Leongatha to Nyora Rail Line to be dismantled by Daniel Andrews

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 29 Feb 2020 15:02
  justarider Deputy Commissioner

Location: Free at last, free at last
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
Woo @bevans fightin words there.

"corruption" "un-elected"

all based upon a vitriolic rant from an anonymous ginger page on farcebook. Just because somebody says it, don't make it true.

The tourist train group had a red hot go at it, with a lot of public funds, and FAILED. Move on with a project that has good precedent of success.

cheers
John

Sponsored advertisement

  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
You can dig up a thread from 2015 about the situation In the Tourist and Presentation column.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
bevans
Again, what would propose instead?
  trainbrain Chief Commissioner

It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
Lad_Porter
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
  trainbrain Chief Commissioner

It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
bevans
I now lump this South Gippy group in with the Rail Revival Aliance, a bunch of gunzels who live nowhere in the area wanting trains back they'll use maybe once a decade.

Oh, that and they're all talk and no substance, with nothing to show they'd actually have the money and or knowhow to do it.
  BigShunter Chief Commissioner

Location: St Clair. S.A.
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
bevans
How does this rubbish actually qualify as news.

"Ripping up these publicly-owned tracks would permanently destroy the train line, making the return of much-needed public rail transport far more difficult and expensive."

Rolling Eyes wouldn't having all the old track ripped up simplify building their new passenger bursting train line. All this bullcrap being written and people are going off the plant about it.....hate to see some of these characters in a real crisis !

BigShunter.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
I now lump this South Gippy group in with the Rail Revival Aliance, a bunch of gunzels who live nowhere in the area wanting trains back they'll use maybe once a decade.

Oh, that and they're all talk and no substance, with nothing to show they'd actually have the money and or knowhow to do it.
speedemon08
...when I read, "private money", "business case", you know this is a warning sign. The same happened in Tas with the NE line opposition to a rail trail, "Private money", "business case", believe us! Yes in that case the railway was in quite good condition and the govt has called their bluff and left a section for a rail option which will likely never see a train again.

Unfortunately heritage rail needs more than dreams to be sustainable. Too many have taken over an existing line and have failed to maintain the required upkeep to keep the line operational. Which unfortunately many other groups have found out and gone down the same path and hence govts now are far less inclined to see HR as practical alternative to a "services suspended" railway line.

Anyone worth their salt who promised money to the Sth Giffy line will naturally redirect those funds to another rail based project, however I very much doubt this will occur and mostly because the money was never forth coming in the first place.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
Lad_Porter

If trains were currently operating between the now peri-urban locations EG, Whittlesea, Healesville, Warburton, Mornington and even Wonthaggi and Leongatha et al...it's a given that these lines would now be upgraded and not become a monster replacement project where a bus, which, whilst not garnering the ridership of a train at least provides a service along the closed lines route.

Mike.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
trainbrain
Funny, I don't recall the Wurundjeri people of the Kulin Nation ever having that parcel of land handed back to them.
  trainbrain Chief Commissioner

It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
Funny, I don't recall the Wurundjeri people of the Kulin Nation ever having that parcel of land handed back to them.
LancedDendrite
fair dinkum  dude, it belonged to the owners of the MLC grounds,  passing off the usual racial tone. does not work on me.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
When the Lilydale - Warburton line closed (1965) and was dismantled (early 70's) the rail corridor became disused and converted to Crown Land, It Is likely that parts of the former corridor was offered to other Government Departments (a long drawn out bureaucratic process) The Education Department must of put In a claim for the rail corridor besides the School.
Also part of Warburton Station yard Is now a Police Station.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
trainbrain
Apologies, I was not aware of that.  The college was established in 1896, but it's not obvious if it owned the future rail corridor at that time.  The railway was opened in 1901.    

