Premier Dan announces Western Distributor off Westgate AND a new tunnel

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 30 Apr 2015 19:55
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia

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  True Believers Chief Commissioner

bevans
Nope, these are not marginal seats. How does a toll road swing seats towards LNP. LNP would of built the same thing, instead passing though Brooklyn and Sunshine, instead widening the existing freeway alignment.

LNP doesn't even have any public transport alternative for the west of Melbourne. So why would they switch government.

ALP is already gonna widen roads throughout the western suburbs, throughout its next term. LNP has zilch.
ALP going to remove a crossing in Williamstown, two crossings in Werribee and one more in Aircraft. LNP wanna grade seperate roads instead.

Sure thing there hasn't been a rail centric project in the west, if you exclude the Ballarat upgrades, Regional Rail Link, a station in Caroline Springs, & removing the Altona shuttle service. Of course they could do much better, such as improving the Werribee line and Regional Rail Link (make it a metro service eventually). As well as improving other modes, especially buses.

But this West Gate Tunnel, as bad as a project it is, would not necessary be the total reason for the seats swinging.
Crime is a major issue in the west and due to the LNP scare tactics may persuade some voters. That sudden decision with the Youth Justice centre in Werribee may change voters stance on the west.

But Infrastructure unlikely would be a main reason, due to the LNP not showing any interest in rail projects, which is what the West Gate Tunnel protests want. ALP are the only ones that are delivering both public transit and roads. LNP only interested in roads.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Article on news saying Ausytalianhas overspent on roads although it looks incomplete. Why how is MELBOURNE going with yet another huge road project ?
  Carnot Minister for Railways
  Carnot Minister for Railways

I find it ironic that both Dan Andrews and Matthew Guy don't support the Melbourne City Council's (good) proposal to further reduce car access in the CBD.  It's especially not surprising since Dan's big huge ugly traffic sewer will funnel 1000's more cars into the North of the CBD...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-21/melbourne-city-council-considers-sweeping-changes-to-push-cars/9892998
  Radioman Chief Train Controller

Hello All,

Bernie Finn is not a reliable purveyor of facts , and their are times when one wonders if he is indulging in illicit substances that the LP believes is only consumed by young people, and as Bernie is no longer young therefore this is not possible,

Best wishes and regards , Radioman
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Dictator Dan wants to extend Citylink tolls for another 10 years to fund this boondoggle:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/citylink-tolls-extended-for-decade-to-pay-for-west-gate-tunnel/news-story/7f2186f8e6890afa1d3ef12be3ba6bc4

Roads like this are never the answer.  Should've built a rail tunnel to Newport instead.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Dictator Dan wants to extend Citylink tolls for another 10 years to fund this boondoggle:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/citylink-tolls-extended-for-decade-to-pay-for-west-gate-tunnel/news-story/7f2186f8e6890afa1d3ef12be3ba6bc4

Roads like this are never the answer.  Should've built a rail tunnel to Newport instead.
Carnot

The Westgate Tunnel Project will deliver an additional 50,000 cars into the docklands area daily and has been requested of Dan by the road transport lobby.  This project is simply horrible and you would be lucky to find a project of this type being built in any sophisticated city of this size globally.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Dictator Dan wants to extend Citylink tolls for another 10 years to fund this boondoggle:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/citylink-tolls-extended-for-decade-to-pay-for-west-gate-tunnel/news-story/7f2186f8e6890afa1d3ef12be3ba6bc4

Roads like this are never the answer.  Should've built a rail tunnel to Newport instead.

The Westgate Tunnel Project will deliver an additional 50,000 cars into the docklands area daily and has been requested of Dan by the road transport lobby.  This project is simply horrible and you would be lucky to find a project of this type being built in any sophisticated city of this size globally.
x31
Agree.  It'll be the go-to case-study in University lectures around the world for decades to come in "Poor Urban Transport Planning".   Dan Andrews should hang his head in shame.  And for that matter any politician that supports similar projects (I'm looking at you, Denis Napthine).
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

…………………...............................................................

But Mr Andrews said it was “wrong” to suggest the new project wouldn’t benefit all motorists by adding another piece to the city’s road network.

“All it takes is one crash to turn the West Gate Bridge into a car park. We desperately need this second river crossing and we’re not wasting a minute delivering it,” he said.
D Andrews, Herald Sun


The myth of the second river crossing. The only way to provide redundancy is to limit traffic on both the bridge and the tunnel to 50% capacity (or variations of such). Assume both are of equal capacity and each is operating at 80%. When one fails, the other has to operate at 160%. A smaller car park perhaps.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

"Earth calling IBAC, we might have a serious conflict of interest here":

  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
This is not unexpected given the amount of corruption I have witnessed myself in Government. Pallas should immediately resign.  Further, were the shares declared?  Either way, the contract should be immediately suspended and an independent inquiry immediately convened.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

This is not unexpected given the amount of corruption I have witnessed myself in Government. Pallas should immediately resign.  Further, were the shares declared?  Either way, the contract should be immediately suspended and an independent inquiry immediately convened.
bevans
He'll find a way to worm his way out of it, I'm sure.

Prediction:
- He will quickly sell his shares.
- Say "I'm sorry for this oversight and error of judgment".
- Nothing happens.

Rinse, repeat...
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Pallas should immediately resign.  
"bevans"
No. Pallas should immediately be ignominiously sacked.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
I can live with that.
  John E Locomotive Fireman

I am very confused how $7.5 Billion of Revenue in today's dollars becomes $37.3 Billion in 2045 - is inflation going to increase by 500%? i must be missing something here.

Overall this is not a good deal for Victoria however it's very misleading to say that a $4 billion contribution from Transurban results in $37.3 Billion of extra tolls.


"The report shows, by 2044-45, tolls on the new West Gate Tunnel and on the existing CityLink would be worth $7.5 billion in today's dollars.
In nominal terms not adjusted for inflation, the report estimates toll revenue from the CityLink extension and new tolls on the West Gate Tunnel would generate $37.3 billion in 2044–45"
  Carnot Minister for Railways

I am very confused how $7.5 Billion of Revenue in today's dollars becomes $37.3 Billion in 2045 - is inflation going to increase by 500%? i must be missing something here.

Overall this is not a good deal for Victoria however it's very misleading to say that a $4 billion contribution from Transurban results in $37.3 Billion of extra tolls.


"The report shows, by 2044-45, tolls on the new West Gate Tunnel and on the existing CityLink would be worth $7.5 billion in today's dollars.
In nominal terms not adjusted for inflation, the report estimates toll revenue from the CityLink extension and new tolls on the West Gate Tunnel would generate $37.3 billion in 2044–45"
John E
That's $7.5 billion which would translate to about $15 billion in 2045 with current inflation model, then add traffic volume increase forecasts and it could get close to $37 billion.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Pallas should immediately resign.  
No. Pallas should immediately be ignominiously sacked.
Valvegear

This is criminal behaviour.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Now the truth is about to begin on this traffic sewer!

  Carnot Minister for Railways

Apparently this project is running into dramas with contaminated soil and the CFMEU are up in arms about it.  This is a shocker of a project.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Who'd have thunk digging under the main sewer and land that has been used for industrial purposes since Melbourne was founded would mean contaminated soil?
  Carnot Minister for Railways

And this project goes from bad to disastrous.  Asbestos, PFAS, and just about every toxin known to humanity means workers are laid off and nothing is dug.  Cancel this boondoggle now.

  justarider Chief Commissioner

Location: Free at last, free at last
If you really want to read a vitriolic diatribe from a bunch if anti ALP trolls, just follow the twitter above for the big load of false factoid tripe.

Just like a couple of weeks ago with MM1, the contractor tries to strong arm the govt to get compensation for their cost overruns.

Too bad neither projects have a side "letter of comfort" to allow getting out of the contract, something they will have to meet.

A few minor facts.
They have been digging for 2 years and always knew there was nasty stuff underground. A lot has been removed already from the Eastern portal.
Despite what some trolls are saying, the tunel is nowhere near Coode Island.

There is massive clean-up facility prepared for bad soil.
Maybe it's not big enough or will cost too much to run - who knows, but the contractor did thier estimates and now have to make it work.

Cheers
John
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Still lots of questions though. At least MM1 has decent benefits and isn't a traffic sewer.

Clearly the Environmental study was botched/rushed.

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