The 'renewable' energy thread -

 
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line

I watched part two of the Saint Greta Thurnsberg documentary last night and it was just another regurgitation of baseless allegations of 'climate change' being responsible for melting glaciers
don_dunstan

The condescending and belittling references to describe young people as described above by the representative from SA, wholly describes the bitter and twisted nature of that contributor who, just a few months ago whipped itself into a state of deliousness over transgender 'boys' utilising girls change rooms etc.

Instead of embracing and supporting the comments and thoughts of a teenager who cares about the future of the planet SHE will be inheriting and overseeing, long after that contributor and myself are long dead.

This is but one example of this contributor flapping in the breeze of whichever prevailing winds takes him.

Need we comment any further about this contributor Question

Mike.

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  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Why is China allowed to enjoy the benefits of 8 cents an hour electricity, building more coal fired power plants than the whole of Germany - and yet we're not allowed to have a single new one in this country?

Economic suicide.
Because morons like *** (Preemptive censorship, breach of forum rules) believe all the self serving BS published in The Australia.

We are now in the ridiculous position of seeing taxpayer funded pollution "invested" to protect what is inappropriately described as a "business model".  Depending on your ideology and whether or not you agree with me, you can decide for yourself if I'm talking about SH2 or peaking gas at Liddell.

The fact is we f***d up our privatisations, and effectively sold the right to levy taxation to fund our (increasingly obsolete) utilities.  The people who own those rights clearly aren't going to just hand them back.

The inconvenient truth - and it is still true despite my deliberately using that phrase - is modern RE is now vastly cheaper than traditional fuel fired power.  The only reason wind is not supplanting coal en-mass through pricing power alone, is it's undermined economically by the fact (sorry, inconvenient truth) PV solar is 3 times cheaper during the day.

The biggest "problem" with RE is not just that costing 2c/h to produce rather undermines the justification for charging 30c/hr for it, it's that it's highly scalable and can be distributed/embedded bypassing the primary need for the grid, and centralised "management".  RE potentially undermines not just the justification, but the ability, to clips everyone's tickets.

The fact is, we don't have an electricity market in Australia, despite the pretence.  We have a regulatory system based on ensuring everyone pays an ever increasing privatised tax, not because of, but despite, the underlying economics.  And it's continuing because, well ...  TLDR.

@don, if you want to know why your are not paying (way) less than 8c/hr, look in the mirror.
djf01
Not scale-able at all.

100 X 0 is STILL ZERO. When the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining we have no electricity being generated - and it's likely that we will never, ever have the capacity to store enough to prevent blackouts.

"Scaling up" this technology is just throwing good money after bad.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud

I watched part two of the Saint Greta Thurnsberg documentary last night and it was just another regurgitation of baseless allegations of 'climate change' being responsible for melting glaciers
The condescending and belittling references to describe young people as described above by the representative from SA, wholly describes the bitter and twisted nature of that contributor who, just a few months ago whipped itself into a state of deliousness over transgender 'boys' utilising girls change rooms etc.

Instead of embracing and supporting the comments and thoughts of a teenager who cares about the future of the planet SHE will be inheriting and overseeing, long after that contributor and myself are long dead.

This is but one example of this contributor flapping in the breeze of whichever prevailing winds takes him.

Need we comment any further about this contributor Question

Mike.
The Vinelander
I was a hundred percent on the money when I said "see you in ten minutes", wasn't I. You just can't stay away from me despite the fact that you whine about how much you dislike me.

And nobody else has talked about transgender boys in girls' change-rooms for months but for some reason it has parked itself in your head and you can't remove it.

Obsessed much, Mike?
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Barrack Obama's former Energy Department Chief Scientist - Steven Koonin - has released a book about the fake climate change crisis having had a change of mind since leaving office - TodayVille;

Steven Koonin’s research into the world’s energy system led him to become convinced that the only “real climate crisis was a crisis of political and scientific candor,” and that the world “isn’t going to be able to reduce [greenhouse gas] emissions enough to make much difference.”

Koonin argues that while he supports responsible climate science, his issue is that what media and activist say about climate science has drifted so far out of touch with the actual science as to be absurdly, demonstrably false.

