That Referendum / Postal Survey

 
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
A report in this mornings Melbourne Age tells of a woman in Brunswick who found 17 unopened mail-outs in her backyard near the kids' cubby house.
You have to wonder at the amount of credibility the survey results will have.
Valvegear
Assumption is that for votes lost that are roughly lost in the same ratio as the national tally/

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  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
People are losing contracts because they oppose SSM:
Let's stick to facts. One person was fired.
And whilst on the subject, two people lost their planned wedding venue (Ebenezer in Ballarat) because they're in favour of SSM. I didn't see you commenting on that.
Valvegear
Highly unlikely she was fired because of her opinion to SSM, likely a long list of issues leading up to this and her attitude and/or behaviour.
  Big J Deputy Commissioner

Location: In Paradise
A report in this mornings Melbourne Age tells of a woman in Brunswick who found 17 unopened mail-outs in her backyard near the kids' cubby house.
You have to wonder at the amount of credibility the survey results will have.
Valvegear
Yep, should have had a parliamentary vote on this in the past ten years. This is a serious waste of money.


The irony is that if there was a conscientious vote on this 10 years ago, it would have been likely a no vote in parliament. Because of their (both the ALP and LNP) delaying tactics, in the long run this will get up.

The usual crap will come out if there is a majority yes vote. Some of the no elected reps will say that they will vote along the lines of their electorate. What will the former PM TA do seeing that it will be highly likely the majority will vote yes. I bet he will be a weasel and vote no because it is a conscientious vote (irrespective of his electorate), something that he prevented when he was PM!

The hypocrisy of some of the elected reps is gob smacking. As I said all of them should hold their heads in shame, to put this nation through this crap, when a simple amendment is all is required. Like they do all of the time.

I look forward to the survey on Parliamentary salaries........ that will never happen.
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
The thing is Big J, there have been several votes in Parliament over the years and each time the No vote got though.   The last one when Gillard was PM.   Those voting No included Wong and Shorton.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Are only yes votes being counted so if you do not vote it is a default
No ?
  Carnot Minister for Railways

People are losing contracts because they oppose SSM:
Let's stick to facts. One person was fired.
And whilst on the subject, two people lost their planned wedding venue (Ebenezer in Ballarat) because they're in favour of SSM. I didn't see you commenting on that.
Highly unlikely she was fired because of her opinion to SSM, likely a long list of issues leading up to this and her attitude and/or behaviour.
RTT_Rules
I doubt it.  Read the details of the exchange.  It's pretty obviously discrimination on the part of the employer: http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/boss-fires-worker-over-same-sex-marriage-views/8961658

And if anyone thinks some in the legal profession don't have it in for those who hold the traditional view of marriage, read this:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/how-the-commissars-will-move-against-christianity/news-story/7c20eaf46796026f2d6c5735325b6ff1
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

People are losing contracts because they oppose SSM:
Let's stick to facts. One person was fired.
And whilst on the subject, two people lost their planned wedding venue (Ebenezer in Ballarat) because they're in favour of SSM. I didn't see you commenting on that.
Highly unlikely she was fired because of her opinion to SSM, likely a long list of issues leading up to this and her attitude and/or behaviour.
I doubt it.  Read the details of the exchange.  It's pretty obviously discrimination on the part of the employer: http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/boss-fires-worker-over-same-sex-marriage-views/8961658

And if anyone thinks some in the legal profession don't have it in for those who hold the traditional view of marriage, read this:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/how-the-commissars-will-move-against-christianity/news-story/7c20eaf46796026f2d6c5735325b6ff1
Carnot
Anything that Andrew Bolt writes can be taken with a pinch of extreme right wing salt. The guy is paranoid.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Funny how the leftists dismiss hard evidence purely because of who conveyed that information....

So many people shouting past each other.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Funny how the leftists dismiss hard evidence purely because of who conveyed that information....
Carnot

Funny how you only have one eye. Hard evidence is backed up with facts; hard evidence is not just one man's opinion, regardless of who he is. What Bolt commented on is speculation which happens to be in line with your religious wish list.
I've said it before - stick to the question. It's very simple - SSM; yes or no.
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

@Carnot, if that young lady had been sacked because she does not believe in SSM then that is wrong. It is her right to say no. What I cannot abide by is many on the no side spouting wild statements that are absolutely baseless because quite simply they believe that the Gay community should not exist.

