Wampu tenders

 
  edison Chief Commissioner

What is a Wampu tender, what does the word mean, and which classes of locos were they used with?

Cheers,  Edison

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  M636C Minister for Railways

The "Wampu" tenders were used with TF (53) and K (55) class locomotives.

They were larger than the previous design, the 3650 gallon tender originally supplied with the T (50) class and also used on later P (32) class locomotives, and fitted to the original 50 P class in place of their six wheel tenders. The 3650 gallon bogie tender was fitted to the early TF class as well. The 3650 gallon tenders were basically a British design with plate frame bogies.

The Wampu was based on the Baldwin tenders supplied with the O and J class locomotives. It was larger with a much taller tank holding 4000 gallons, but it retained the curved rear corners seen on the Baldwin design. The bogies were to an American design. The angled coal plates at the top of the tender continued right around, and is the quickest way to tell a "Wampu" from a 3650 gallon (at least in their final form with "hungry boards").

The Wampu tenders were converted to oil burning to run with the modified 55 class locomotives.

I was told that "Wampu" was a native American word for"large" or "clumsy" but I would be happy to have this expanded or corrected.

M636C
  Grantham Minister for Railways

Location: I'm with stupid!
Wampu = Western And Metropolitan Pick Up

E.E.Lucy loved plays on words.

M
  MrNathan Chief Commissioner

Location: In and out.
If you'd like to see one up close and personal, 5461 on display at Valley Heights is coupled to one. I'm pretty sure it's the only one preserved, but am happy to be corrected.

Ugly bloody things!
  KAVRAIL Banned

Location: Banned
I think 5595 at RTM may have one as well, again, feel free to correct me.
  12CSVT Chief Commissioner

Location: Drowning in accreditation red tape!
Apparently 5595 does have a Wampu tender (which I thought was the sole survivor - didn't realise 5461 had one as well?) but the tender tank is stuffed. From what I have read, RTM had a new tender tank built to replace the one on 5595 with a view towards restoring 5595 to service, but the project never proceeded.

DSR&M have a complete Wampu tender underframe. According to the latest newsletter, they have just purchased the new tender tank from RTM (which was otherwise destined for scrap) which will be fitted to the underframe. This will give DSR&M a full set of 5 Standard Goods tenders, an original small tender, the only? surviving 'Walsh Island' tender, a 'Commonwealth' or 'Turret' tender, the aforesaid 'Wampu' tender and a shunt tender (LO33).
  M636C Minister for Railways

The bogie "shunting tender" which was actually intended for tender first operation on construction work used a Wampu underframe.

The acronym suggestion for the origin of the term is ingenious but the duties indicated don't seem to require an additional 10% water, and the tender wasn't confined to those duties.

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service. I recall seeing a Wampu on a stored oil burning 55 at Enfield in the early 1960s, and it may have been this one with the oil tank removed. There certainly weren't many still in use at the end - I can't recall seeing one in normal service.

Whether this is the one now on 5461 or another, I don't know.

M636C
  Aussielgb Locomotive Fireman

Location: Gulmarrad Station
The Wampu tender is on 5461 at Valley
The terrett tender of the TF is now on 5595 at the RTM.
The tenders along with other parts were swapped between loco's before 5461 left the RTM to go to Valley Heights.

Regards

Greg.
  MrNathan Chief Commissioner

Location: In and out.
the only? surviving 'Walsh Island' tender.
"12CSVT"


Better known as a Mort's Dock tender.

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service.
"M636C"


Ah Peter, as usual assumption is a poor substitute for fact.

Taken on 26th February:

[bigimg]http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f89/The4thDivision/P1020909.jpg[/bigimg]
  M636C Minister for Railways

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service.
"M636C"


Ah Peter, as usual assumption is a poor substitute for fact.

Taken on 26th February: (see photo above)

"MrNathan"


And your photo taken on 26 Feb 2009 (?) relates to 5595 as running in 1966 and 1967 in what way exactly? 5595 was attached to a Wampu tender towards the end of its period in service. Before that it had a turret tender. I was trying to explain that it had not had this earlier, and that the tender must have been in non locomotive use or on a stored locomotive up to that time. The tender on 5461 is believed to be that attached to 5595 in 1966 or so. So what have I assumed incorrectly?

M636C
  a6et Minister for Railways

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service.
"M636C"


Ah Peter, as usual assumption is a poor substitute for fact.

