Mars 2020 Perseverance launch

 
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Its launch time



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21X5lGlDOfg&feature=emb_logo

Sponsored advertisement

  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
The DSN is in communication with the new probe

https://eyes.nasa.gov/dsn/dsn.html
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
In 19 years time if I am still here we will be talking about a mars human launch. Hard to believe it is.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Gosh, watching a major launch stream on NASA TV with their hyped up and dumbed down approach is hard work. It's a pity that ULA were not allowed to do their normal launch broadcast format instead, which would have given NASA just two or three customer video slots (depending on the coast phase/s) where they would have had to use their time as productively as possible.

Combined with the Emirates Mars Mission and Tianwen-1 launches over the last few weeks, this makes 2020 the first time in 17 years that a single transfer orbit window saw three separate missions launched to Mars.
  NSWGR8022 Assistant Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
In 19 years time if I am still here we will be talking about a mars human launch. Hard to believe it is.
freightgate

Nasa said in the mars broadcast they would be kicking dust on the planet around 2034 not far away if you consider how fast technology moves.

Is it true the probe has technical issues after leaving the rocket?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Is it true the probe has technical issues after leaving the rocket?
NSWGR8022
Yes.

One (an incorrectly received telemetry packet) was not a surprise and has already been resolved.

The other (reduced operation due to a high temperature difference between the side facing the sun and the side facing away) is a very minor issue that is already well on the way to being solved.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
With 3 probes and landers going to the red planet as I type this do the 3 agencies have to agree orbit profiles and timing to ensure they are no compromising moves between the 3?  I know on earth you need a n orbit slot allocated is the same true for Mars and other planets?
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Dragon lands (congrats to NASA and SPACEX) and what happens next, its surrounded by a fleet of d++kheads in their own boats.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Dragon lands (congrats to NASA and SPACEX) and what happens next, its surrounded by a fleet of d++kheads in their own boats.
RTT_Rules

Welcome to the new space race
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

With 3 probes and landers going to the red planet as I type this do the 3 agencies have to agree orbit profiles and timing to ensure they are no compromising moves between the 3?  I know on earth you need a n orbit slot allocated is the same true for Mars and other planets?
bevans
It would be exactly the same as in low earth orbit - the spacecraft launched earlier has right of way and collision prevention is the duty of the spacecraft launched later.

There's absolutely no chance of Mars 2020 hitting either of the other spacecraft while they are all in the heliocentric transfer orbit, they are all well separated at this time thanks to launching on different dates.

Once they are all at Mars, the different mission profiles will ensure separation. Hope is an orbiter only, Tianwen-1 is an orbiter-rover combination that will use polar orbits for the orbital phase, and Mars 2020 will make a descent to drop off Perseverance without any orbital science.

It's an interesting move of NASA to forego the opportunity to include orbital science on Mars 2020. I don't think payload mass would have been the issue, as they could have upgraded from an Atlas V 541 to a 551, or even a Delta IV Heavy.
  NSWGR8022 Assistant Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
Does NASA intend leaving a probe in orbit for the mars 2020 mission even when the rover is on the surface since there is no orbital science?
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Does NASA intend leaving a probe in orbit for the mars 2020 mission even when the rover is on the surface since there is no orbital science?
"NSWGR8022"


This project was done on the cheaper side to get up. NASA already maintains a small fleet of Mars orbiters around Mars for coms with rovers and science requirements of MARS with a new one going in I think the next Mars launch window.

Not sure if weight would have been an issue but the booster had four solid rocket boosters, the max it can have is five so likely adding 1 -1.5t or so would have been too much for the Atlas.

There probably isn't alot more they can do from orbit. I know the UAE spent alot effort to try and find orbit based science it could do that was unique and spent some time communicating with the international community to find what it could offer within their time and budget constraints and came up with mostly continuous study of the weather over one full Martian year, two if possible.

The science for Mars is now mostly on the surface, drill holes and look for signs of former life and a little geology along the way to find what nasty crap or other bonuses Mars has to offer humans. Curiosity probably has another 10 years left in it and Perseverance should be still kicking along up to 2040. If the helicopter thing works, expect them to send alot more before the end of the decade or early 2030's.

The next big leap will be getting Martian dirt back to Earth, this opens the door for better analysis of Mars. However will the samples come back on their own or carried by humans? To date none of the space agencies have done all that well bringing dirt home from another body with only a few grams actually being returned. Meanwhile a six dudes sent to the Moon 50 years ago brought home nearly 400kg combined.

The next 13 years is going to be very exciting, lets hope humanity does find other dumb ways to stop us from putting humans on Mars by early 2030's. I know Musk wants alot earlier, and he wants to be one of the first. He's nearly 50 so he will need to get a move on to achieve it before he's 60.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Not sure if weight would have been an issue but the booster had four solid rocket boosters, the max it can have is five so likely adding 1 -1.5t or so would have been too much for the Atlas.
RTT_Rules
You'd be looking at around 400kg extra payload to Mars by going from an Atlas V 541 to the 551, and a bit more again by going to a 552 (5 metre fairing, 5 solid fuelled boosters, dual engine Centaur).

That's comfortably enough to get a mid-sized satellite on for the ride, perhaps one that could do some science in a lower altitude orbit around Mars that cannot be done from the Emirates mission with its high 20000x43000km orbit.

Getting bang for buck has never been a NASA tradition, a private company or even a national security agency (other satellites ride share on US national security launches all the time) would have thought about that.