On looking for more information, I found a Wikipedia site that says "the trail deviates around the north, east and south of Mount Lilydale Mercy College. The school currently leases the land formerly occupied by the railway". Another Wikipedia site says "the Warburton line right-of-way is intact, except for a short section leased to Mount Lilydale Mercy College."   Another description of the former Warburton line says "There is however a missing section of this former rail line that is not available to the public. This is the section between Anderson St and the Maroondah Highway in Lilydale, due to a lease from the Mount Lilydale Mercy College."

All of these seem to suggest that the college  is not the original owner, but is leasing the land (although of course you can't always believe anything on the Internet).  If that's the case, who is it leasing from and under what terms?  Please note I am not disputing anything, just trying to establish the current situation.
  Goose13 Station Master

Location: Having a sook about Southern cross's western wall
For what its worth its still zoned as parkland:


Only other info not from wikipedia I could find on this section of the trail:

https://www.railtrails.org.au/archives-1999-2003/archive-2000/318-minister-puts-valley-tourist-icon-under-threat

Regardless of who owned it initially it seems to have been operating as a rail trail through this section for at least 6ish years (again if wikipedia can be trusted) prior to the handover to the college.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
I now lump this South Gippy group in with the Rail Revival Aliance, a bunch of gunzels who live nowhere in the area wanting trains back they'll use maybe once a decade.

Oh, that and they're all talk and no substance, with nothing to show they'd actually have the money and or knowhow to do it.
speedemon08
As much I agree with you on this, Our Lord and Saviour is correct in that the current council is unelected, as the state government sacked for very agreeable and justifiable reasons. As for the Rail trail extension, pretty sure the now sacked council was pushing for it to be extended prior to the SGR going kaput. I'm going to wait for Brians next conspiracy theory on the matter.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-19/council-sacked-by-victorian-government/11082182
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
I am starting to smell corruption here in this matter. How would an un-elected council who is only in an administrative capacity until the new council is elected make decisions and fund the removal of the rail line?

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/stop-the-destruction-of-the-south-gippsland-railway-line-under-the-unelected-council
How does this rubbish actually qualify as news.
BigShunter
Thats because its been stolen from this local foamer Facebook page (linked below). Same deal as the Robert Whitehall Twitter post that started this thread, and the RRA 'Media releases'.

https://www.facebook.com/swgt.org.au/

EDIT
LAMO They staged a protest with Robert Whitehill

https://www.facebook.com/387949562009940/videos/1567249200092157/
  Upven Locomotive Driver

It's no different to the old Healesville line, where we now have (with considerable Council assistance) an excellent cycling/walking track to Yering (with the promise of more to come).  This line was equally as degraded/unusable/unrestorable as was Nyora-Leongatha, but not a word of protest about the tracks being ripped up, although in terms of potential use, Healesville has a larger population than Leongatha.  (About 6,600 and 5,200 respectively, according to the 2016 census.)

Where a railway line ceases to be viable and is closed, conversion to a rail trail is one of the best alternatives for future use, and it should be done promptly, before the corridor is compromised in some way (e.g. Mt Lilydale College on the Warburton trail).

There is an old saying "use it or lose it".  One wonders if passenger numbers had been much greater, whether the Leongatha line (or Healesville for that matter) would have overcome their physical difficulties and survived.
honerstly..............misinformation.................the rail trail around the back of Mt Lilydale College was never compromised, the land was returned to its original owners that had the land prior to the Warburton Line being built....................
Apologies, I was not aware of that.  The college was established in 1896, but it's not obvious if it owned the future rail corridor at that time.  The railway was opened in 1901.    

On looking for more information, I found a Wikipedia site that says "the trail deviates around the north, east and south of Mount Lilydale Mercy College. The school currently leases the land formerly occupied by the railway". Another Wikipedia site says "the Warburton line right-of-way is intact, except for a short section leased to Mount Lilydale Mercy College."   Another description of the former Warburton line says "There is however a missing section of this former rail line that is not available to the public. This is the section between Anderson St and the Maroondah Highway in Lilydale, due to a lease from the Mount Lilydale Mercy College."