Taken on 26th February: (see photo above)

"MrNathan"


And your photo taken on 26 Feb 2009 (?) relates to 5595 as running in 1966 and 1967 in what way exactly? 5595 was attached to a Wampu tender towards the end of its period in service. Before that it had a turret tender. I was trying to explain that it had not had this earlier, and that the tender must have been in non locomotive use or on a stored locomotive up to that time. The tender on 5461 is believed to be that attached to 5595 in 1966 or so. So what have I assumed incorrectly?

M636C
"M636C"


The last real use of the wampu tender was on a tour train to Kiama back in 1965, it was retrieved from #1 shed Enfield as the best remaining example of the remaining tenders.  IIRC, & if I can find the photo's the engine used was 5593.  I remember it well as the fireman on the return from Wollongong.

The tender was repaired sufficiently for the trip worked for a few days beforehand, & removed on return to Enfield from the tour.

I have a photo taken at Bathurst in 1965 of a rake of 8 or 10 tenders that were stored for water trains, & were scrapped shortly afterwards, also at the time there were 2 at Harden & survived the torch to when Sims returned from the southern depots cutting up the 57-58 classes.
  jumboman44211 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Depot No. 20
The bogie "shunting tender" which was actually intended for tender first operation on construction work used a Wampu underframe.

The acronym suggestion for the origin of the term is ingenious but the duties indicated don't seem to require an additional 10% water, and the tender wasn't confined to those duties.

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service. I recall seeing a Wampu on a stored oil burning 55 at Enfield in the early 1960s, and it may have been this one with the oil tank removed. There certainly weren't many still in use at the end - I can't recall seeing one in normal service.

Whether this is the one now on 5461 or another, I don't know.

M636C
"M636C"


LO33 was first in service in 1925, first was used between Parkes and Trida, due to no turning facilities at Trida. In the late 1940's, it was pressed into the Newcastle coal traffic. Two locos I know it was attached to, were 5180 and 5195 at Port Waratah. The former I worked on, many times, and was a 'Godsend' in winter for tender first running.
  TBP Minister for Railways

Location: Singleton
This photo by Tony Eyre show's 5595 on the NSWRTM's Exhibits page show's the locomotive with a Wampu tender at Eastwood, December 1962.

http://www.nswrtm.org/exhibits/the_exhibits/5595.html
  M636C Minister for Railways

This photo by Tony Eyre show's 5595 on the NSWRTM's Exhibits page show's the locomotive with a Wampu tender at Eastwood, December 1962.

http://www.nswrtm.org/exhibits/the_exhibits/5595.html
"SMR30"


That looks a lot more like Rozelle than Eastwood to me, although if someone can tell me what the industry in Eastwood was and why I never noticed it, I'll be happier.

But if the location is indeed wrong, maybe the date is too...

M636C
  a6et Minister for Railways

This photo by Tony Eyre show's 5595 on the NSWRTM's Exhibits page show's the locomotive with a Wampu tender at Eastwood, December 1962.

http://www.nswrtm.org/exhibits/the_exhibits/5595.html
"SMR30"


That looks a lot more like Rozelle than Eastwood to me, although if someone can tell me what the industry in Eastwood was and why I never noticed it, I'll be happier.

But if the location is indeed wrong, maybe the date is too...

M636C
"M636C"


Certainly does not look like Eastwood in any way.  Not too sure about it being Rozelle either.  Its certainly not coming under Victoria Rd nor the White Bay power station as the sides are wrong, too many tracks, & the bridge is too high.  

With a van on the loco, it is a trip train, I am thinking somewhere near Darling Island/Pyrmont area
  M636C Minister for Railways

Yes, on reflection it might well be Darling Harbour or Pyrmont.

Those look like power station stacks in the background, over the rise.

M636C
  MrNathan Chief Commissioner

Location: In and out.
The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service.
"M636C"


As an individual who both speaks and writes English reasonably fluently, I would say that your use of this statement suggests that you have assumed that the Wampu is presently coupled to 5595.

Q.E.D.
  Spinner5711 Train Controller

There is one complete Wampu tender in existence.  It is TAB Number 1415 and is presently coupled to 5461 at Valley Heights.  DSR&M have a Wampu underframe, they purchased several from Cardiff Workshops circa 1986 and scrapped all but one, keeping parts off teh scrapped examples.

Some leading dimensions of the various tenders coupled to Standard Goods locomotives.

                      Wampu       Commonwealth.   32/50 Class.  Morts Dock
Water capacity: 4,000 Gal.   5,000 Gal            3,650 Gal       3,650 Gal

Coal Capacity:  13 Tons.     11 Tons                9½ tons        11 tons.

This tender was used for two tour workings in the mid 1960's: with 5593 circa 1965 and with 5597 circa 1966.

Wampu tenders were initially issued into traffic with 53 & 55 Class locomotives, there have been two known instances where a Wampu was used behind a 50 Class.

