Massive SSR grain train

 
Topic moved from New South Wales by bevans on 20 Jun 2018 13:10
  Jack Le Lievre Assistant Commissioner

Location: Moolap Station, Vic
One problem with any long train is that nothing is designed to run it. There are no real long crossing loops (New ones 1.8km long to be built between Lithgow and Blayney.
gordon_s1942
Between Crystal Brook and Goobang Jct., just about every second loop is 1800m+

Gladstone (1990m).
Peterborough (2200m).
Hillgrange (1877m).
Yunta (1974m).
Mannahill (2490m).
Mingary (1854m).
Kinalung (1850m).
Kaleentha (1833m).
Ivanhoe (2019m).
Trida (1850m).
Matakana (1850m).
Kiacatoo (1870m).
Yarrabandai (1920m).
Goobang Jct. (1870m).

And then between Goobang Jct. and Cootamundra West most Loops are 1800m+ also.

So, I am not really sure by what is meant that there aren't enough long loops?

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  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Ah, the thriving metropolis of Ivanhoe ........ Rolling Eyes
You can run any length of train anywhere provided that you don't meet another overlength one coming the other way. The North Coast line used to operate this way for donkey's years. For all I know it may still do so but I doubt it.
Regardless of length 8000 tonnes of anything east/north of Parkes would be a problem.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Length is not an issue as the train will split east of Parkes anyway. Half goes to Moree via Narromine- Binnaway and as others have listed plenty of 1800m loops west of Parkes to accommodate train.

Also CRN won’t allow more than 5 Locos powering on their track (Parkes-Bowenfels)


No way Sydney trains would allow such a heavy or long train at nearly 1800m. Any train that long would not many places to go away for a cross east Parkes until Gosford, pathing would be almost impossible plus similar restrictions as CRN with powering locos.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Just imagine trying to move this quantity of grain over this distance by road.
SG wins again.Smile
  mikesyd Chief Commissioner

Location: Lurking
Length is not an issue as the train will split east of Parkes anyway. Half goes to Moree via Narromine- Binnaway and as others have listed plenty of 1800m loops west of Parkes to accommodate train.

Also CRN won’t allow more than 5 Locos powering on their track (Parkes-Bowenfels)


No way Sydney trains would allow such a heavy or long train at nearly 1800m. Any train that long would not many places to go away for a cross east Parkes until Gosford, pathing would be almost impossible plus similar restrictions as CRN with powering locos.
2LaGrange
They allowed a 100 Car SSR Coal train to run between Lithgow and Newcastle about a year back, there was a Bevan Wall video posted here even.
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

Ah, the thriving metropolis of Ivanhoe ........ Rolling Eyes
You can run any length of train anywhere provided that you don't meet another overlength one coming the other way. The North Coast line used to operate this way for donkey's years. For all I know it may still do so but I doubt it.
Regardless of length 8000 tonnes of anything east/north of Parkes would be a problem.
YM-Mundrabilla
Yanks ran over length trains in the past using a saw by to deal with too short passing loops.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Ah, the thriving metropolis of Ivanhoe ........ Rolling Eyes
You can run any length of train anywhere provided that you don't meet another overlength one coming the other way. The North Coast line used to operate this way for donkey's years. For all I know it may still do so but I doubt it.
Regardless of length 8000 tonnes of anything east/north of Parkes would be a problem.
Yanks ran over length trains in the past using a saw by to deal with too short passing loops.
nswtrains
Ye Gods and little fishes! Smile

Meanwhile, 24 hours, six crib breaks, three crew changes, two derailments and a collision later ..................... Rolling Eyes

Explanation here (if you can be bothered following it) :

http://www.sdmrra.org/Odds-n-Ends/saw_bye.htm
  theanimal Chief Commissioner

Ah, the thriving metropolis of Ivanhoe ........ Rolling Eyes
You can run any length of train anywhere provided that you don't meet another overlength one coming the other way. The North Coast line used to operate this way for donkey's years. For all I know it may still do so but I doubt it.
Regardless of length 8000 tonnes of anything east/north of Parkes would be a problem.
Yanks ran over length trains in the past using a saw by to deal with too short passing loops.
Ye Gods and little fishes! Smile

Meanwhile, 24 hours, six crib breaks, three crew changes, two derailments and a collision later ..................... Rolling Eyes

Explanation here (if you can be bothered following it) :

http://www.sdmrra.org/Odds-n-Ends/saw_bye.htm
YM-Mundrabilla
Gee, can you imagine how long that movement would take? Particularly under NSW train orders where there is no provision to occupy a section for a shunting movement?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Ah, the thriving metropolis of Ivanhoe ........ Rolling Eyes
You can run any length of train anywhere provided that you don't meet another overlength one coming the other way. The North Coast line used to operate this way for donkey's years. For all I know it may still do so but I doubt it.
Regardless of length 8000 tonnes of anything east/north of Parkes would be a problem.
Yanks ran over length trains in the past using a saw by to deal with too short passing loops.
Ye Gods and little fishes! Smile

Meanwhile, 24 hours, six crib breaks, three crew changes, two derailments and a collision later ..................... Rolling Eyes

Explanation here (if you can be bothered following it) :

http://www.sdmrra.org/Odds-n-Ends/saw_bye.htm
Gee, can you imagine how long that movement would take? Particularly under NSW train orders where there is no provision to occupy a section for a shunting movement?
theanimal
I have a vague recollection that it has happened on the North Coast years ago but don't know how they got out of it. Needless to say heads rolled as it was probably the old NSWGR then but on the other hand the NSWGR would have had the wherewithal to deal with the problem!

There have also been cases of trains being over length due to wagons being on the train but not on the X2010 (train load sheet).
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Impressive.

Has something like this had to be done on the full scale railway here?  Either by plan or by necessity?

Edit: the above answered my question whilst i typed it.
  2LaGrange Train Controller

Length is not an issue as the train will split east of Parkes anyway. Half goes to Moree via Narromine- Binnaway and as others have listed plenty of 1800m loops west of Parkes to accommodate train.

Also CRN won’t allow more than 5 Locos powering on their track (Parkes-Bowenfels)


No way Sydney trains would allow such a heavy or long train at nearly 1800m. Any train that long would not many places to go away for a cross east Parkes until Gosford, pathing would be almost impossible plus similar restrictions as CRN with powering locos.
They allowed a 100 Car SSR Coal train to run between Lithgow and Newcastle about a year back, there was a Bevan Wall video posted here even.
mikesyd
Yes they did allow 100 car coal train with AC locos in distributed power mode as a trial and has never run since. It also took a lot of work to get approval TOC waivers etc.

PN and SSR regular Coal trains are held at Lithgow in the Bank Road, Katoomba Refuge and also Flemington to allow other trains to overtake them or hold the coal train to wait for a path. None of these locations can hold a 100 wagon train they are way too long.
  greasyrhys Chief Commissioner

Location: MacDonald Park, SA
It was just a pity that besides a very short section on Tuesday morning, that this did not run at all in daylight. Sadly I missed out on any shots due to work, but I’m very confident that this won’t be the last time any of the Mighty Ones (C class) will lead in SA
  allan Chief Commissioner

I guess that that will explain the five C class locos stabled in Broken Hill yard yesterday afternoon...
  trainguy84 Junior Train Controller
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
It is things like this that make me curious as to what might be possible if the whole network was SG.  Im sure Central Queensland has had its share of grain importation after droughts for example.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
HI

Well done SSR, they have booked another one for the 9th of July.

https://www.stockjournal.com.au/story/5483978/record-grain-train-departs-crystal-brook/?cs=4879#slide=2
trainguy84
Congratulations to SSR.
  mikesyd Chief Commissioner

Location: Lurking
So it the date holds, as well as some daylight running, there might be quite a cavalcade escorting the train.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
It is things like this that make me curious as to what might be possible if the whole network was SG.  Im sure Central Queensland has had its share of grain importation after droughts for example.
james.au
Yes, this is a brilliant example of the rolling stock utilization benefits of one uniform gauge.

SSR and others can send their grain hoppers anywhere that has had a good season instead of rakes being parked up on BG tracks in SA / VIC because of a poor season and the same for SG rakes in NSW. Same goes for motive power, container flats and anything else on rails, it can be used where ever the demand exists.

BG
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
It is things like this that make me curious as to what might be possible if the whole network was SG.  Im sure Central Queensland has had its share of grain importation after droughts for example.
Yes, this is a brilliant example of the rolling stock utilization benefits of one uniform gauge.

SSR and others can send their grain hoppers anywhere that has had a good season instead of rakes being parked up on BG tracks in SA / VIC because of a poor season and the same for SG rakes in NSW. Same goes for motive power, container flats and anything else on rails, it can be used where ever the demand exists.

BG
BrentonGolding
Absolutely.

SG has only one major disadvantage here in Wictoria. It originated in NSW.Twisted Evil
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
SG has only one major disadvantage here in Victoria. It originated in NSW
"YM-Mundrabilla"
I blame the Poms.
  nscaler69 Deputy Commissioner

Location: There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
Yes, this is a brilliant example of the rolling stock utilization benefits of one uniform gauge.

SSR and others can send their grain hoppers anywhere that has had a good season instead of rakes being parked up on BG tracks in SA / VIC because of a poor season and the same for SG rakes in NSW. Same goes for motive power, container flats and anything else on rails, it can be used where ever the demand exists.

BG
BrentonGolding
It never would have been a problem either 100 or so years ago if NSW didn't stuff it up for the rest of the states! (meaning if NSW had kept broad gauge instead of going standard, especially when both VIC & SA were too committed to broad gauge to change)
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
It never would have been a problem either 100 or so years ago if NSW didn't stuff it up for the rest of the states! (meaning if NSW had kept broad gauge instead of going standard, especially when both VIC & SA were too committed to broad gauge to change)
nscaler69
Really? We're going to do this? Again?

BG
  allan Chief Commissioner

And again...
  BDA Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney
Reality check , standard gauge or stranded gauge .
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Please don't let this thread get derailed like so many others recently. The gauge debate has been done to death but if you want to keep doing it there are plenty of other threads on RP where you can continue the discussion.

BG

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