Just a quick question
What locomotives apart from the 19 class
pushed coal hoppers up the coal stage?
Regards Mat
I'm not an expert, but the only two photos I have illustrating locos working on NSW coal stages show 3221 at Broadmeadow (1966), and 7328 at Port Waratah (1972, when there were still standard goods and 30T classes based there)Thanks duttonbay I was not even thinking a diesel went up there for the job
Google "NSWR coal stage", and a few variations on the theme, will return some images. Examples I found included 20 class on Enfield coal stage, and a 53 class on Broadmeadow's.Thanks NSWRcars I did google it but I googled NSWGR not NSWR and got a few
The large coal stages at Werris Creek, Broadmeadow, Port Waratah, Goulburn, Demondrille and Junee could use any engines depending on what was available at the time. They could be 19, 20, 30, 30T, 32, 50, 53, 55 or 59cl the later were used at BMD, while PTW used 19, 30T and SG engines. Enfield I only ever saw 20 or 30tank engines on the coal stage shunter, which worked every day M-F 730am - 3pm and Saturdays 6am - 2pmGoogle "NSWR coal stage", and a few variations on the theme, will return some images. Examples I found included 20 class on Enfield coal stage, and a 53 class on Broadmeadow's.Thanks NSWRcars I did google it but I googled NSWGR not NSWR and got a few
results so lesson learned drop the G
Regards Mat
Just out of interest, was the Parkes coal stage considered to be "large"?The large coal stages at Werris Creek, Broadmeadow, Port Waratah, Goulburn, Demondrille and Junee could use any engines depending on what was available at the time. They could be 19, 20, 30, 30T, 32, 50, 53, 55 or 59cl the later were used at BMD, while PTW used 19, 30T and SG engines. Enfield I only ever saw 20 or 30tank engines on the coal stage shunter, which worked every day M-F 730am - 3pm and Saturdays 6am - 2pmGoogle "NSWR coal stage", and a few variations on the theme, will return some images. Examples I found included 20 class on Enfield coal stage, and a 53 class on Broadmeadow's.Thanks NSWRcars I did google it but I googled NSWGR not NSWR and got a few
results so lesson learned drop the G
Regards Mat
JohnJust out of interest, was the Parkes coal stage considered to be "large"?The large coal stages at Werris Creek, Broadmeadow, Port Waratah, Goulburn, Demondrille and Junee could use any engines depending on what was available at the time. They could be 19, 20, 30, 30T, 32, 50, 53, 55 or 59cl the later were used at BMD, while PTW used 19, 30T and SG engines. Enfield I only ever saw 20 or 30tank engines on the coal stage shunter, which worked every day M-F 730am - 3pm and Saturdays 6am - 2pmGoogle "NSWR coal stage", and a few variations on the theme, will return some images. Examples I found included 20 class on Enfield coal stage, and a 53 class on Broadmeadow's.Thanks NSWRcars I did google it but I googled NSWGR not NSWR and got a few
results so lesson learned drop the G
Regards Mat
Those of us who did the 2 x 19 class tour (1904 / 1923) in 1972 were told they were kept as they were the only ones that could get up the Port Waratah coal stage. I never cross checked that depot's closure date against the withdrawal date for those two 19 class, as obviously they would need something to get up that stage after the 19 class were gone, assuming the depot lasted beyond that 19 class withdrawal.Petan, I know under the "normal" circumstances PTW did use standard goods engines on the coal stage shunter, more often than not 50cl, in later years though the use of 30T was common, as well as the 19cl.
As mentioned previously, I photographed 7328 shunting the coal stage at Port Waratah on 22/8/72Those of us who did the 2 x 19 class tour (1904 / 1923) in 1972 were told they were kept as they were the only ones that could get up the Port Waratah coal stage. I never cross checked that depot's closure date against the withdrawal date for those two 19 class, as obviously they would need something to get up that stage after the 19 class were gone, assuming the depot lasted beyond that 19 class withdrawal.Petan, I know under the "normal" circumstances PTW did use standard goods engines on the coal stage shunter, more often than not 50cl, in later years though the use of 30T was common, as well as the 19cl.
I also tend to remember as steam finished in most areas or close to the end, many of the bins were closed for economic reasons also many had rotting timbers and the amount of coal needed was diminishing almost daily.
That 73 class makes more sense as their introduction would fit the approx date of that tour so the 19 clould be retired which memory says was mid to late 1972. But I was basing my remarks on what the railfans and organisers were telling us, so likely it was a case of Chinese whispers. The main thing I remember of that day was being at the front middle door of the leading car with the tender first 19 class just in the immediate front of me and mesmerized by the operation of the inside cylinders, remembering that was the first and only time I had been up close to inside cylinders while they were hauling a train.As mentioned previously, I photographed 7328 shunting the coal stage at Port Waratah on 22/8/72Those of us who did the 2 x 19 class tour (1904 / 1923) in 1972 were told they were kept as they were the only ones that could get up the Port Waratah coal stage. I never cross checked that depot's closure date against the withdrawal date for those two 19 class, as obviously they would need something to get up that stage after the 19 class were gone, assuming the depot lasted beyond that 19 class withdrawal.Petan, I know under the "normal" circumstances PTW did use standard goods engines on the coal stage shunter, more often than not 50cl, in later years though the use of 30T was common, as well as the 19cl.