Today, 5595 is coupled to Commonwealth Turret Tender TAB 1634.  5595 had a Commonwealth tender for its last few years of service.
  M636C Minister for Railways

The Wampu tender attached to 5595 was found somewhere just before that locomotive's withdrawal from service.
"M636C"


As an individual who both speaks and writes English reasonably fluently, I would say that your use of this statement suggests that you have assumed that the Wampu is presently coupled to 5595.

Q.E.D.
"MrNathan"


Even when I followed that statement with:

"Whether this is the one now on 5461 or another, I don't know."

As another person reasonably fluent in English, I can only conclude that you didn't read my entire post, since to draw your conclusion I must have thought it was coupled to BOTH 5595 and 5461 at the same time!

If I had wanted to say "now coupled to 5595" I woould have done so.

M636C
  edison Chief Commissioner

Guys -

Many thanks for the explanations re these tenders. Very informative.

Pity it had to develop into a slanging match, but regretably this happens with so many threads if they are allowed to ramble on long enough.

For my money, the topic may as well be closed.  Thanks again.

Edison
  3651 Station Staff

Location: Bullaburra. Blue Mountains NSW
I think that the Wampu tender suits the TF's and the K classes.
It looks nice behind 5461.
  M636C Minister for Railways


This tender was used for two tour workings in the mid 1960's: with 5593 circa 1965 and with 5597 circa 1966.

Today, 5595 is coupled to Commonwealth Turret Tender TAB 1634.  5595 had a Commonwealth tender for its last few years of service.
"Spinner5711"


So to return to the thread, what is the likely date of the photo of 5595 at Darling Island at the link posted above?

It is unlikely to be 1962 since 5595 would be expected to have one of the German Talbot tenders (assembled by Comeng) by that time.

It could be during the period of tour operation, with the tender used with 5593 and 5597, but this is less likely since by that time, the LHG vans would have been being withdrawn and replaced by GHG vans.

There is nothing I can see in the photo that would definitely date it after the late 1940s. So it could be of 5595 before the general fitting of the large turret tenders.

M636C
  a6et Minister for Railways


This tender was used for two tour workings in the mid 1960's: with 5593 circa 1965 and with 5597 circa 1966.

Today, 5595 is coupled to Commonwealth Turret Tender TAB 1634.  5595 had a Commonwealth tender for its last few years of service.
"Spinner5711"


So to return to the thread, what is the likely date of the photo of 5595 at Darling Island at the link posted above?

It is unlikely to be 1962 since 5595 would be expected to have one of the German Talbot tenders (assembled by Comeng) by that time.

It could be during the period of tour operation, with the tender used with 5593 and 5597, but this is less likely since by that time, the LHG vans would have been being withdrawn and replaced by GHG vans.

There is nothing I can see in the photo that would definitely date it after the late 1940s. So it could be of 5595 before the general fitting of the large turret tenders.

M636C
"M636C"


From my time at Enfield from January 1964, there was a wampu tender sitting in #1 shed, I forget the road number but was on the western side & about the 4th last stall.  This was the tender used for 93 & 97 on the mentioned tours, the Kiama tour was actually 5597, & the tender was not in very good condition at all.

Prior to the tour it was inspected & give approval for that trip & was removed on return owing to its condition.  The Wampu tender was NOT fitted to any of the few remaining 55cl at Enfield at the time, & I photographed 5595 at Harden during its last allocation to Cowra with a Turrett tender.

One of the last 55cl to have a Wampu tender fitted was 5610, as well as 5595.  Certainly both received the Turrett tenders at least during their final overhauls, as there are photos of them both in some books showing them with the Wampu's in the early 60's.

The more I look at the location, the more I am mystified by it, as the engine is coming out from what looks to be a single siding under the overpass.  The rail next to it seems to be truncated at the end, & the shiny rails nearest the camera are curving away to the right.

From memory there were storage roads Darling Island through to an area within the deep cuttings & tunnels to the side of the up & down lines Rozelle, my feeling is that it is in that region as there was a power station on that side of the line.  (there is a photo of a TF in the 53/55cl book near that location, in the vicinity of what was the wash roads).
  Supertyfon Locomotive Driver

Sorry to take a diverging route on yet another topic but have any Morts Dock tenders been saved?
  Supertyfon Locomotive Driver

have any Morts Dock tenders been saved?
"Supertyfon"

5132 at Dorrigo has a Morts Dock (often referred to as "Walsh Island") tender.
"NSWRcars"


Thanks, must be the lone survivor.

Shame, they were a nice looking tender.

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