New Trams and Trains in Vic Budget

 

News article: New Trams and Trains in Vic Budget

Premier Daniel Andrews earlier announced a $2 billion budget spend on building 100 new trams, 100 metropolitan trains and a large expansion of the regional train fleet.

  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Premier Daniel Andrews earlier announced a $2 billion budget spend on building 100 new trams, 100 metropolitan trains and a large expansion of the regional train fleet.

The investment will provide greater certainty to rolling stock manufacturers and suppliers, which employ up to 10,000 people in Victoria, Mr Andrews said.
New Trams and Trains in Vic Budget


100 new metropolitan trains is a big investment.  Andrew's continues to pout his money where is mouth is.

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  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Any extra announcments due, iemore train drivers to drive them ????

Regards,
David Head
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Is a good point. As the network has more trains and trams who will drive them ?

Where will they be stored ?
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Is a good point. As the network has more trains and trams who will drive them ?

Where will they be stored ?
freightgate

There are plans for a stabling facility to be built past Frankston and I believe there are more stabling facilities being built ar Calder Park.  I guess we would need to know what lines the new trains would be running on so we then know where they would need to be stored.

As for trams.  Someone must know.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
As for trams.  Someone must know.
bevans
I believe that Southbank and Preston depots have recently been expanded to handle additional trams. It's possible that more are being expanded.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
New stabling/maintenance facilities are planned to be built at the end of each line - already done at Epping, Craigieburn and Calder Park and will continue with
  • Pakenham East (maintenance & stabling)
  • Baxter (maintenance & stabling, possibly replacing Frankston & Carrum stabling)
  • Lilydale/Coldstream (maintenance & stabling, replacing Bayswater Workshops)
  • Mernda (stabling only, supporting Epping Workshops)

All detailed in the PTV 2012 Network Development Plan.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
New stabling/maintenance facilities are planned to be built at the end of each line - already done at Epping, Craigieburn and Calder Park and will continue with
  • Pakenham East (maintenance & stabling)
  • Baxter (maintenance & stabling, possibly replacing Frankston & Carrum stabling)
  • Lilydale/Coldstream (maintenance & stabling, replacing Bayswater Workshops)
  • Mernda (stabling only, supporting Epping Workshops)

All detailed in the PTV 2012 Network Development Plan.
LancedDendrite

The Coldstream option sounds like a good idea.  Plenty of space out that way.

Within what timeframe is Baxter to be built?
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
Baxter was listed as part of 'stage two' works in the plan - within 15 years, so roughly 2022-2027.
  msilsby Deputy Commissioner

Location: Canberra
Trains and trams are to be purchased over a 10 year period, and interestingly, the rolling stock is mentioned as 'new' stock, not 'additional' stock.

As such, trams will probably see a one for one with Z's, while I imagine a similar plan for Metro rolling stock.
  whippit Beginner

Location: Eaglemont, Victoria
The total amount of trams will be significantly decreasing. Seems it will be replaced on a capacity-to-capacity basis, so there will be some route consolidation, frequency cuts.
  msilsby Deputy Commissioner

Location: Canberra
From an article on the Railway Gazette [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Here[/font];

"AUSTRALIA: The Victoria state government has allocated more than A$6bn for rail investment in its 2015-16 budget, announced by Treasurer Tim Pallas on May 5.

The headline element is A$2bn for rolling stock investment as the first tranche of a 10-year programme to strengthen local public transport and revitalise the state’s domestic rolling stock manufacturing industry. Other spending includes up to A$2·4bn over four years towards the removal of 50 of Victoria’s most dangerous level crossings, A$1·5bn for planning, design and early construction of the Melbourne Metro Rail cross-city link, and up to A$220m for the Murray Basin Rail Project.

