Call to reinstate Limestone Coast rail line

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 26 Aug 2020 12:38
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
The business case looks solid making the investment easier. This is one for Freight Victoria when you consider the trains now running between border town and melbourne with timber. 

Intermodal our of mount gambier also another source.

Call to reinstate Limestone Coast rail line

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  NSWGR8022 Deputy Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
NSWGR8022
People with expertise claim it doesn't stack up so nothing will happen.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
NSWGR8022
At a guess,
Need joint state support and submit a business case to Infrastructure Australia for approval and funding, but I doubt the feds will pick up 100% of the bill, so SA and Vic will need to get on board.

Good news, regardless.
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
NSWGR8022
At a guess,
Need joint state support and submit a business case to Infrastructure Australia for approval and funding, but I doubt the feds will pick up 100% of the bill, so SA and Vic will need to get on board.

Good news, regardless.
"RTT_Rules"


You missed this bit........

"The reinstatement of the line between Mount Gambier and Wolseley was evaluated by CSIRO but was found to have a very low economic benefit to the region and incur a much greater cost to reinstate than the Heywood line."

No benefit for SA.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
At a guess,
Need joint state support and submit a business case to Infrastructure Australia for approval and funding, but I doubt the feds will pick up 100% of the bill, so SA and Vic will need to get on board.

Good news, regardless.
You missed this bit........

"The reinstatement of the line between Mount Gambier and Wolseley was evaluated by CSIRO but was found to have a very low economic benefit to the region and incur a much greater cost to reinstate than the Heywood line."

No benefit for SA.
bingley hall
Just like last time......
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
At a guess,
Need joint state support and submit a business case to Infrastructure Australia for approval and funding, but I doubt the feds will pick up 100% of the bill, so SA and Vic will need to get on board.

Good news, regardless.
You missed this bit........

"The reinstatement of the line between Mount Gambier and Wolseley was evaluated by CSIRO but was found to have a very low economic benefit to the region and incur a much greater cost to reinstate than the Heywood line."

No benefit for SA.
Just like last time......
james.au
I visited Naracoorte last year and the former railway was In a very sad state.

Most of the level crossings had been demolished and road pavement resealed.

Random sections of track had been removed for construction of walkway.

There were some trees up to two foot In diameter growing between the rails.

The opportunity to re-gauge the former broad gauge line slammed shut about 20 years ago, total rebuild would be the only option (If the funding could be found)
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
The local community and politicians of the area have done the numbers and a rail link stacks up.

What happens next?
At a guess,
Need joint state support and submit a business case to Infrastructure Australia for approval and funding, but I doubt the feds will pick up 100% of the bill, so SA and Vic will need to get on board.

Good news, regardless.
You missed this bit........

"The reinstatement of the line between Mount Gambier and Wolseley was evaluated by CSIRO but was found to have a very low economic benefit to the region and incur a much greater cost to reinstate than the Heywood line."

No benefit for SA.
Just like last time......
I visited Naracoorte last year and the former railway was In a very sad state.

Most of the level crossings had been demolished and road pavement resealed.

Random sections of track had been removed for construction of walkway.

There were some trees up to two foot In diameter growing between the rails.

The opportunity to re-gauge the former broad gauge line slammed shut about 20 years ago, total rebuild would be the only option (If the funding could be found)
Nightfire
Just to clarify

The line between Mt G and Worsley is a dead duck which I didn't think was big focus anyway as the bulk of the freight traffic has always been east towards Portland, not north.

So from what I understand CSIRO has confirmed
- Mt G to Heywood is viable
- Mt G to Worsley is not

I last drove along this corridor in around Dec 1997 and it wasn't a bed of roses then, so I'm assuming its alot worse now and yes regardless of the corridor they want to reopen, its basically 100% sleeper replacement, completely new ballast, reinstatement of LX etc etc etc. Maybe, just maybe some of rail is ok and fit for modern trains.

Bonus, the ROW and most of the earthworks was paid for 100 years ago.

The line will not run through town again and realistically the rest of the line in the town should be removed as part of the funding deal. They will most likely build a transfer yard on the outskirts of Mt G next to the timber mill which I assume is a potential customer? (and also removed the pesky railway within their grounds)
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
It's 'Wolseley'.
  SinickleBird Assistant Commissioner

Location: Qantas Club at Mudgee International Airport
Thank you, Vinelander.

For the life of me, I couldn’t understand why they would connect Mt Gambier to Western Australia.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia


You missed this bit........

