Toolamba - Echuca line reopening

 
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Aren't the level crossings which are protected also protected rail wise by a coloured signal?
bevans
Some LXs are interlocked with signals such as the Up Departure signal at Sunbury (you can sit in the platform with a red over red aspect and the LX which is only 50m or so ahead is still open for vehicle traffic however I don't think they are on the Bendigo - Echuca line, signalling on that line is pretty rudimentary.

I am not even sure how it works on the Bendigo line proper, I would be interested to know, the sections are pretty long between signals and I don't think the LXs are interlocked with the signals. Say between Woodend and Kyneton where there are a number of LXs. From memory there is a signal on the Down side of Woodend and the next signal is the co-acting pair at the cutting on the Up side of Kyneton. (I am not 100% sure on this and would love a clarification)

All crossings with lights have Healthy State Indicators of course but by the time the driver sees that one is not working he/she may not be able to stop before the crossing (although the train would scrub off a fair bit of speed before it got there, especially from 75km/h!)

BG

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  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

The logical thing to do is with the offending crossing is to instruct all trains to proceed on an SR at a speed they can pull up . BUT if the train driver observes booms are down then proceed at the SR speed .

Then our Safety Nazis at VLP can sort out the issue .

Are the lx on this section  track circuit activated or  axle counters or a mix of both .

After the same issues with loco hauled on the Bairnsdale line 2 years ago, one would think all new installations would now be
axle counters .

Closing the whole line is just overkill .
  historian Deputy Commissioner

At the risk of oversimplifying a relatively complex subject...

The default situation in Victoria is that level crossing protection equipment is not protected by a signal. An approaching train triggers the protection equipment (by track circuit, level crossing predictor, or axle counter). When the train has completely cleared the level crossing the protection equipment is switched off. All active level crossings have indications that the drivers can use to check correct operation (even if they are only sidelights on the flashing light cases), but many level crossings also have remote monitoring which can phone home if something goes wrong.

Signals are provided in the country on otherwise unsignalled lines to protect level crossings where a train can sit on the main line approach for some time - the standard example these days being a platform. On the modern network, the signal is usually at proceed and the level crossing operates completely as previously described. When it is necessary for a train to stand on the main line for some time, a key switch is provided to allow the train crew to put the signal back to stop and stops the protection equipment. When the train is ready to proceed, the train crew operates the key switch. The protection equipment then starts operating, and a short time later, the signal clears. The signal is simply there to prohibit the train crew from driving the train onto the unprotected level crossing.

The interlocking between signals and protection equipment gets significantly more complex where three position signalling is provided. But the general rule is still the same: the signals prevent unnecessary operation of the level crossing protection equipment where trains routinely come to a stand in the approach track circuit.
  historian Deputy Commissioner

Are the lx on this section  track circuit activated or  axle counters or a mix of both .
kuldalai

The recently installed level crossing protection equipment on the Echuca line is axle counters. The rest is a mixture of level crossing predictors (medium age) and conventional track circuits (oldest examples).

The Train Operating Data gives details.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Are the lx on this section  track circuit activated or  axle counters or a mix of both .

The recently installed level crossing protection equipment on the Echuca line is axle counters. The rest is a mixture of level crossing predictors (medium age) and conventional track circuits (oldest examples).

The Train Operating Data gives details.
historian
Imagine if Vicroads had a faulty set of traffic signals on Dandenong Road; would they close Dandenong Road from  St Kilda Junction to Dandenong ?  NO they would FIX the problem intersection lights  FAST .
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

The logical thing to do is with the offending crossing is to instruct all trains to proceed on an SR at a speed they can pull up . BUT if the train driver observes booms are down then proceed at the SR speed .

Then our Safety Nazis at VLP can sort out the issue .

Are the lx on this section  track circuit activated or  axle counters or a mix of both .

After the same issues with loco hauled on the Bairnsdale line 2 years ago, one would think all new installations would now be
axle counters .

Closing the whole line is just overkill .
kuldalai
Just announced  Thursday30/03 that  12  level crossings on Echuca line still with track circuited lx are to get axle counters over next 5 - 7 weeks. VLP passenger services will then resume . In the meantime VBus reigns supreme .

The current debacle on the Echuca line was totally avoidable if VLP had learnt from the Bairnsdale  line lx activation problem around two years ago, and last years  V/Locity activation issues in Metro area with track circuited lx .

Now will VLP fix any track circuited lx on Ballarat - Ararat , or do we wait till the same problem arises there too ?
  damooops Junior Train Controller

Location: The Revenue Raising State
G'day all.
It's a wonder they don't take advantage of the fact there is a line from Toolamba and Echuca and run the 2 passenger trains a day that way while the repairs are taking place.
Cheers all.
  SamTheMan79 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Geelong
G'day all.
It's a wonder they don't take advantage of the fact there is a line from Toolamba and Echuca and run the 2 passenger trains a day that way while the repairs are taking place.
Cheers all.
damooops

V/line don't seem to be interested in keeping trains running in some cases.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Are the lx on this section  track circuit activated or  axle counters or a mix of both .