Entitled Trains, Trams, Jobs 2015-25, the Victorian Rolling Stock Strategy unveiled by Premier Daniel Andrews on May 4 envisages the construction of 100 suburban EMUs, 100 new trams and additional regional trainsets to support a ‘massive expansion’ of regional services.
Noting that the local rolling stock industry supported up to 10 000 jobs, Andrews said not a single tram had been ordered in the past four years. Meanwhile, Melbourne’s population was continuing to grow rapidly. He predicted that ‘as we transform our public transport system with projects like Melbourne Metro Rail, patronage will grow to more than 1 billion passengers/year by 2031’.
According to state Transport Minister Jacinta Allan, ‘the number of people using our public transport is growing twice as fast as our population. Without this critical investment and a long-term plan for rolling stock, our network would grind to a halt.’

The A$2bn first tranche in the 2015-16 budget includes five more Alstom X’Trapolis EMUs (A$90m) for the suburban network and 37 high capacity EMUs to operate Melbourne Metro Rail (A$1·3bn), a further 20 Bombardier E-Class trams (A$274m) and 21 extra VLocity DMU cars from Bombardier to work regional services (A$257). Another A$75m has been allocated for life-extension of the ageing Comeng EMUs which still make up around half of the suburban fleet and A$21m for similar work on the B-Class articulated trams.

Andrews said ‘all new train and tram orders will be procured to ensure the best value for Victorians’, adding that the Labor government would require 50% local content in all future train and tram orders, ‘supporting local industry and providing new opportunities for skills, training and employment. Victoria is the only state that makes trams and trains. We want to see these industries grow and employ more people, which is why we’re investing strongly.'"

Victorian Rolling Stock Strategy available Here in PDF and DocX format.


Yikes. EMU's work out at $18m each, while the E-Class work out at $13.7 - although I do believe that the trams come with 10 years of maintenance.



http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/trains-trams-jobs-2015-2025
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/single-view/view/victoria-budget-kicks-off-10-year-rolling-stock-spend.html
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

Location: Banned
From an article on the Railway Gazette [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Here[/font];

"AUSTRALIA: The Victoria state government has allocated more than A$6bn for rail investment in its 2015-16 budget, announced by Treasurer Tim Pallas on May 5.

The headline element is A$2bn for rolling stock investment as the first tranche of a 10-year programme to strengthen local public transport and revitalise the state’s domestic rolling stock manufacturing industry. Other spending includes up to A$2·4bn over four years towards the removal of 50 of Victoria’s most dangerous level crossings, A$1·5bn for planning, design and early construction of the Melbourne Metro Rail cross-city link, and up to A$220m for the Murray Basin Rail Project.

Entitled Trains, Trams, Jobs 2015-25, the Victorian Rolling Stock Strategy unveiled by Premier Daniel Andrews on May 4 envisages the construction of 100 suburban EMUs, 100 new trams and additional regional trainsets to support a ‘massive expansion’ of regional services.
Noting that the local rolling stock industry supported up to 10 000 jobs, Andrews said not a single tram had been ordered in the past four years. Meanwhile, Melbourne’s population was continuing to grow rapidly. He predicted that ‘as we transform our public transport system with projects like Melbourne Metro Rail, patronage will grow to more than 1 billion passengers/year by 2031’.
According to state Transport Minister Jacinta Allan, ‘the number of people using our public transport is growing twice as fast as our population. Without this critical investment and a long-term plan for rolling stock, our network would grind to a halt.’

The A$2bn first tranche in the 2015-16 budget includes five more Alstom X’Trapolis EMUs (A$90m) for the suburban network and 37 high capacity EMUs to operate Melbourne Metro Rail (A$1·3bn), a further 20 Bombardier E-Class trams (A$274m) and 21 extra VLocity DMU cars from Bombardier to work regional services (A$257). Another A$75m has been allocated for life-extension of the ageing Comeng EMUs which still make up around half of the suburban fleet and A$21m for similar work on the B-Class articulated trams.

Andrews said ‘all new train and tram orders will be procured to ensure the best value for Victorians’, adding that the Labor government would require 50% local content in all future train and tram orders, ‘supporting local industry and providing new opportunities for skills, training and employment. Victoria is the only state that makes trams and trains. We want to see these industries grow and employ more people, which is why we’re investing strongly.'"

Victorian Rolling Stock Strategy available Here in PDF and DocX format.