"The reinstatement of the line between Mount Gambier and Wolseley was evaluated by CSIRO but was found to have a very low economic benefit to the region and incur a much greater cost to reinstate than the Heywood line."

No benefit for SA.
bingley hall

There is plenty of benefit to SA and Vic and the country and communities in between.  The CSIRO could not run a chook raffle.

New intermodal logs are a key example of why it is needed.  Woodchipping to the Port of Portland the other.  Add some intermodal. BINGO.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Forget about the former SAR line from Mt Gambier to Wolseley. That is a dead horse.

The former VR line from Heywood to Mt Gambier though, that is bit different. Both states could potentially benefit from it, but both states will need to fund it. I think we can forget the feds wanting to have anything to do with any of it.

Unfortunately I believe it will be like the Moulamein line, both states will wait for the other to get off their behinds, and nothing will happen.
  brownhillboy Train Controller

Forget about the former SAR line from Mt Gambier to Wolseley. That is a dead horse.

The former VR line from Heywood to Mt Gambier though, that is bit different. Both states could potentially benefit from it, but both states will need to fund it. I think we can forget the feds wanting to have anything to do with any of it.

Unfortunately I believe it will be like the Moulamein line, both states will wait for the other to get off their behinds, and nothing will happen.
Gman_86
Progression of a proposed intermodal terminal at Portland North, and the never used hardstand area at Hamilton would be much more cost effective.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
The advantage of using rail becomes evident here rail is closest to the customer you get. This is why it is so valuable in the USA and Europe as sidings and connections to customers are used.

The timber industry will benefit from the same approach.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Thank you, Vinelander.

For the life of me, I couldn’t understand why they would connect Mt Gambier to Western Australia.
SinickleBird

Yeah, sorry force of habit, our largest supplier is from Worsley WA.

...but technically connecting to Wolseley is connecting to SA and WA. (weak I know)
  Jack Le Lievre Assistant Commissioner

Location: Moolap Station, Vic
Jeez, you lot know how to flog a dead horse. Don't you!
As previously pointed out in the Bordertown Thread.

"Brian, it has been pointed out to you across countless Threads that the S.A. Government has no interest in Intrastate Freight."

"Also, the Victorian Government won't reopen the Heywood-Mt. Gambier Line either."



If either Government has changed their minds in recent times, please, by all means, lets us all know. Show your work, provide links. The trucking lobby in this neck of the woods has deep pockets and the ears of both sides politics.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Jeez, you lot know how to flog a dead horse. Don't you!
As previously pointed out in the Bordertown Thread.

"Brian, it has been pointed out to you across countless Threads that the S.A. Government has no interest in Intrastate Freight."

"Also, the Victorian Government won't reopen the Heywood-Mt. Gambier Line either."

If either Government has changed their minds in recent times, please, by all means, lets us all know. Show your work, provide links. The trucking lobby in this neck of the woods has deep pockets and the ears of both sides politics.
Jack Le Lievre

As the trucking lobby 'has deep pockets' they should be stumping up a levy to keep the Princes Hwy in a reasonable shape. With the very wet winter I bet it's worse than a goat track along there...something the logical utilisation of rail would solve from several aspects.

Having said that and tucked away in the far south east corner of SA, the Marshall government has form regards anything SA regional rail and will unlikely be getting into this discussion.

Mike.

Mike.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
The Heywood line may actually be favourably seen by ARTC given it might increase traffic on the Maroona-Portland line, and the DIRN more broadly.

Exec summary says 254kt would divert to rail, mainly (75%) paper products moving to distribution centres.  Forestry supply chains were judged to not be contestable based on the new data they collected, unless there was a significant changes to the cost structure of log haul traffic

Some of the graphics are a little ambiguous but it suggests that these DCs are in Melbourne but also Sydney and that a rail service to Sydney might be financially viable.  It says that perhaps 33% of the traffic is Sydney bound, which equates to about 83ktpa.  And 15% of this is to Brisbane (38ktpa). This would be on top of any Melbourne traffic which could get dropped off on the way (similar volumes to Sydney - 76ktpa).


Now, i need to go through the report in a bit more detail as its not the most well written report ive seen, but those numbers are rail viable volumes, even if at the lower end of the rail volume levels.

The only thing thats not clear is the cost to do up the line.  The CSIRO report helps identify the benefits, but there is nothing on the cost side. With $15mpa benefit per year, that does give some benefit but we would want to see line restoration and intermodal terminal costs under say $200m for it to make sense I think.  Who would fund that is the key question...