I also tend to remember as steam finished in most areas or close to the end, many of the bins were closed for economic reasons also many had rotting timbers and the amount of coal needed was diminishing almost daily.
The one at Parkes had what look more like check rails than guard rails - quite close to the rails.John, IIRC, they all were similar and when on the trestles there was a strict speed limit on the loco's, at Enfield there was a 5mph approach speed from the bank but on the trestles it was slowed down, supposedly. As Enfield had two tracks over the bins, there was a set of ball points at the top and the fuelman was sit on them to hold them down, it was quite precarious as if the speed was too great they could be bounced off.
John
The one at Parkes had what look more like check rails than guard rails - quite close to the rails.John,
John
Hi allMathew, it was usually in Tarped S Wagons, job of the fuelmen to shovel the sand out into the burners that would dry the sand before going down to the storage bins. Hopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
Sorry, I don't understand the significance of the sand bins being on the approach end of the coal bins, with regard to hopper sand wagons? Not disputing the point but just plain curious, as usual.Hi allHopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
Petan, I understand its a weird aspect but if you look at the location of the sand bin, in relation to the servicing of the loco's it comes into play, in certain respects it depends on the depot as well as I am thinking the WCK one may have been different.Sorry, I don't understand the significance of the sand bins being on the approach end of the coal bins, with regard to hopper sand wagons? Not disputing the point but just plain curious, as usual.Hi allHopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
Thanks for all that interesting material. I have a follow up question; Why does the fact sand is in a hopper wagon or not in a hopper wagon, make a difference to its delivery to the coal stage area?Petan, I understand its a weird aspect but if you look at the location of the sand bin, in relation to the servicing of the loco's it comes into play, in certain respects it depends on the depot as well as I am thinking the WCK one may have been different.Sorry, I don't understand the significance of the sand bins being on the approach end of the coal bins, with regard to hopper sand wagons? Not disputing the point but just plain curious, as usual.Hi allHopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
(lots of lovely material snipped)
Petan, the only reason really is that a hopper wagon can discharge from the bottom, now something has come to me that gives the primary reason why sand for steam and the separate bins for sand than with coal, is that there is what's called a burner in the top of the sand bin, the concept is and I think I mentioned before was that sand had to be very dry, and the heating of the sand as it flowed down was at high temp to ensure no moisture was in the sand, sand pipes on loco's could readily block if moisture got in and made the sand thick.Thanks for all that interesting material. I have a follow up question; Why does the fact sand is in a hopper wagon or not in a hopper wagon, make a difference to its delivery to the coal stage area?Petan, I understand its a weird aspect but if you look at the location of the sand bin, in relation to the servicing of the loco's it comes into play, in certain respects it depends on the depot as well as I am thinking the WCK one may have been different.Sorry, I don't understand the significance of the sand bins being on the approach end of the coal bins, with regard to hopper sand wagons? Not disputing the point but just plain curious, as usual.Hi allHopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
(lots of lovely material snipped)
I just realised your description suggests sand out the side of the wagon into the receiver burner on the side of a coal stage, not dumped into a receiver under the wagon so a bottom discharge hopper wagon would not work. By the way, I never knew how sand burners worked, although I had heard of them, so thanks for that as well. Cheers PeterPetan, the only reason really is that a hopper wagon can discharge from the bottom, now something has come to me that gives the primary reason why sand for steam and the separate bins for sand than with coal, is that there is what's called a (more good material snipped to save space)Thanks for all that interesting material. I have a follow up question; Why does the fact sand is in a hopper wagon or not in a hopper wagon, make a difference to its delivery to the coal stage area?Petan, I understand its a weird aspect but if you look at the location of the sand bin, in relation to the servicing of the loco's it comes into play, in certain respects it depends on the depot as well as I am thinking the WCK one may have been different.Sorry, I don't understand the significance of the sand bins being on the approach end of the coal bins, with regard to hopper sand wagons? Not disputing the point but just plain curious, as usual.Hi allHopper wagons were generally not used owing to the sand bins being on the approach end of the bins, both for the coal bins and for loco's going through to get sand boxes filled, then coaled then up onto the de-ash pits before heading to the shed. and next job.
Does anyone know what sort of wagons were used to take the
sand up the top of the sand towers that are attached to some of
the coal stages?
Regards Mathew Hughes
(lots of lovely material snipped)
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