All of these seem to suggest that the college  is not the original owner, but is leasing the land (although of course you can't always believe anything on the Internet).  If that's the case, who is it leasing from and under what terms?  Please note I am not disputing anything, just trying to establish the current situation.
Lad_Porter
It's zoned as public park similar to the rest of the Warburton Rail trail.
https://services.land.vic.gov.au/landchannel/download/Allot.-17a-Sec.-29-Yering-Vicplan-Planning-Property-Report.pdf
edit: meaning it's probably leased from VicTrack (or its predecessor) to MLC
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
As much I agree with you on this, Our Lord and Saviour is correct in that the current council is unelected, as the state government sacked for very agreeable and justifiable reasons. As for the Rail trail extension, pretty sure the now sacked council was pushing for it to be extended prior to the SGR going kaput. I'm going to wait for Brians next conspiracy theory on the matter.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-19/council-sacked-by-victorian-government/11082182
Dangersdan707
There are media reports that planing and lobbying for the extension of the rail trail started back In 2011  

Note, though It Is possible, a trail beside the railway Is not practical, because of the amount of earthworks required to build a trail to the minimum standards, than there are the land requirements (some people have long standing legitimate leases on railway land besides the narrow railway track reserve)

All In all a trail besides the railway would be very expensive and take many years to plan.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
All In all a trail besides the railway would be very expensive and take many years to plan.
Nightfire
That's exactly what is planned for the section between Yarra Glen and Healesville.
  8077 Chief Train Controller

Location: Crossing the Rubicon
I am confused on how a caretaker council could make such a decision without the support of victrack and therefore the state government and have someone there to immediate start pulling up the line.  This is rightly angered many associated with the area and at the same time a fully funded tourist railway operation is available bring more people to the area.

I smell corruption.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
I am confused on how a caretaker council could make such a decision without the support of victrack and therefore the state government and have someone there to immediate start pulling up the line.  This is rightly angered many associated with the area and at the same time a fully funded tourist railway operation is available bring more people to the area.

I smell corruption.
8077
Interesting that you and Bevans both smell the same corruption....... and keep posting stuff like the fully funded tourist railway op despite all evidence to the contrary. Got a source for that claim?
  8077 Chief Train Controller

Location: Crossing the Rubicon
Interesting that you and Bevans both smell the same corruption....... and keep posting stuff like the fully funded tourist railway op despite all evidence to the contrary. Got a source for that claim?
BrentonGolding

Not sure about bevans but the article I read is on the site and states there is a fully funded tourist railway proposal.

Source

Despite long-standing community calls for better public transport and a return of the rail service, AND despite a funded proposal on the table for a tourist railway between Korrumburra and Leongatha on the existing South Gippsland Railway, the un-elected administrators of the South Gippsland Shire Council have begun ripping up the railway tracks..
Somebody

There it is.

Corruption comes to mind as the council was sacked due to corruption and the question still remains how has this decision been made with a temp administrator?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
The decision way made by the State Government Department of Transport through their sub department of VicTrack.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction

Despite long-standing community calls for better public transport and a return of the rail service, AND despite a funded proposal on the table for a tourist railway between Korrumburra and Leongatha on the existing South Gippsland Railway, the un-elected administrators of the South Gippsland Shire Council have begun ripping up the railway tracks..

There it is.
8077
Just because someone says something doesn't make it true. I would like to see the business case and the details of who is funding it - as someone who is involved with another T&HR I have seen first hand how difficult it is just to break even and that is with a fair degree of assistance from all levels of government in terms of $$$, donations in kind etc. I don't think that the state or local government would be forthcoming with same for an operation that a) conflicts partially with another proposal that they seem to be backing and b) involves an operation in the same area that they already sunk a heap of resources into only to see it fail.
  8077 Chief Train Controller

Location: Crossing the Rubicon
Mr. Golding I am relying on posts here and on facebook and information from a local mate that is all i can do just like the rest of you guys.

Someone in the council is getting something out of doing this.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: