Mildura passenger service

 
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Loco hauled via Geelong, meet with V/locity at Ballarat 6 x week return would seem the most logicial and kills a few birds at the same time as it returns service between Geelong and Ballarat as pushed by others and allows a 2nd set to be conveyed in one movement for a service on the interstate and/or Portland.
RTT_Rules

Geelong to Maryborough via Ballarat is broad gauge right now. Murray Basin Project originally had scope to convert it to SG or DG but with that whole program being a complete basket case, right now it is unclear if and when this will be completed.

Broad Gauge trains currently run direct to Maryborough via Bacchus Marsh & Creswick, connecting at Maryborough to a SG train to and from Mildura is achievable now.

If the SG train from Maryborough to Mildura proves successful, that may provide more of a mandate for the government to convert the line from Maryborough to Geelong to SG or DG to give Mildura - Melbourne pass a single train run.

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While I believe it is achievable, I don't believe the political interest exists in either of the major parties. If either party provided this, all it would likely do is shore up the seat for the incumbent independent.

From a political point of view there is little to gain here.

For this reason, I believe the only option that could have a chance of success is one that requires the least possible outlay to implement.

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  Tii Junior Train Controller

Loco hauled via Geelong, meet with V/locity at Ballarat 6 x week return would seem the most logicial and kills a few birds at the same time as it returns service between Geelong and Ballarat as pushed by others and allows a 2nd set to be conveyed in one movement for a service on the interstate and/or Portland.

Geelong to Maryborough via Ballarat is broad gauge right now. Murray Basin Project originally had scope to convert it to SG or DG but with that whole program being a complete basket case, right now it is unclear if and when this will be completed.

Broad Gauge trains currently run direct to Maryborough via Bacchus Marsh & Creswick, connecting at Maryborough to a SG train to and from Mildura is achievable now.

If the SG train from Maryborough to Mildura proves successful, that may provide more of a mandate for the government to convert the line from Maryborough to Geelong to SG or DG to give Mildura - Melbourne pass a single train run.

----

While I believe it is achievable, I don't believe the political interest exists in either of the major parties. If either party provided this, all it would likely do is shore up the seat for the incumbent independent.

From a political point of view there is little to gain here.
Gman_86
here's the latest update on the MBP lol.
https://www.murraybasinrailproject.com.au
  Galron Chief Commissioner

Location: Werribee, Vic
i'll just throw this on the table as a not to silly idea that was on one of the facebook groups today thats worth talking about here, is that was rather than take N Class and N sets from the albury route, you take retired XTP sets (which are in the process of being replaced) and do an overnight service with them. Idea being they are probably a more comfortable train over the long distance, and are likely better for sleeping service. Running overnight you could potentially go the distance into Melbourne as well.

They are about as old as the N class and N sets are. possibly better depending who you talk to.

Someone from the same thread reminded me of some documents/expressions of interests that went around a year or 2 ago about the disposal schedule of the vline loco hauled fleet, with the process to start in 2022 with at least 5 N class locos to be retired out of the fleet. Somehow i don't think they are likely to move from that unless.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
i'll just throw this on the table as a not to silly idea that was on one of the facebook groups today thats worth talking about here, is that was rather than take N Class and N sets from the albury route, you take retired XTP sets (which are in the process of being replaced) and do an overnight service with them. Idea being they are probably a more comfortable train over the long distance, and are likely better for sleeping service. Running overnight you could potentially go the distance into Melbourne as well.
Galron

That is an interesting scenario but where could the set or sets be serviced?  Could you build a workshop at Ararat for this purpose?
  Djebel Junior Train Controller

Do XTPs count as loco hauled or DMU?  Because if could take all night to get to/from Melbourne at the restricted DMU speeds beyond Maryborough.
  Galron Chief Commissioner

Location: Werribee, Vic
Do XTPs count as loco hauled or DMU?  Because if could take all night to get to/from Melbourne at the restricted DMU speeds beyond Maryborough.
Djebel
very much loco hauled. power units are independent and are not currently restricted in the same way sprinters and vlocities are in vic.

i'll just throw this on the table as a not to silly idea that was on one of the facebook groups today thats worth talking about here, is that was rather than take N Class and N sets from the albury route, you take retired XTP sets (which are in the process of being replaced) and do an overnight service with them. Idea being they are probably a more comfortable train over the long distance, and are likely better for sleeping service. Running overnight you could potentially go the distance into Melbourne as well.