Koonin emphasizes the absurdity of basing climate change alarm on century-long forecasts claiming to know how 1% shifts in poorly understood variables will affect a future global climate that we don’t understand with anything even resembling that precision.

Nevertheless, the IPCC will issue a report next year that will purport to determine how much warming to expect by the end of this century based upon 40-plus computer model simulations which have been diverging in projections — not converging — coming together — as one would hope to enable determination of which one should be trusted.

Without tweaking, the modelers can’t even agree on a current simulated global average surface temperature — varying by 3 degrees Celsius – three times the observed change over the past century.

Koonin, both an experienced computer practitioner and modeling enthusiast, recognizes that they are wonderful where the simulation variables and their interactions being projected are well known and results can be empirically tested.

“But these are more controlled, engineered situations,” he adds, “whereas the climate is a natural phenomenon. It’s going to do whatever it’s going to do. And it’s hard to observe. You need long, precise observations to understand its natural variability and how it responds to external influences.” Koonin, who has been building models and watching others do so over 45 years, cautions that climate models “are not to the standard you would trust your life or even trillions of dollars to.”

Yet that's exactly what we're doing - we're spending billions upon billions to solve a problem that doesn't exist and can't be proven. Climate change is just 'junk science' - that's the long and the short of it.
  DirtyBallast Chief Commissioner

Location: Standing at the limit of an endless ocean

I watched part two of the Saint Greta Thurnsberg documentary last night and it was just another regurgitation of baseless allegations of 'climate change' being responsible for melting glaciers
The condescending and belittling references to describe young people as described above by the representative from SA, wholly describes the bitter and twisted nature of that contributor who, just a few months ago whipped itself into a state of deliousness over transgender 'boys' utilising girls change rooms etc.

Instead of embracing and supporting the comments and thoughts of a teenager who cares about the future of the planet SHE will be inheriting and overseeing, long after that contributor and myself are long dead.

This is but one example of this contributor flapping in the breeze of whichever prevailing winds takes him.

Need we comment any further about this contributor Question

Mike.I was a hundred percent on the money when I said "see you in ten minutes", wasn't I. You just can't stay away from me despite the fact that you whine about how much you dislike me.

And nobody else has talked about transgender boys in girls' change-rooms for months but for some reason it has parked itself in your head and you can't remove it.

Obsessed much, Mike?
don_dunstan
Unfair.

You can't walk back from what you have previously said. It is there in perpetuity. Just like I occasionally remind you of your grass yurts statement, you claiming that 'that ship has sailed' is no defense.

Own your statements or face constant accusations of hypocrisy. The choice is yours.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud

I watched part two of the Saint Greta Thurnsberg documentary last night and it was just another regurgitation of baseless allegations of 'climate change' being responsible for melting glaciers
The condescending and belittling references to describe young people as described above by the representative from SA, wholly describes the bitter and twisted nature of that contributor who, just a few months ago whipped itself into a state of deliousness over transgender 'boys' utilising girls change rooms etc.

Instead of embracing and supporting the comments and thoughts of a teenager who cares about the future of the planet SHE will be inheriting and overseeing, long after that contributor and myself are long dead.

This is but one example of this contributor flapping in the breeze of whichever prevailing winds takes him.

Need we comment any further about this contributor Question

Mike.I was a hundred percent on the money when I said "see you in ten minutes", wasn't I. You just can't stay away from me despite the fact that you whine about how much you dislike me.

And nobody else has talked about transgender boys in girls' change-rooms for months but for some reason it has parked itself in your head and you can't remove it.

Obsessed much, Mike?Unfair.

You can't walk back from what you have previously said. It is there in perpetuity. Just like I occasionally remind you of your grass yurts statement, you claiming that 'that ship has sailed' is no defense.

Own your statements or face constant accusations of hypocrisy. The choice is yours.
DirtyBallast
When was the last time that was discussed - February?

We're yet to see how Joe Biden's policy will pan out as he just dumped it into the collective laps of the states and told them to enforce it. We would have been able to monitor it more closely if we were allowed to have an open thread on the Biden government on Railpage but there's been a concerted effort to stop that from happening, so discussion of that tapered off on this board.

