Standard Gauge VLocity

 
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
So, the works at Albury to extend the platforms for this new Velocity. The current space looks to be plenty for a 6 car Vlo.  Does this mean that there are contingencies being made to operate longer VLos?  Or is this capacity an overcook where the cash could be used elsewhere?
james.au

I believe that's the same dock as the Spirit of Progress used to be stabled in before the SG in 1962 so if it can hold about 12 Spirit cars and a loco, it should easily cope with an N Set and three V'Locity cars.

Mike.

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  Carnot Minister for Railways

LX crossing activation is proving to be an issue on the NE line with the Vlos.  Sounds like axle counters might be required...
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

The 1962 Albury signal diagram on Victorian Railways.Net website shows the dock platform loop length as 286 yards (261 metres) plus 74 yards (68 metres) for engine run round, total 360 yards (329 metres). A 3-car VLocity's length is 76 metres.
https://www.victorianrailways.net/signaling/completedia/albury62.html
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
There is no need to extend either of the platforms at Albury.

Anybody who had actually been there would know that.
  Galron Chief Commissioner

Location: Werribee, Vic
LX crossing activation is proving to be an issue on the NE line with the Vlos.  Sounds like axle counters might be required...
Carnot
And this would be a surprise to absolutely no one.

If that's the decision taken, given what happened with the gippsland line a few years ago, it will delay delivery by at least 6 months, probably closer to 12.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
LX crossing activation is proving to be an issue on the NE line with the Vlos.  Sounds like axle counters might be required...
And this would be a surprise to absolutely no one.

If that's the decision taken, given what happened with the gippsland line a few years ago, it will delay delivery by at least 6 months, probably closer to 12.
Galron

The delivery of the train sets will unlikely be delayed by LX activation issues, perhaps you meant to say the implementation of the V'Locity's on the NE may be delayed.

As axle counters are standard across most of the network, I thought it would be a given they were also installed on the NE line. Yet another stuff up and lack of communication by ARTC and V/Line Question

Mike.
  Carnot Minister for Railways
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Puerile spin.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
At the very least, it should make the Vlocity less susceptible to graffiti attacks than if they were left at the platform like the loco hauled sets are.

It would be nice though if these things didn't require a press release with statements from half of the politicians in the southern hemisphere. But then again, what else are they going to do with their time?
  LegendsofSteam Junior Train Controller

The Albury Stabling Yard Works have nothing to do with The Former BG Dock Platform & Loco Release / Run~around Track...

These works are in relation to the present headshunt / overshoot track that runs beside The SG Mainline coming off the dock platform running toward The Bridge St. & Atkins St. Rail~over~Road Bridge...

The Plan is to extend this track right thru; to the abutment of Bridge St. & Atkins St. Rail~over~Road Bridge, with suitable track~mounted buffer safety system installed to stop an overrun ‘over the cliff’ to the road below...

A new retaining wall is also to be installed along  the Atkins St. Boundary, (running parallel to the extended track that will now go all the way to the bridge abutment) This Retaining Wall will be back~filled & compacted to form the base for the new light maintenance / cleaning facilities & access Platform...

(I doubt there would be enough room in this area to install a second track in this area; like was done with the Ararat Stabling Cage...)
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

94 supposed to have come into Dynon last week .

When they have all 6 x 3 car sg Inter city sets this is how they will run it.

3 x 3 car sets overnight at Albury, 3 x 3 car sets overnight Dynon

am Down runs as 3 cars , attaches a 3 car set at Albury form 6 cars as Midday Up.forms PM Down as 6 cars
am Up runs as 6 cars forms , Midday Down as 6 cars on arrival split as single sets 1 set forms 1/2 midday up next day, and other set forms PM Up same day

Always 2 sets available Melb end to rottae PPM/backup

So am in service   3 sets    1 on am Down and 2 on the am Up
Midday in service  2 on the Up and 2 on the Down
PM  2 sets on the Down and 1 on the Up

To run 5 return trips as promised would seem to require an additional 2 x 3 car Inter City sets.
The extra trips being approx 0800 Up and 1530 Down plus mid morning Down and early afternoon Up.
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
VS93 is numbered 1293-1593-1193 now too, so some speculation that they could be extended to 5 car sets.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Or is the different middle car number to distinguish it as a Buffet car?
  speedemon08 Mary

Location: I think by now you should have figured it out
Or is the different middle car number to distinguish it as a Buffet car?
BrentonGolding
Why skip the 14xx series entirely then.
  Tii Junior Train Controller

94 supposed to have come into Dynon last week .

When they have all 6 x 3 car sg Inter city sets this is how they will run it.

3 x 3 car sets overnight at Albury, 3 x 3 car sets overnight Dynon

am Down runs as 3 cars , attaches a 3 car set at Albury form 6 cars as Midday Up.forms PM Down as 6 cars
am Up runs as 6 cars forms , Midday Down as 6 cars on arrival split as single sets 1 set forms 1/2 midday up next day, and other set forms PM Up same day

Always 2 sets available Melb end to rottae PPM/backup

So am in service   3 sets    1 on am Down and 2 on the am Up
Midday in service  2 on the Up and 2 on the Down
PM  2 sets on the Down and 1 on the Up

To run 5 return trips as promised would seem to require an additional 2 x 3 car Inter City sets.
The extra trips being approx 0800 Up and 1530 Down plus mid morning Down and early afternoon Up.
kuldalai
any likely start date ? Might they wait until all sets are ready and passed for service or do a mixture with locos
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

VS93 is numbered 1293-1593-1193 now too, so some speculation that they could be extended to 5 car sets.
speedemon08
The 1500 number series is because that is a new car type with the buffet module.