That is an interesting scenario but where could the set or sets be serviced?  Could you build a workshop at Ararat for this purpose?
bevans

I think the option would be for them to go the distance to Melbourne, so would be serviced in Melbourne. Not sure of the range of the XPT, but may able to go up and back on a tank. I'm sure servicing at Mildura for fuel and basic maintenance could be setup relatively simply.
  route14 Chief Commissioner

It will be politically difficult to cascade them to the Victorian SG network, though.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
I believe XPTs run Sydney - Melbourne - Sydney on one tank, so Melbourne - Mildura - Melbourne would be fine.

It comes back to political will. There is already very little political will to re-introduce trains to Mildura. Purchasing life-expired rollingstock from NSW is not going to improve this situation, especially when we have our own life-expired rollingstock that is soon to become available.

Come up with a proposal that requires the Andrews Government (or the opposition if you want to get a headline but no actual train) to provide the service with as little outlay as possible and you may get them interested. Give them a proposal that requires a massive investment into track work and/or new rollingstock and you can rest assured that they will ignore it and continue with the status quo.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
Move along folks...nothing to see here.Smile

No word on Ali Cuppers website which is up-to-date.

https://www.alicupper.com.au/category/press/

My best guess will be a trial introduction of an SG N Set or two from Maryborough later in 2022 AFTER an announcement is made regards DDA compliance and general station upgrades to the former main stops north of St Arnaud, which coincidentally is also an election year.

A lot of investment in station works and staff recruitment at around NINE stations needs to be completed before any pax trains are re-instated.

Mike.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
I believe XPTs run Sydney - Melbourne - Sydney on one tank, so Melbourne - Mildura - Melbourne would be fine.
Gman_86

I believe there is still a fuel point at Maryborough?
  justarider Chief Commissioner

Location: Released again, maybe for the last time??
Move along folks...nothing to see here.Smile

No word on Ali Cuppers website which is up-to-date.

https://www.alicupper.com.au/category/press/

My best guess will be a trial introduction of an SG N Set or two from Maryborough later in 2022 AFTER an announcement is made regards DDA compliance and general station upgrades to the former main stops north of St Arnaud, which coincidentally is also an election year.

A lot of investment in station works and staff recruitment at around NINE stations needs to be completed before any pax trains are re-instated.

Mike.
The Vinelander
Agreed Mike, that N sets , which become available 2022, is the time to do it.  

Change trains at Maryborough for the quicker Vlo would give a repectable end/end run time.
Certainly better than an XPT (at restricted speed  courtesy the many LX) taking the full scenic journey.

We've had this discussion before about how much effort/money you put into the stations.
A lick of paint would be nice. DDA for the low platforms is problematic - raising for one door entrace might be enough.

I think it will be interesting whether the guards can be persuaded to be of more assistance with ticketing and infirm pax, instead of station staff with  almost always nothing to do.

cheers
John
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
Move along folks...nothing to see here.Smile

No word on Ali Cuppers website which is up-to-date.

https://www.alicupper.com.au/category/press/

My best guess will be a trial introduction of an SG N Set or two from Maryborough later in 2022 AFTER an announcement is made regards DDA compliance and general station upgrades to the former main stops north of St Arnaud, which coincidentally is also an election year.

A lot of investment in station works and staff recruitment at around NINE stations needs to be completed before any pax trains are re-instated.

Mike.
Agreed Mike, that N sets , which become available 2022, is the time to do it.  

Change trains at Maryborough for the quicker Vlo would give a repectable end/end run time.
Certainly better than an XPT (at restricted speed  courtesy the many LX) taking the full scenic journey.

We've had this discussion before about how much effort/money you put into the stations.
A lick of paint would be nice. DDA for the low platforms is problematic - raising for one door entrace might be enough.

I think it will be interesting whether the guards can be persuaded to be of more assistance with ticketing and infirm pax, instead of station staff with  almost always nothing to do.

cheers
John
justarider


Agreed regards provision of station staff. On reflection Creswick, Talbot and Beaufort are unstaffed.

Mike.
  Lachlan's Train Channel Junior Train Controller

Location: probably taking a photo of 7901V
I believe XPTs run Sydney - Melbourne - Sydney on one tank, so Melbourne - Mildura - Melbourne would be fine.

I believe there is still a fuel point at Maryborough?
bevans
Yes, but it has been booked out for a few years. (Since MBRP?)
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
Some of the stations have had an upgrade for community use.   Would only require a room to be open as a waiting room (plus toilets I guess) for a bit before the train is due.   But then, not all metro stations  have waiting rooms, so is one required?
Tickets would be on-line so station staff not required.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
I believe XPTs run Sydney - Melbourne - Sydney on one tank, so Melbourne - Mildura - Melbourne would be fine.