Michael
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Funny how the leftists dismiss hard evidence purely because of who conveyed that information....

Funny how you only have one eye. Hard evidence is backed up with facts; hard evidence is not just one man's opinion, regardless of who he is. What Bolt commented on is speculation which happens to be in line with your religious wish list.
I've said it before - stick to the question. It's very simple - SSM; yes or no.
Valvegear
How is it speculation when he highlights exactly what the former Tasmanian Anti-Discrimination Tribunal boss Robin Banks said?

She's the one acting like a dictator.
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

@Carnot. I take everything that A Bolt, a right wing windbag with a pinch of salt. He champions people like F Nile and Margaret Court. Believe me I have no problem with those two of they simply had stated I believe that marriage is between a man and a woman. I have no problem with that even though I do not agree. But likening gays and lesbians to nazis, saying that most have been abused and other such filth, then expect that community to cop it sweet, then whinge when they fire back (quite rightly) about their loss of freedom of speech is just utter rubbish.

The Gay and Lesbian community has suffered from terrible discrimination from losing their jobs, to being shunned by family members, to being physically attacked. So I say to some in the no camp, grow some balls and stick to the question in hand and stop banging on about religious freedom crap.

Michael
  billybaxter Chief Commissioner

Location: Bosnia Park, Fairfield
The owner of a small company thinks an employee's action on Facebook could hurt business. Why wouldn't she sack her? It's her decision to make. All the arguments about letting managers manage and giving business owners to right to run their business as they see fit don't disappear just because a pretty young woman says she's a Christian.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
How is it speculation when he highlights exactly what the former Tasmanian Anti-Discrimination Tribunal boss Robin Banks said?
Carnot
I'll put this as simply as I can. What someone else said isn't relevant to what will happen here.
Banks cannot possibly be talking about what will happen - he can only speculate on what might happen and this suits people whose sole purpose is to complicate something easy with irrelevancies. The entire NO campaign is full of half truths, outright lies, and red herrings. The question is about equal rights.
Simple really.
  DJPeters Deputy Commissioner

There is of course an easy way to give everyone the same rights, simply do away with marriage altogether. These days it is simply a legal paper that allows two people to live together, it is a license really to have sex nothing more and it is still a religious type of thing. So get rid of it and introduce laws that give every person equal rights and it also removes any arguments as well about which side or faction you are on.

That way everyone wins, sort of, the religious fanatics will still complain though about it but laws of a country should be separated from religions of any sort!
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
There sure are a lot of people getting awfully distracted by a whole lot of crap on this topic.

Personally, I couldn't give 2 shiits why some knob in Canberra got sacked by their knob boss. Maybe it was just because she was vocal about voting no, or maybe that was just the last of many indescretions. Again, I don't really care. The thing is, anybody who forms an opinion based on one half of the story doesn't know what they are talking about, or they are just an idiot all together. Either way, it doesn't have anything to do with marriage equality.

As for Andrew Bolt. If I said what I really thought about that turd I would probably be banned.


This is not a vote on whether or not gay couples should be allowed to bring up children.

This is not a vote on the Safe Schools program.

This is not a vote on the religious freedoms of some compared to others.

This is not a vote on the specifics of Unfair dismissal policy in relation to contractors.

This isn't even a vote on weather or not Andrew Bolt is a complete and utter f#@kwit. (he most certainly is)

It is incredibly simple:

Should the marriage act be changed to allow same sex couples to marry?

That is the only question that needs to be answered. The rest is just a distraction thrown in to cloud the issue.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
@Carnot, if that young lady had been sacked because she does not believe in SSM then that is wrong. It is her right to say no. What I cannot abide by is many on the no side spouting wild statements that are absolutely baseless because quite simply they believe that the Gay community should not exist.

Michael
mejhammers1
I'm not going to read the article because I cannot be bothered nor do I care because more often that not there is alot more befre such an article than the headline makes out.

My humble opinion is that you would hard up to a boss who fires a perfectly satisfactory performing employee, because they support Gas Marriage and indicate this by doing nothing more than stating your preference on FB.  

IF and I IF the boss has fired her only for this reason, then she is better off and time to move on. Being 18, she will quickly find a more worthy boss to start her career with.
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

@Carnot. I take everything that A Bolt, a right wing windbag with a pinch of salt. He champions people like F Nile and Margaret Court. Believe me I have no problem with those two of they simply had stated I believe that marriage is between a man and a woman. I have no problem with that even though I do not agree. But likening gays and lesbians to nazis, saying that most have been abused and other such filth, then expect that community to cop it sweet, then whinge when they fire back (quite rightly) about their loss of freedom of speech is just utter rubbish.