And for your information we ARE going to end up in grass yurts crapping into holes in the ground - spearheaded by the usual suspects like Yarra Council;

New gas connections could be banned in Victoria to help the state meet its emission reduction goals.

Almost half of the nation’s total residential gas consumption is used solely to heat Victorian homes.

The City of Yarra is the first council to introduce a moratorium, as part of its “climate emergency” plan.

City of Yarra mayor Gabrielle de Vietri told Neil Mitchell it would only apply to new developments.

“We’re not asking people to go out there tomorrow and rip out their gas stove,” she said.

“This is about a transition towards a really important change that we have to make to mitigate the catastrophic effects of climate change.”

That means in a blackout you won't be able to cook or heat yourself either. And I for one will not be giving up gas cooking until I'm forced to by these green idiots.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
That means in a blackout you won't be able to cook or heat yourself either.
"don_dunstan"
Solar power, Don; no such thing as a blackout.
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
Rip out your gas heater and replace it with a wood heater.  That will fire up a Greenie
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
It's like trying to argue with a drunk. Logic goes out the window and the goal posts are constantly getting shifted.

I'm with Shane.

M.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Scomo was on 3AW this morning and was asked about Nuclear Energy,  his response being it could be considered but would need the support of the ALP so how about it.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
That means in a blackout you won't be able to cook or heat yourself either.
Solar power, Don; no such thing as a blackout.
Valvegear
Yet again it's "I'm alright Jack" from Valvegear because he's invested in the middle class welfare of a stand-alone. Except on a cloudy day when he'll be forced to use the gas BBQ - oops! Not allowed in City of Yarra!
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
It's like trying to argue with a drunk. Logic goes out the window and the goal posts are constantly getting shifted.

I'm with Shane.

M.
The Vinelander
Except you're not arguing, you're just trolling about something from months ago that for some reason you've become obsessed by as if its my fault somehow.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Yet again it's "I'm alright Jack" from Valvegear because he's invested in the middle class welfare of a stand-alone. Except on a cloudy day when he'll be forced to use the gas BBQ - oops! Not allowed in City of Yarra!
don_dunstan
Ladies and gentlemen, our Special on today's menu is fresh Flathead. It was hooked in Adelaide less than two hours ago.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Yet again it's "I'm alright Jack" from Valvegear because he's invested in the middle class welfare of a stand-alone. Except on a cloudy day when he'll be forced to use the gas BBQ - oops! Not allowed in City of Yarra!
Ladies and gentlemen, our Special on today's menu is fresh Flathead. It was hooked in Adelaide less than two hours ago.
Valvegear
I think you'll find that any and all fume-spewing devices are going to end up banned in City of Yarra. Have they banned two stroke lawn mowers and whipper snippers yet? Next on the list after gas or (heaven forbid) charcoal BBQ's (swoon!) cooking great big filthy chops and sausages that might make a vegan neighbor vomit and faint.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Scomo was on 3AW this morning and was asked about Nuclear Energy,  his response being it could be considered but would need the support of the ALP so how about it.
bevans
Port Pirie, why not; make it the center of Aussie nuclear reprocessing/storage too. Maybe Portland VIC too seeing as there's already HV infrastructure for transmission to Melbourne.

And here's the railways angle; make nuclear material compulsory by rail all over the nation in special containers so there's reduced risk to the public. Ta da!
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Don; you just got sucked in perfectly. I with a group of people who watched me post the comment about solar power, and we had a sweep about how long it would take for you to snap up the bait. ( my next door neighbour has won it incidentally.)

I only made one typing error - I wrote that the special was fresh flathead; I should have written stale old fathead.

But thanks anyway; we enjoyed your bite. . . hook, line and sinker.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Don; you just got sucked in perfectly. I with a group of people who watched me post the comment about solar power, and we had a sweep about how long it would take for you to snap up the bait. ( my next door neighbour has won it incidentally.)

I only made one typing error - I wrote that the special was fresh flathead; I should have written stale old fathead.