The recently installed level crossing protection equipment on the Echuca line is axle counters. The rest is a mixture of level crossing predictors (medium age) and conventional track circuits (oldest examples).

The Train Operating Data gives details.
Imagine if Vicroads had a faulty set of traffic signals on Dandenong Road; would they close Dandenong Road from St Kilda Junction to Dandenong ?  NO they would FIX the problem intersection lights  FAST .
kuldalai

And if two cars collide at the any of those intersections, it might make the news but only if it's a slow news day.

If a train and a road vehicle collide it becomes state wide front page news...that's the obvious difference.

Mike.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
G'day all.
It's a wonder they don't take advantage of the fact there is a line from Toolamba and Echuca and run the 2 passenger trains a day that way while the repairs are taking place.
Cheers all.
damooops

Ummm, let's see....the speed limit on that track is 60KPH for freight trains.

There's little automatic Level Crossing protection.

The line isn't up to the standard for VLocity's.

Most pax are travelling to/from Echuca to Bendigo.

Mike.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Why aren't we seeing the same level crossing issues on the Swan Hill line?
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Why aren't we seeing the same level crossing issues on the Swan Hill line?
x31
That's tempting fate a little isn't it?!?! Smile

BG
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Why aren't we seeing the same level crossing issues on the Swan Hill line?
That's tempting fate a little isn't it?!?! Smile

BG
BrentonGolding

I am assuming the same technology is being used on that line as is on the Echuca line.  So why the issues with Echuca?
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction

And if two cars collide at the any of those intersections, it might make the news but only if it's a slow news day.

If a train and a road vehicle collide it becomes state wide front page news...that's the obvious difference.

Mike.
The Vinelander .
So as a political insider you are confirming that state budget funds are allocated depending on what is on the front page of the paper!

BG
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

G'day all.
It's a wonder they don't take advantage of the fact there is a line from Toolamba and Echuca and run the 2 passenger trains a day that way while the repairs are taking place.
Cheers all.

V/line don't seem to be interested in keeping trains running in some cases.
SamTheMan79
The V/Line Safety Nazis would no doubt demand  boom barriers at all crossings for passenger operation between Echuca and Toolamba, and that would be a decade long project for  VLP infrastructure to implement , then the line speed would no doubt be 60 kmh max for DMU operation .
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Why aren't we seeing the same level crossing issues on the Swan Hill line?
That's tempting fate a little isn't it?!?! Smile

BG

I am assuming the same technology is being used on that line as is on the Echuca line.  So why the issues with Echuca?
x31

Big issues...Loco hauled on Swan Hill line Vs V'Locity on Echuca line.

Mike.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line

And if two cars collide at the any of those intersections, it might make the news but only if it's a slow news day.

If a train and a road vehicle collide it becomes state wide front page news...that's the obvious difference.

Mike.So as a political insider you are confirming that state budget funds are allocated depending on what is on the front page of the paper!

BG
BrentonGolding

Newspapers these days, as was proven at the 2014 state election have little political influence.

I was attempting to convey the difference in two cars crashing into each other at a set of lights Vs a train and a car which always draws far more publicity due to the dramatic images that are inevitably reported in all the variations of the 21st Century media.

Mike
  HardWorkingMan Chief Commissioner

Location: Echuca

And if two cars collide at the any of those intersections, it might make the news but only if it's a slow news day.

If a train and a road vehicle collide it becomes state wide front page news...that's the obvious difference.

Mike.So as a political insider you are confirming that state budget funds are allocated depending on what is on the front page of the paper!

BG
Newspapers these days, as was proven at the 2014 state election have little political influence.

I was attempting to convey the difference in two cars crashing into each other at a set of lights Vs a train and a car which always draws far more publicity due to the dramatic images that are inevitably reported in all the variations of the 21st Century media.

Mike
The Vinelander
Cars run into each other at traffic lights several times each hour. It's so common it's boring unless you are involved. Train crashes are relatively rare hence the bigger coverage. Buses and Trucks make the news for the same reason trains, buses and trucks have relatively few crashes compared to cars on a km covered between accident basis.  
one thing I have noticed
Cars have problems with motorbikes
Cars have problems with trucks
Cars have problems with buses
cars have problems with trams
Cars have problems with trains
Cars have problems with cyclists
Yet it is the motorbikes, trucks, buses, trams, trains and cyclists that are the problem!
I think I can see a common factor here
  jakar Assistant Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
Toolamba to Echuca line has been downgraded from being under absolute occupation to being completely booked out of service on account of sleeper condition, geometry faults, and failing culverts.



(didn't deem it necessary to start a new thread just for this and this was the most recent+relevent thread a google search came up with)

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