The Gay and Lesbian community has suffered from terrible discrimination from losing their jobs, to being shunned by family members, to being physically attacked. So I say to some in the no camp, grow some balls and stick to the question in hand and stop banging on about religious freedom crap.

Michael
mejhammers1
That is what annoys me about Bolt and his acolytes. He can spray as much venomous opinion as he feels like but when some one retaliates he screams like the bully he really is. That is all he is, a bully.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I hope Bolt's fears do come true, I hope more than anything this vote goes yes, and we can drag back some morality toward community standard, away from the opinions of the religious.

It's time we stopped taking guidance on morality from religious persons.

I have said before, but I will say again, SSM going yes I hope will weaken the religious strangle hold holding us back from arguably even more important reforms like euthanasia and abortion.

I am tired of 'religious freedom' being used as an excuse for churches to legally discriminate, as a society it is time we stamp out discrimination in every area possible (and in some cases it is impossible to stamp out). Churches should have no exemption here.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

I hope Bolt's fears do come true, I hope more than anything this vote goes yes, and we can drag back some morality toward community standard, away from the opinions of the religious.

It's time we stopped taking guidance on morality from religious persons.

I have said before, but I will say again, SSM going yes I hope will weaken the religious strangle hold holding us back from arguably even more important reforms like euthanasia and abortion.

I am tired of 'religious freedom' being used as an excuse for churches to legally discriminate, as a society it is time we stamp out discrimination in every area possible (and in some cases it is impossible to stamp out). Churches should have no exemption here.
Aaron
Sounds like Maximilien Robespierre and Antonio Gramsci are inspiration for your totalitarianism.

Would you be keen to have a referendum to remove Section 116 from the Australian Constitution?
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
To ask (if I may) is why are we talking about this on a forum site dedicated to railways?
also most young people these days simply don't understand what all the fuss is about and why the right are all way going all mad about it (NO MAH traditions!)
To quote one of the few thing I agree with Marx on 'Religion is the opium of the masses'
apologies to any one who disagrees (I support the Yes side of the argument)Shocked
  Graham4405 The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Dalby Qld
It's time we stopped taking guidance on morality from religious persons.
Aaron
Totally agree, such guidance should only come from our Creator. Jeremiah 10:23, 24.
  petan Chief Commissioner

Location: Waiting to see a zebra using a zebra crossing!
The people I meet in real life groups including hobbies don't generally ask others about religion, political view point or marital status. If it is a train or aviation group, the talk is all about planes or trains etc. If it is one of my historical societies or similar, then the talk is about the topic of the group eg does anyone have material on event x that occurred in year Y. Occasionally around the coffee pot someone will get on their hobby horse about their political party but the rest of us soon learn how to change the subject away from that topic and onto something more enjoyable. Many in some of these groups know there are a couple of members who live with people of the same gender but the couple concerned are nice helpful knowledgeable folk so the topic is ignored.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Guidance from the supposed being you believe to be your creator Graham4405?

A being so wise, caring, moral and powerful that its only solution to controlling its mistake with man was to essentially wipe near every living from the face of the earth? That's a terrific piece of morality to follow don't you think?

So if one of your children or other miscellaneous decendants decides to enter into a same sex relationship you're going to shoot up everything that moves on their street and repopulate the houses with your more pure children?

I presume you're married, but I don't know, and don't care, if you are or ever intend to be married (clearly to a woman because 'God knows' you won't be a SSM person) do you expect your wife to behave according to the morals of Abraham in Ephesians 5:22? Do/are you going to have her submit to you, her husband, 'as the Lord'? For her sake I hope not, also please, don't try and pass on a shopping list to her through a burning bush, that didn't seem to go to plan either.

How about the divine morality of Moses asking us to kill the witches in Exodus 22

Perhaps we should gain some moral teaching from the alleged creator's advice in 1 Samuel 15:3?


But I understand, I am not a Christian; I am just no good at cherry picking...
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Totally agree, such guidance should only come from our Creator. Jeremiah 10:23, 24.
"Graham4405"
So, apparently Jeremiah was your creator. He's the one who gave you this information, and you mustn't listen to anyone else - you said so yourself.

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