Yikes. EMU's work out at $18m each, while the E-Class work out at $13.7 - although I do believe that the trams come with 10 years of maintenance.



http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/trains-trams-jobs-2015-2025
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/single-view/view/victoria-budget-kicks-off-10-year-rolling-stock-spend.html
msilsby
Actually for a 6 car Train $18m is relatively cheap. Although for X Traps which are in my view crap trains it is too much. One suspects they are that expensive because it is such a small order!!! London Crossrail 9 Car Trains will be about $27 Million

21 DMU Carriages at $257 Million, that works out to about $37 Million for a three car train. That is bloody ridiculous. $37 Million for a train that goes 100mph!!

Michael
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville

21 DMU Carriages at $257 Million, that works out to about $37 Million for a three car train. That is bloody ridiculous. $37 Million for a train that goes 100mph!!

Michael
mejhammers1

Quite clearly stated elsewhere that this also includes a new maintenance and stabling facility at Waurn Ponds.

Bloody ridiculous people can't do a bit of research before posting Razz
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

Location: Banned
Quite clearly stated elsewhere that this also includes a new maintenance and stabling facility at Waurn Ponds.

Bloody ridiculous people can't do a bit of research before posting Razz
bingley hall
Alright Bing, how much is the Maintenance Facility going to cost! $70 Million. Ok that's down to $27 Million per 3 Car Train. Still too expensive!!!


Michael
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
Alright Bing, how much is the Maintenance Facility going to cost! $70 Million. Ok that's down to $27 Million per 3 Car Train. Still too expensive!!!


Michael
mejhammers1

The figure is around $6.5m per car.
  TedHanson Junior Train Controller

The price for the V/Locity cars will be the same as for the current order. The cost for XTraps has been the same for a decade - $18 million for a six car set. The additional trams will be slightly more expansive than the current order due to the inflation factor contained in the original order for the exercising of options.

It's a pity that related costs like on going maintenance, stabling facilities and other assorted addons aren't given separate line  items within the budget papers. But of course, the whole point of the Budget Papers is to make things as difficult to find out as possible. That was Kennett's plan when they moved to the current format, and successive government have only made it worse (from our viewpoint anyway). People want to know what you are going to spend, on what, and when and how the revenue to pay for it will be raised. The cash surplus figure is far more illustrative than that offered by the "accrual accounting" derived surplus figure given headline treatment. It only needs to be ten pages. The rest is crap designed to confuse.
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
New stabling/maintenance facilities are planned to be built at the end of each line - already done at Epping, Craigieburn and Calder Park and will continue with
  • Pakenham East (maintenance & stabling)
  • Baxter (maintenance & stabling, possibly replacing Frankston & Carrum stabling)
  • Lilydale/Coldstream (maintenance & stabling, replacing Bayswater Workshops)
  • Mernda (stabling only, supporting Epping Workshops)

All detailed in the PTV 2012 Network Development Plan.
LancedDendrite
Do you have a link to this plan? Adding stabling at Baxter and Coldstream will require extension of the overhead in both cases and re-construction of the line as well in the case of Coldstream. Quite ambitious projects?
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Do you have a link to this plan? Adding stabling at Baxter and Coldstream will require extension of the overhead in both cases and re-construction of the line as well in the case of Coldstream. Quite ambitious projects?
TheBlacksmith
Have a look on the PTV website. Also if I remember correctly there is a video on YouTube.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
Do you have a link to this plan? Adding stabling at Baxter and Coldstream will require extension of the overhead in both cases and re-construction of the line as well in the case of Coldstream. Quite ambitious projects?
TheBlacksmith
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ptv+network+development+plan&l=1

Baxter electrification is not hard. The line exists, the frequency of traffic is low. Duplication will be unnecessary if existing service frequencies are maintained i.e extending some Frankston services but not most of them.

The choice of Lilydale vs Coldstream will come down to the size of the maintenance facility and what will happen with the Maroondah Highway level crossing removal. The Coldstream option has more readily acquired land available but it's mostly private or leased. The costs can be offset by selling off or redeveloping parts of Lilydale yard. The Lilydale option requires less (but still some) land acquisition in order to relocate the station out of Lilydale yard, most likely to the Up side of Maroondah Highway.

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