Anyone know what Heywood-Mt Gambier looks like?
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia

As the trucking lobby 'has deep pockets' they should be stumping up a levy to keep the Princes Hwy in a reasonable shape. With the very wet winter I bet it's worse than a goat track along there...something the logical utilisation of rail would solve from several aspects.

Having said that and tucked away in the far south east corner of SA, the Marshall government has form regards anything SA regional rail and will unlikely be getting into this discussion.

Mike.

Mike.
The Vinelander

Hand it over to ARTC to complete the work and operate the track.  The volumes and the destinations clearly fall into the interstate traffic category and not intrastate.

I would not trust the SA Government to deliver a pizza.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Hand it over to ARTC to complete the work and operate the track.
Yeah; great idea - you too could have something like the Melbourne to Albury fiasco.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Kimberly Clarke have a purpose built SG yard and access at Millicent obviously the line would need to be connected back to the main source of traffic.
  BigShunter Chief Commissioner

Location: St Clair. S.A.
The only thing thats not clear is the cost to do up the line.  The CSIRO report helps identify the benefits, but there is nothing on the cost side. With $15mpa benefit per year, that does give some benefit but we would want to see line restoration and intermodal terminal costs under say $200m for it to make sense I think.  Who would fund that is the key question...

Anyone know what Heywood-Mt Gambier looks like?[/quote]

Well james, mum has a fair idea what Heywood looks like.........she lives there ! But I assume you mean the line, wouldn't matter, complete dismantle and scalped back to the trackbed and start again.

How much $$$  '' to do up the line '' well $ 750,000 to $1,000,000 per Kilometre would be a rough estimate. The line through Avoca was around the $750 mark.

There's also a fair sort of bridge over the Glenelge River wonder what the condition that's in ?

Hope it's not this one..

https://www.slv.vic.gov.au/pictoria/gid/slv-pic-aab77906

If it's this, doesn't look too shaby..

https://www.flickr.com/photos/25245971@N08/43908679630/in/photostream/

Has anyone who is going to shift all these woodchips thought about how and where they will be loaded and unloaded...hmmmm

BigShunter.
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
Hand it over to ARTC to complete the work and operate the track.
Yeah; great idea - you too could have something like the Melbourne to Albury fiasco.
Valvegear
You're assuming Vline would give a smeg outside of the pass network. Big clue here, they dont and in some cases are worse.
  NSWGR8022 Deputy Commissioner

Location: From the lands of Journalism and Free Speech
The Heywood line may actually be favourably seen by ARTC given it might increase traffic on the Maroona-Portland line, and the DIRN more broadly.

Exec summary says 254kt would divert to rail, mainly (75%) paper products moving to distribution centres.  Forestry supply chains were judged to not be contestable based on the new data they collected, unless there was a significant changes to the cost structure of log haul traffic

Some of the graphics are a little ambiguous but it suggests that these DCs are in Melbourne but also Sydney and that a rail service to Sydney might be financially viable.  It says that perhaps 33% of the traffic is Sydney bound, which equates to about 83ktpa.  And 15% of this is to Brisbane (38ktpa). This would be on top of any Melbourne traffic which could get dropped off on the way (similar volumes to Sydney - 76ktpa).


Now, i need to go through the report in a bit more detail as its not the most well written report ive seen, but those numbers are rail viable volumes, even if at the lower end of the rail volume levels.

The only thing thats not clear is the cost to do up the line.  The CSIRO report helps identify the benefits, but there is nothing on the cost side. With $15mpa benefit per year, that does give some benefit but we would want to see line restoration and intermodal terminal costs under say $200m for it to make sense I think.  Who would fund that is the key question...

Anyone know what Heywood-Mt Gambier looks like?
james.au

Did the report also state the CO2 reductions by changing modes?
  hilly Locomotive Fireman

Location: Mount Gambier
Kimberly Clarke have a purpose built SG yard and access at Millicent obviously the line would need to be connected back to the main source of traffic.
bevans
The area around the old Mount Gambier station has been converted at great expense into a recreational area and the rail alignment for several km to the east and west has been made into bitumenised rail trail. This effectively cuts off the Millicent branch and the line to Penola and north to Wolseley and it is very unlikely that this could be changed now.
As has been pointed out by others there would have to be loading/unloading area east of Mount Gambier.
The question is now whether anyone is willing to pay for this and the rail upgrade and operate the line, and of course persuade people to use it.

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