the U.S., they go to the handful of landfills that accept them, in Lake Mills, Iowa; Sioux Falls, South Dakota; and Casper, where they will be interred in stacks that reach 30 feet under.


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