Why rail electrification is key to keeping the UK’s climate progress on track

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 08 Sep 2020 14:37
  NSWGR8022 Deputy Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
It goes without saying Adelaide, Melbourne and some of Sydney need to get electrification rolling oout especially Melbourne to regional centres already taking a large number of rail passenger services.

It feels like we in Australia are years behind the rest of the world when it comes to reducing emissions for transport.

Victoria especially so when you remember the announcement last week on renewable energy and the same for Adelaide.

Adelaide has very green power and yet only a small amount of the network is electrified.

Why rail electrification is key to keeping the UK’s climate progress on track

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  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
It goes without saying Adelaide, Melbourne and some of Sydney need to get electrification rolling oout especially Melbourne to regional centres already taking a large number of rail passenger services.

It feels like we in Australia are years behind the rest of the world when it comes to reducing emissions for transport.

Victoria especially so when you remember the announcement last week on renewable energy and the same for Adelaide.

Adelaide has very green power and yet only a small amount of the network is electrified.

Why rail electrification is key to keeping the UK’s climate progress on track
"NSWGR8022"


Gets down to traffic density and a few other inputs. In general a single line with 1h frequency or less is usually not worthy of sparking unless its just easier with fleet management, Lithgow in NSW and Rosewood in Qld for example.

Meanwhile Adelaide's progress is rated limited by DMU fleet age, spark when it time to replace them and not before unless for example sparking once section allows increased frequency on both that using new EMU's and diverting the DMU's to the remaining non-sparked lines.

Melbourne, yeah well I don't understand how the Geelong line got this far no-overhead and likewise the Eastern line, but hey its Vic, they always do things differently.

Then there is the complexity of Double stacking corridors etc, something the UK doesn't have to deal with.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

Distance and population density.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

It goes without saying Adelaide, Melbourne and some of Sydney need to get electrification rolling oout especially Melbourne to regional centres already taking a large number of rail passenger services.

It feels like we in Australia are years behind the rest of the world when it comes to reducing emissions for transport.

Victoria especially so when you remember the announcement last week on renewable energy and the same for Adelaide.

Adelaide has very green power and yet only a small amount of the network is electrified.

Why rail electrification is key to keeping the UK’s climate progress on track
NSWGR8022
What parts of Sydney need electrification to get rolled out when the entire Sydney network is electrified?
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
Rule of thumb: if you're running either more than 6 trains per hour or 160kph (or greater) top speeds on a line, it's economical to electrify it. That means that virtually every RFR corridor line in Victoria is theoretically economical to electrify. Throw in the Melbourne-Sydney line and you're onto a winner. We need a rolling programme of regional railway electrification.
  apw5910 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Location: Location.
We need a rolling programme of regional railway electrification.
LancedDendrite
It'll ruin the photographs and Bevan's videos.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Distance and population density.
simstrain

If you consider that approach then the report recently developed with business case for electrification in Victoria should be adopted and quickly.  Victoria has a growing investment in renewable power which would be perfect for electrified rail services (it is different in the UK where there is a lot of Nuclear Power) and there is the population centres and the traffic density.  Start with Melbourne to Ballarat and Melbourne to Geelong and thence Melbourne to Bendigo.  Since the majority of these services run during the day renewable energy is perfect.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

Distance and population density.

If you consider that approach then the report recently developed with business case for electrification in Victoria should be adopted and quickly.  Victoria has a growing investment in renewable power which would be perfect for electrified rail services (it is different in the UK where there is a lot of Nuclear Power) and there is the population centres and the traffic density.  Start with Melbourne to Ballarat and Melbourne to Geelong and thence Melbourne to Bendigo.  Since the majority of these services run during the day renewable energy is perfect.
bevans

I have said many times that Geelong should be electrified but all I keep hearing is about how Geelong residents don't want to ride on a metro train even though many in Sydney do so within a similar or greater distance. There is no reason why an electric train can't have comfortable seats for a 1 hour journey.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
There were plans for Sydney to Melbourne electrification of the line for the bi-centenary celebrations 1988. What a pitty this was not completed as it would be renewable energy mostly now and assist the environment greatly.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
There were plans for Sydney to Melbourne electrification of the line for the bi-centenary celebrations 1988. What a pitty this was not completed as it would be renewable energy mostly now and assist the environment greatly.
freightgate
Actually around about 30% RE, not most.

The track needs to be realigned before they put wires up but I support the wires longterm.

One of the issues in 1988 was the voltage / current. Today not such an issue as the interstate doesn't share much under the wire and could easily be by-passed so as to enable a decent power supply of 25kVAC.
  The Inevitable Looney Station Staff

What are the choices for electric locomotives with similar hauling capabilities to the NR class?  I imagine the Swiss and Austrian systems must have some powerful haulers.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
What are the choices for electric locomotives with similar hauling capabilities to the NR class?  I imagine the Swiss and Austrian systems must have some powerful haulers.
The Inevitable Looney
Qld operates similar or rather more powerful on skinny gauge, shouldn't be too hard to find a 4000 - 5000 Hp loco.
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
What are the choices for electric locomotives with similar hauling capabilities to the NR class?  I imagine the Swiss and Austrian systems must have some powerful haulers.
Qld operates similar or rather more powerful on skinny gauge, shouldn't be too hard to find a 4000 - 5000 Hp loco.
RTT_Rules
Siemens Vectrons are 7000Hp. I'd be surprised if you found a modern mainline electric with less than 5000Hp
  The Inevitable Looney Station Staff

Getting off topic but I recall the Whitlam Govt offering to contribute to the Syd-Melb electrification project but the States wouldn't be in it.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Getting off topic but I recall the Whitlam Govt offering to contribute to the Syd-Melb electrification project but the States wouldn't be in it.
The Inevitable Looney
States knew it probably didn't make sense and still doesn't until the track alignment is improved. With O/H costing $1m/km, its not cheap and costs more if not built in the final position the first time.
  62440 Chief Commissioner

When I worked in Melbourne in 85 I asked why electrification did not go to Geelong and was told that the City Fathers did not want to be seen as part of Melbourne. I suspect that attitude survives.
  Lockspike Deputy Commissioner

Getting off topic but I recall the Whitlam Govt offering to contribute to the Syd-Melb electrification project but the States wouldn't be in it.
The Inevitable Looney
And the Fraser Govt offered to pay for most of it (75%?). NSW premier Neville Wran said, "No thanks, we have our own electrification priorities", meaning Newcastle and Wollongong.

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