To increase capacity up from 150 to 240 one just inserts a standard commuter powered centre card as a 4 car set.

When VLP and DOT finally wake up that a mix of 3 and 4 car VL sets is the way to go in gives max flexibility in tailoring train sizes to loadings, lowers opex costs then this is what could be done :

Commuter type VL sets:  Mix of 3 and 4 car sets one can run consists 0f 3, 4, 6, 7, 8 0r 9 cars.
Inter City type VL sets as mix of 3 and 2 car sets one can run 2, 3 or 5 car sets.

Plus for Warrnambool, Swan Hill and Bairnsdale one can run beyond Geelong. Bendigo and Traralgon respectively a 3 or 5 car IC sets, and within the commuter zone attached a 3 or 4 car Commuter set unreseserved.

For years many have been telling VLP and DOT a mix of set sizes is the way to go in future.
Now the brain trsusts tell us all the maintenance facilities are set up for 3 cars  !!!!
Derh  what have we been telling you for years.
Still not too late extend 1 road at CMD for 4 cars, plus at dynon plus at Ballarat East.  PLUS  new DMU maintenance facilities at Waurn Ponds and Ballarat East build all roads for 4 cars .

Not rocket science.  3 car VL Commuter set 222  4 cars  312
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Or is the different middle car number to distinguish it as a Buffet car?
Why skip the 14xx series entirely then.
speedemon08
Sorry, should have deleted that post, started doing it on the phone but it was just way too hard so I gave up and just hit the send button.

So unless the 1400 numbering series has a clash with something else in the V/Line system my guess is that it is indeed reserved for another type of V/Locity car. My guess was originally that it would be an unpowered trailer car.

VicSig says that when we get to VL numbers over 100 they will simply add an extra digit to the carriage numbers so VL106 for instance will be 11106 12106 13106 so for those 3 car types they can basically keep going ad infinitum

My next thought was that if they were to insert another trailer motor into the set these could simply use the same 13 numbering series but then it occurred that this would upset the numbering sequence for a set. For example taking VL50 a 4 car set would become 1150 1360 13107 1250 which might be a bit weird. It would make more sense for it to be 1150 1250 1450 1250 as you say

So a long winded way of saying yes, I suspect that 1400 series may be reserved for either unpowered trailer or an extra powered trailer car

But as has been discussed many times before on RP V/Line don't seem to be of a mind to introduce ANY variations on the 3 car arrangement due to maintenance and stabling issues

Of course the the layman this seems to make no sense but as we know V/Line seems to be a law unto themselves in many ways

Acknowledgement to Kuldalai who I know has already posted in response to you, I have tried to type this as I was going to last eve before I gave up!
  NimbleJack Locomotive Fireman

The only law at issue here is the law of physics: a four-car VLocity set does not fit in a siding designed for three cars. Broad-gauge VLocitys will run in mutiples of three cars and that will never change. Only on standard guage is there the possibility of extending trains to four or five cars.

The first stardard-gauge commercial VLocity run is supposed to happen this week, albeit sans buffet module. I'd be curious to hear passengers' reports.
  Duncs Chief Commissioner

Where necessary a 3 car Vlocity siding can be expanded to take 4 cars. Keep in mind the the original 2 car  Vlocities in the early days were intended to be joined together provide a 4 car set, and to be stabled as such in sidings. As having only 2 cars in a siding was inefficient.
  NimbleJack Locomotive Fireman

Everything looks so easy and obvious when you're sitting behind a keyboard.
  Tii Junior Train Controller


The first stardard-gauge commercial VLocity run is supposed to happen this week, albeit sans buffet module. I'd be curious to hear passengers' reports.
NimbleJack
WHAT!! No chips from the buffet ??? Why is it missing anyway- no providers appointed yet by Z/line ?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Did 'the plan for a plan' all those years ago overlook the inclusion of refreshments?
Not as if SG Vlocitys have arrived with only five minutes notice.
Waiting for someone's wife to submit a tender.....................
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
The only law at issue here is the law of physics: a four-car VLocity set does not fit in a siding designed for three cars. Broad-gauge VLocitys will run in mutiples of three cars and that will never change. Only on standard guage is there the possibility of extending trains to four or five cars.

The first stardard-gauge commercial VLocity run is supposed to happen this week, albeit sans buffet module. I'd be curious to hear passengers' reports.
NimbleJack
The only law? Are common sense and economics laws?

Having to add an extra 3 car set because a service is slightly too popular for a single VL set doesn't seem like a very clever idea to me. Surely the increased op-ex of running extra unnecessary cars would go a long way to extending a few sidings and such

Likewise being able to create 7 or 8 car trains to cater for increased (pre-Covid) pax demand without the need to create new paths or hire more staff seems like a pretty good use of money.

V/Line takes the easy way out every time. Why? Because the government keeps throwing other people's $$$ at it with seemingly no requirement for them to justify how they spend it.

I bet if V/Line had been split into above and below rail entities VLP would be asking at the first opportunity for the "other" lot to build them some extended sidings as they urgently need to run 4 car sets!!! Laughing
  NimbleJack Locomotive Fireman

Do you have any notion of how much it costs to install and certify new points, signals and maintenance equipment?

Are you even remotely familiar with the concept of opportunity cost - the infinite wants of keyboard gunzels versus the finite pockets of taxpayers?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Tail wagging the dog.
It is the job of maintenance to serve operations not dictate them.

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