It comes back to political will. There is already very little political will to re-introduce trains to Mildura. Purchasing life-expired rollingstock from NSW is not going to improve this situation, especially when we have our own life-expired rollingstock that is soon to become available.

Come up with a proposal that requires the Andrews Government (or the opposition if you want to get a headline but no actual train) to provide the service with as little outlay as possible and you may get them interested. Give them a proposal that requires a massive investment into track work and/or new rollingstock and you can rest assured that they will ignore it and continue with the status quo.
Gman_86
I believe going to Brisbane one loco is refuelled at Grafton headed nth and the other on return. So they must be good for abotu 1200 km and the Mildura line won't have the fuel demand the NSW NCL does. So they could most likely run Mel- Geelong - Mildura and return on one tank.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Would be fantastic to see a service from Ballarat to Maryborough and then to Castlemaine with changes for Mildura at Maryborough.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
Would be fantastic to see a service from Ballarat to Maryborough and then to Castlemaine with changes for Mildura at Maryborough.
freightgate
Castlemaine - Maryborough is in the early throes of a transition to becoming a rail trail.

Mike.
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

Location: Banned
I believe XPTs run Sydney - Melbourne - Sydney on one tank, so Melbourne - Mildura - Melbourne would be fine.

It comes back to political will. There is already very little political will to re-introduce trains to Mildura. Purchasing life-expired rollingstock from NSW is not going to improve this situation, especially when we have our own life-expired rollingstock that is soon to become available.

Come up with a proposal that requires the Andrews Government (or the opposition if you want to get a headline but no actual train) to provide the service with as little outlay as possible and you may get them interested. Give them a proposal that requires a massive investment into track work and/or new rollingstock and you can rest assured that they will ignore it and continue with the status quo.
Gman_86
Yes I do not understand the enthusiasm of purchasing old clapped out trains from NSW. Victoria will have so much old life expired stock when the SG and BG Velocities come on stream. 133 coaches to be exact and numerous N class locos.

I would rather that more velocities be built for Seymour services and use the displaced Sprinters for the Mildura service.


Michael
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

The Xplorer's aren't life expired. They will be retiring earlier then need be. I agree that the XPT's are not something you should be looking in to but it is vline so who knows what sort of stupid decision will be made on this. For a state that boasts (incorrectly) about it's supposedly superior regional service it is laughable that you can't get a train to Mildura while the supposedly inferior NSW service can somehow get a train to Armidale,Broken Hill, Dubbo, Griffith and Moree.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Could an Xplorer do the job and could Victoria get access to several for a good price ?

What would the explorers be doing if they remained in NSW ?
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
Same problem as a Velocity, too many level crossings without lights & bells.  You need loco powered service.
  Djebel Junior Train Controller

Same problem as a Velocity, too many level crossings without lights & bells.  You need loco powered service.
Donald
How do they manage in NSW?  Have they grade separated every level crossing?  Installed bells, lights & gates everywhere?  Or do they just drive around not having a problem?
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

Location: Banned
The Xplorer's aren't life expired. They will be retiring earlier then need be. I agree that the XPT's are not something you should be looking in to but it is vline so who knows what sort of stupid decision will be made on this. For a state that boasts (incorrectly) about it's supposedly superior regional service it is laughable that you can't get a train to Mildura while the supposedly inferior NSW service can somehow get a train to Armidale,Broken Hill, Dubbo, Griffith and Moree.
simstrain
I was just talking about the XPT's of which some posters were saying should be used. And agreed getting XPT's is a stupid idea. Victoria might as well refurbish the old N carriage stock that is available. It is a major embarrassment that we still have old H type carriages in passenger service.

I get that Xplorers are relatively new.


Michael
  Tii Junior Train Controller

Same problem as a Velocity, too many level crossings without lights & bells.  You need loco powered service.
Donald
Is it the speed of the Vlocity that restricts it's use at these crossings? Why is a loco better for those lines? Just asking as it's often mentioned but I never understand why.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

Same problem as a Velocity, too many level crossings without lights & bells.  You need loco powered service.
Donald

I think this is more of a Vline laziness reason then a reason with any factual relevance. It's not like the Mildura line is of high quality and at 80 km/h an Xplorer would be no more dangerous then a loco hauled fleet and in fact it might be safer since it will have better braking capabilities. How hard is it to put up some LED crossing lights with a solar panel and battery for power at some of these crossings anyway.

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