But thanks anyway; we enjoyed your bite. . . hook, line and sinker.
Valvegear
What a sad little world you live in. No wonder you need me to shine a little light in -
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
What a sad little world you live in. No wonder you need me to shine a little light in -
"don_dunstan"
You take it whichever way your little heart desires if it makes you feel better.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
What a sad little world you live in. No wonder you need me to shine a little light in -
You take it whichever way your little heart desires if it makes you feel better.
Valvegear
Oh well let's just say that we're the sunshine in each other's lives then and call it even Wink
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
Yet again it's "I'm alright Jack" from Valvegear because he's invested in the middle class welfare of a stand-alone. Except on a cloudy day when he'll be forced to use the gas BBQ - oops! Not allowed in City of Yarra!
Ladies and gentlemen, our Special on today's menu is fresh Flathead. It was hooked in Adelaide less than two hours ago.
I think you'll find that any and all fume-spewing devices are going to end up banned in City of Yarra. Have they banned two stroke lawn mowers and whipper snippers yet? Next on the list after gas or (heaven forbid) charcoal BBQ's (swoon!) cooking great big filthy chops and sausages that might make a vegan neighbor vomit and faint.
don_dunstan
Bought a new lawn mower the other day, no more 2 strokes, 4 strokes only. Good mower still
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Hydrogen can never be scaled up enough and/or made safe enough to be a meaningful source of energy - according to (none other) than The Guardian:

Damian Carrington
Environment editor
@dpcarrington
Fri 7 May 2021 01.14 AEST

Using hydrogen-based fuels for cars and home heating risks locking in a dependency on fossil fuels and failing to tackle the climate crisis, according to a new analysis.

Fuels produced from hydrogen can be used as straight replacements for oil and gas and can be low-carbon, if renewable electricity is used to produce these “e-fuels”. However, the research found that using the electricity directly to power cars and warm houses was far more efficient.

Renewable electricity production is increasing rapidly as costs tumble. But it still makes up a small proportion of all energy used, which is mostly provided by coal, oil and gas. Using the electricity directly is efficient, but requires investment in new types of car and heating systems.

Using the electricity to create hydrogen from water and then using carbon dioxide to manufacture other fuels can produce “drop-in” replacements for fossil fuels. But the new study concludes this cannot work on a large enough scale to tackle the climate emergency in time.

“Hydrogen-based fuels can be a great clean energy carrier, yet their costs and associated risks are also great,” said Falko Ueckerdt, at the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (PIK) in Germany, who led the research.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Yet again it's "I'm alright Jack" from Valvegear because he's invested in the middle class welfare of a stand-alone. Except on a cloudy day when he'll be forced to use the gas BBQ - oops! Not allowed in City of Yarra!
Ladies and gentlemen, our Special on today's menu is fresh Flathead. It was hooked in Adelaide less than two hours ago.
I think you'll find that any and all fume-spewing devices are going to end up banned in City of Yarra. Have they banned two stroke lawn mowers and whipper snippers yet? Next on the list after gas or (heaven forbid) charcoal BBQ's (swoon!) cooking great big filthy chops and sausages that might make a vegan neighbor vomit and faint.
Bought a new lawn mower the other day, no more 2 strokes, 4 strokes only. Good mower still
wobert
Two stroke is less complicated and you can fix it yourself if there's anything wrong - that's the main advantage.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
South Australia struggling this morning with a good chunk of our power consumption (436 MW) being imported from Victoria's dirty brown coal plants all the way over in the Latrobe Valley. Wind and solar yet again failing us - both providing less than 80 MW each while gas is generating 614 MW. No wind, no sun.

Without imported brown coal electrons we'd be in blackout. That's despite the tens of billions spent trying to harvest sunshine and breezes.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Things actually got worse during the day and now at peak time we have: 92% (1,305 MW) gas generation, 8% wind (117 MW) and the remaining 172 MW used imported from Victoria. So really wind and sun have called in sick today while fossil fuels as usual have carried around 90-95% of the load all day here in South Australia.

What will happen when the brown electrons that we're dipping into from VIC and (soon) NSW are all gone and there's not much wind all over the continent AND it's overcast all day? We'll all be in the same boat, pointless having an extensive, diffuse grid when the weather won't let us have electricity.
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

Mr John Clarke penning script from beyond the grave?

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