There probably isn't alot more they can do from orbit. I know the UAE spent alot effort to try and find orbit based science it could do that was unique and spent some time communicating with the international community to find what it could offer within their time and budget constraints and came up with mostly continuous study of the weather over one full Martian year, two if possible.
RTT_Rules
My understanding is that the UAE government left the science part of it up to the University of Colorado, who have had many payloads on NASA and ESA missions over the years and would be well acquainted with all the other members of the ESA-hosted international working group on Mars exploration.

The next big leap will be getting Martian dirt back to Earth, this opens the door for better analysis of Mars. However will the samples come back on their own or carried by humans? To date none of the space agencies have done all that well bringing dirt home from another body with only a few grams actually being returned. Meanwhile a six dudes sent to the Moon 50 years ago brought home nearly 400kg combined.

The next 13 years is going to be very exciting, lets hope humanity does find other dumb ways to stop us from putting humans on Mars by early 2030's. I know Musk wants alot earlier, and he wants to be one of the first. He's nearly 50 so he will need to get a move on to achieve it before he's 60.
RTT_Rules
Perseverance is the first part of a joint NASA-ESA strategy for returning Mars samples to Earth.

Following on from Perseverance will be a joint NASA-ESA mission to be launched in October 2026 on an Atlas V or Ariane 6 which will land an ESA rover and an encapsulated NASA ascent rocket on Mars. This rover will be collect the samples left behind by Perseverance and load them onto the ascent rocket.

Also launched in the 2026 Mars transfer window will be an ESA mission on an Ariane 6 which will have the Earth Return Orbiter that will receive the ascent rocket from the Mars surface and transfer the samples to a spacecraft which will (thanks to orbital mechanics) land on earth in 2031.

A successful unmanned return is a prerequisite for NASA funding for anything more than preparatory work for a manned mission, and ESA has the same condition. My guess is that the first manned mission to Mars will be a multinational ESA-NASA crew.
  apw5910 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Location: Location.
I know Musk wants alot earlier, and he wants to be one of the first. He's nearly 50 so he will need to get a move on to achieve it before he's 60.
RTT_Rules
RA Heinlein, "The Man Who Sold the Moon."
  NSWGR8022 Assistant Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
How on earth are they going to get martian soil back to earth without sending another probe with the ability to collect it and get it into martian orbit and then on the way back to Earth?

We do not ave the technology unless Musk has something in his stable
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

How on earth are they going to get martian soil back to earth without sending another probe with the ability to collect it and get it into martian orbit and then on the way back to Earth?
NSWGR8022
Read my last post. NASA and ESA are working together to develop the vehicles needed to do it in a series of three missions with Perseverance (the sample collection rover) being the first one.

You can bet that the second mission of the series of three will not have any SpaceX involvement. ESA has already awarded Airbus the contract for the rover (Airbus has experience developing hardware for ESA Mars missions in the past) and SpaceX won't win the contract to build the Mars Ascent Vehicle (the small rocket which will launch from Mars and rendezvous in Mars orbit with the Earth Return Orbiter) as SpaceX don't have any expertise with solid fuelled rockets.

The third mission is an all-ESA affair, so it's probably too late for SpaceX to win any of the work on that as they don't have any prior history of positively working with the ESA on other smaller missions.

We do not ave the technology unless Musk has something in his stable
NSWGR8022
You are wrong, all the components of the technology do exist.

NASA has successfully returned samples from a comet with the Stardust mission that returned to earth in 2006.

JAXA successfully landed the Hayabusa spacecraft on an asteroid and returned the sample capsule to earth at the Woomera Test Range in 2010. The improved Hayabusa2 spacecraft has landed on another asteroid and is on its way back with samples which it will land at Woomera this December.

NASA's first asteroid sample return mission is currently underway with the OSIRIS-REx spacecraft currently in orbit around the asteroid 101955 Bennu and due to return to earth in 2023.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
How on earth are they going to get martian soil back to earth without sending another probe with the ability to collect it and get it into martian orbit and then on the way back to Earth?
Read my last post. NASA and ESA are working together to develop the vehicles needed to do it in a series of three missions with Perseverance (the sample collection rover) being the first one.

You can bet that the second mission of the series of three will not have any SpaceX involvement. ESA has already awarded Airbus the contract for the rover (Airbus has experience developing hardware for ESA Mars missions in the past) and SpaceX won't win the contract to build the Mars Ascent Vehicle (the small rocket which will launch from Mars and rendezvous in Mars orbit with the Earth Return Orbiter) as SpaceX don't have any expertise with solid fuelled rockets.

The third mission is an all-ESA affair, so it's probably too late for SpaceX to win any of the work on that as they don't have any prior history of positively working with the ESA on other smaller missions.

We do not ave the technology unless Musk has something in his stable
You are wrong, all the components of the technology do exist.

NASA has successfully returned samples from a comet with the Stardust mission that returned to earth in 2006.

JAXA successfully landed the Hayabusa spacecraft on an asteroid and returned the sample capsule to earth at the Woomera Test Range in 2010. The improved Hayabusa2 spacecraft has landed on another asteroid and is on its way back with samples which it will land at Woomera this December.

NASA's first asteroid sample return mission is currently underway with the OSIRIS-REx spacecraft currently in orbit around the asteroid 101955 Bennu and due to return to earth in 2023.
justapassenger
SpaceX don't won't projects like this. Yes they may bid for lifting stuff into space, but they won't waste time and resources on one off science projects.

Musk has been very clear about direction of SpaceX, their development is solely focused on Starship to eventually replace F9/FH and get people to Moon and Mars.

Sponsored advertisement

Subscribers: bevans, NSWGR8022, RTT_Rules

Display from: